Does the wage gap exist?

Opening Argument

blankiblanki 5 Pts
edited June 2017 in Work Place
Feminists try to argue that women make $0.77 for every dollar even when location, choices, work hours etc are taken into consideration. Is this true?

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  • No, as a matter of fact, women and minorities are stepping up in the work place and earring about the same as men.
  • @the_world, the wage gap is subjective..although there are many Lawsuits out there for specific companies that argue there is a gap
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  • I think the wage gap is exaggerated and have not seen sufficient evidence yet of its existence, but there is certainly an earnings gap (that may not have been caused by sexism).
  • The general findings are that the calculated wage gap based on various models is smaller than the raw wage gap, but still exists. See for example which is a meta-analysis of 260+ studies across 63 countries. If you're not familiar with meta-analyses, they're very useful as they help summarise what the scientific consensus is.

    The other possible concern is how much of what is chalked up to a human capital difference between genders is actually effected by sexism, e.g. a random woman chooses to pursue a career as a nurse while a random man chooses to pursue a better paying and more respected career as a doctor. How much of their is their free choice and how much is the stereotypes of society pushing the different genders towards different careers, biasing their choice?
  • @AlwaysCorrect, excellent point about free choice.  I think in general the wage gap should be evaluated strictly as a gap in salary for the same job.  It is true that in many cases the wage gap exists, and there are a number of high profile lawsuits regarding that.  The issue is getting much more publicity and there are trends towards closing the gaps.  
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  • @agsr

    Got to disagree. The core thing we want to measure is gender inequality. If we only look at salaries within the same job then that ignores wide varieties of possible inequality and gives us less useful information. For instance if women are much less likely to get promotions and high-paying jobs and this is down to discrimination rather than any other rationale, that's something we would want to know as it shows that women are in a much worse position.

    Also is the best paper I've found going over the limits of the human capital method and how some of the explanatory variables could themselves be rooted in sexism.
  • There are different fields with lean towards certain genders that could affect salaries and benefits.

    Also, what about women's leave for pregnancy. Men don't get this, and they can also assist with the baby or their child.
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  • There are different fields with lean towards certain genders that could affect salaries and benefits.

    Also, what about women's leave for pregnancy. Men don't get this, and they can also assist with the baby or their child.
    Paternity leave exists in about 50% of countries. Source:

    It tends to not be as long as maternity leave when it is in place so even where it does exist it isn't equal.

    This is however one of those double edged sword scenarios. There is a greater expectation to be the breadwinner on men, which sucks for them if they want to look after the child. However the flip side to that is that there is a greater expectation on women to be the caregiver, which sucks if they want to focus on their career
  • @AlwaysCorrect, agree on double edge sword, but in most cases it is still women who prefer to take care of the child
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  • @agsr I agree and likewise I think most men prefer to be the breadwinners, but with that you have to keep in mind two things.

    1) How much of that is because people are brought up in a world of gender stereotypes where women are expected to be the caretakers for the child and men the breadwinners?

    2) There is a scientific basis for wanting the woman to be the primary caregiver. Although in most scenarios the sexes are equal, there are certain biological differences; one of which is that women's breasts produce milk after pregnancy. Although we have formula milk exists, to quote the NHS's guide to breastfeeding: "Formula milk doesn't provide the same protection from illness and doesn't give you any health benefits." This is backed up by peer reviewed scientific research; breast feeding is good for the baby.

    Therefore to benefit the child, governments would want to encourage the mother to be the one to stay home.

    This is changing somewhat due to breast pumps, which I believe are growing in popularity a little, but I'm not aware of if there's been research on how storing breast milk before feeding effects the health benefits to the child and some mothers who've tried it report it's a bit of a hassle in terms of the time involved pumping, the painful pinching and pulling on the nipple, extra work cleaning up the equipment afterwards, etc.
  • melefmelef 53 Pts
    You need to include befits when it comes to this. 

    Men don't get pregnancy leave while women do. Men could also help out with the child or baby.
  • We literally were just discussing that. For instance I've already noted men do get paternity leave in about 50% of countries, though not as much leave as.women typically get.
  • @blanki  The wage gap doesn't really exist in the small jobs like fast food and retail.  It's when you get up to management levels.  My mom had this supervisor that just came in, checked on everyone, and left.  Paid 12 an hour.  She got offered it and learned it was the most stressful job in the world.  She had to take care of everything and everyone, but was offered 10.25 an hour.  It's why jobs stress not sharing your pay with coworkers.  Stuff like cashiers though, nah it's not there.  
  • @AlwaysCorrect, your points are legit. Regardless of the reasons though I doubt that we will see a dramatic change in this area.
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  • When you control for all other factors women are still compensated 10% less the men. This means that the only difference between the women and male is their sex and compensation[1]. The gap is even larger with blacks, going up to 18%[2].


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