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Are there contradictions in the bible?
in Religion

I believe that there are many contradictions in the bible. Here are just a few examples

800,000 men were fighting in Israel: 2 Samuel 24:9
1,100,000 men were fighting in Israel: 1 Chronicles 21:5

454 Children of Adin: Ezra 2:15
655 Children of Adin: Nehemiah 7:20

Ahaziah was 22: 2 Kings 8:26
Ahaziah was 42: 2 Chronicles 22:2

Jacob was Joseph's Father: Matthew 1:16
Heli was Joseph's Father: Luke 3:23

David Captured 700 Horsemen: 2 Samuel 8:4
David Captured 7,000 Horsemen: 1 Chronicles 18:4

anonymousdebaternamemcnameZombieguy1987ZeusAres42
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Retired DebateIslander. I no longer come here actively, and many of the things that I may have posted in the past (Such as belief in the flat Earth theory) do not reflect on my current views. 

https://docs.google.com/document/d/1p6M-VgXHwwdpJarhyQYapBz-kRc6FrgdOLFAd3IfYz8/edit

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Arguments

  • All of these are small contradictions, not affecting the main message.
    SilverishGoldNovaZombieguy1987ZeusAres42
  • All of these are small contradictions, not affecting the main message.
    Whether they are small or not, they're still contradictions.
    Zombieguy1987PlaffelvohfenZeusAres42
    Retired DebateIslander. I no longer come here actively, and many of the things that I may have posted in the past (Such as belief in the flat Earth theory) do not reflect on my current views. 

    https://docs.google.com/document/d/1p6M-VgXHwwdpJarhyQYapBz-kRc6FrgdOLFAd3IfYz8/edit

  • SilverishGoldNova, can we debate the matter one-on-one? I can answer these wild claims. Let me know what you think. Shalom.
  • All of these are small contradictions, not affecting the main message.

    So what.

    If there a contradictions, no matter how small or big, they're still contradictions, and when Christians claim the bible is god word and has no contradictions , but when stuff like this:
    Image result for bible contradictions

    Then that means the Bible is
    A. Not prefect
    B. Unlikely to be God's word, because who makes so many contradictions without proofreading to fix it?


    https://www.google.com/search?q=victims+of+religion&safe=active&source=lnms&tbm=isch&sa=x&ved=0ahukewihu9jugorfahwkmeakhbtib00q_auidigb&biw=1920&bih=963&safe=active

    Blues and Raptors handed two very toxic teams embarrassing losses, 95% of the sports world is rejoicing in the news

    Repealing the Second Amendment is the first step to Totalitarianism, and it needs to be prevented to protect our freedom 

    http://www.atheistrepublic.com/
  • Zombieguy1987ZeusAres42
  • edited January 6
    Well this got necro'd so might as well just post some more that were sitting in one of my drafts.

    How many men of the chief did David's captains kill?

    2 Samuel 23:8: They killed 800.
    1 Chronicles 11:11: They killed 300.

    Has anyone ever seen God face to face?

    John 1:18: No
    Exodus 33:11: Yes

    What should we do to homosexuals?

    Leviticus 20:13, Leviticus 18:22: They should be killed.
    1 Kings 15:11-12: They should be exiled.

    Who was Salah's father?

    Genesis 10:24, Genesis 11:12: Arphaxad
    Luke 3:35-36: Cainan

    Was Keturah Abraham's wife or concubine?

    Genesis 25:1: Wife
    1 Chronicles 1:32: Concubine

    Who was Joseph's father?

    Matthew 1:16: Jacob
    Luke 3:23: Heli

    How should the Edomites be treated?

    Deuteronomy 23:7: Treat them with respect.
    2 Kings 14:3, Ezekiel 25:13, Obadiah 1:1, Obadiah 1:8-9: Kill them.

    Does God ever get angry? 

    Isaiah 27:4: Never
    Isaiah 34:2, Micah 5:15, Nahum 1:2, Zechariah 8:2: He needs anger management classes.

    Are Adam and Eve the ancestors of everyone? 

    Genesis 3:20: Yes
    Hebrews 7:3: Not everyone.
    Image result for muh holy book
    http://bibviz.com/
    Zombieguy1987
    Retired DebateIslander. I no longer come here actively, and many of the things that I may have posted in the past (Such as belief in the flat Earth theory) do not reflect on my current views. 

    https://docs.google.com/document/d/1p6M-VgXHwwdpJarhyQYapBz-kRc6FrgdOLFAd3IfYz8/edit

  • TTKDBTTKDB 265 Pts
    Humanity itself is full of  contradictions isn't it? 

    Which is maybe worse, a book with some contradictions in it?

    Or some of humanity being self contradictory? 


    Zombieguy1987SilverishGoldNova
  • TTKDB said:
    Humanity itself is full of  contradictions isn't it? 

    Which is maybe worse, a book with some contradictions in it?

    Or some of humanity being self contradictory? 

    Off topic...

    Again...

    https://www.google.com/search?q=victims+of+religion&safe=active&source=lnms&tbm=isch&sa=x&ved=0ahukewihu9jugorfahwkmeakhbtib00q_auidigb&biw=1920&bih=963&safe=active

    Blues and Raptors handed two very toxic teams embarrassing losses, 95% of the sports world is rejoicing in the news

    Repealing the Second Amendment is the first step to Totalitarianism, and it needs to be prevented to protect our freedom 

    http://www.atheistrepublic.com/
  • @SilverishGoldNova

    None of those are contradictions. You're just a poor thinker and ignorant of the bible.

    But here is one for you.

    American history books have contradictions. Here is one example.

    America has 42 States. - American History, Swinborn, 1867

    America has 50 States - American History, Bartells, 1949

    Tadaaa!!
    SilverishGoldNovaZombieguy1987IdolRocksPlaffelvohfen
  • ethang5 said:
    @SilverishGoldNova

    None of those are contradictions. You're just a poor thinker and ignorant of the bible.

    But here is one for you.

    American history books have contradictions. Here is one example.

    America has 42 States. - American History, Swinborn, 1867

    America has 50 States - American History, Bartells, 1949

    You can't be serious...

    Please... Tell me this is a joke...

    Tadaaa!!

    The bible is suppose to be Gods word, yet he/she seems to not even keep track of what they write.

    Not such an all mighty being after all 

    https://www.google.com/search?q=victims+of+religion&safe=active&source=lnms&tbm=isch&sa=x&ved=0ahukewihu9jugorfahwkmeakhbtib00q_auidigb&biw=1920&bih=963&safe=active

    Blues and Raptors handed two very toxic teams embarrassing losses, 95% of the sports world is rejoicing in the news

    Repealing the Second Amendment is the first step to Totalitarianism, and it needs to be prevented to protect our freedom 

    http://www.atheistrepublic.com/
  • ethang5 said:
    @SilverishGoldNova

    None of those are contradictions. You're just a poor thinker and ignorant of the bible.

    But here is one for you.

    American history books have contradictions. Here is one example.

    America has 42 States. - American History, Swinborn, 1867

    America has 50 States - American History, Bartells, 1949

    You can't be serious...

    Please... Tell me this is a joke...

    Tadaaa!!

    The bible is suppose to be Gods word, yet he/she seems to not even keep track of what they write.

    Not such an all mighty being after all 

    @Zombieguy1987 who was this post directed to? Talking about: "seems to not even keep track of what they write." !?
    Zombieguy1987
  • @Zombieguy1987

    >The bible is suppose to be Gods word, yet he/she seems to not even keep track of what they write.

    >Not such an all mighty being after all 

    As usual, you missed the point. And continue to pretend a contradiction exists simply because you've said one does.

    Not a single contradiction has been posted in this thread.

    If two history books have America having 42 states and 50 states, how is that a contradiction? Only stupid people think that way.

    The bible is a history book covering more than 6,000 years of human history. Things change. Number of horses, ages, names of towns and cities.

    But for the ignorant atheist, America could only have had 50 states, anything else is a contradiction. Ahaziah remained 22 years old and did not change. Nothing but poor thinking and anti-theist bias.

    Or they play on words as if words cannot have more than one meaning. So to such morons, the word "righteous" for example, can have only one meaning. So a common trait of language, that the same words can be used in different ways with different meaning, becomes a "contradiction" to such people.

    What these dweebs do, is post so many "contradictions", trying to overwhelm theists with a wall of text.

    Let's take them one at a time. Pick any one of your so called contradictions, and I will show you (and the board) your ignorance.

    Browsing an atheist website cannot substitute for an actual education.
    Zombieguy1987IdolRocks
  • IdolRocksIdolRocks 49 Pts
    @SilverishGoldNova They most likely are not contradictions at all. They have all been answered almost certainty without a doubt. It usually comes down to the Skeptic not likely the explanation of the contradiction because the explanation proves that they are wrong. However, perhaps you could provide a couple examples and I will respond to them. 
  • IdolRocksIdolRocks 49 Pts
    @Zombieguy1987

    I will respond to each one of the examples you gave by numbering them. I may not respond to all of them in one comment. I will respond to some of them now and the rest of them later. 

    1.) https://carm.org/has-anyone-seen-god-or-not

    3.) In regards to the third one, this is a common so-called contradiction but it has been answered over and over again and has been shown to not be a contradiction.

    https://carm.org/creation-events

    http://apologeticspress.org/apcontent.aspx?category=6&article=1131

    https://answersingenesis.org/contradictions-in-the-bible/do-genesis-1-and-2-contradict-each-other/

    https://creation.com/genesis-contradictions

    https://www.gotquestions.org/two-Creation-accounts.html

    https://www.blueletterbible.org/faq/don_stewart/don_stewart_694.cfm

     5.) https://carm.org/bible-difficulties/matthew-mark/how-many-blind-men-did-jesus-encounter-when-leaving-jericho

    https://www.gotquestions.org/one-two-blind-men.html

    http://apologeticspress.org/apcontent.aspx?category=6&article=666


    I will provide responses to the other two, which are #2 and #4, as soon as I find an explanation. But there is plenty for you to look at (if you choose to do so), until then. 
    Image result for bible contradictions
  • IdolRocksIdolRocks 49 Pts
    @SilverishGoldNova 

    1.)How many men of the chief did David's captains kill?


    2 Samuel 23:8: They killed 800.
    1 Chronicles 11:11: They killed 300.

    2.) Has anyone ever seen God face to face?

    John 1:18: No
    Exodus 33:11: Yes

    3.) What should we do to homosexuals?

    Leviticus 20:13, Leviticus 18:22: They should be killed.
    1 Kings 15:11-12: They should be exiled.

    4.)Who was Salah's father?

    Genesis 10:24, Genesis 11:12: Arphaxad
    Luke 3:35-36: Cainan

    5.) Was Keturah Abraham's wife or concubine?

    Genesis 25:1: Wife
    1 Chronicles 1:32: Concubine

    6.) Who was Joseph's father?

    Matthew 1:16: Jacob
    Luke 3:23: Heli

    7.) How should the Edomites be treated?

    Deuteronomy 23:7: Treat them with respect.
    2 Kings 14:3, Ezekiel 25:13, Obadiah 1:1, Obadiah 1:8-9: Kill them.

    8.) Does God ever get angry? 

    Isaiah 27:4: Never
    Isaiah 34:2, Micah 5:15, Nahum 1:2, ZHebrews 7:3echariah 8:2: He needs anger management classes.

    9.) Are Adam and Eve the ancestors of everyone? 

    Genesis 3:20: Yes
    Hebrews 7:3: Not everyone.


    All of these have answers. It is really not difficult to search and find the explanations for these so-called contradictions. It turns out that they are not contradictions at all. 

    1.)   http://apologeticspress.org/apcontent.aspx?category=6&article=749



    2.) https://carm.org/has-anyone-seen-god-or-not

    3.)   https://www.rationalchristianity.net/law_killing.html

    https://www.rationalchristianity.net/homosexuality.html

    https://carm.org/leviticus-18-22

    https://www.apologeticspress.org/apcontent.aspx?category=7&article=1419



    4.) http://apologeticspress.org/apcontent.aspx?category=6&article=668

    5.) https://apologeticspress.org/AllegedDiscrepancies.aspx?article=804&b=Genesis   This one, the article is like word for word what you have written. 

    Was Keturah Abraham's wife or concubine?

    Genesis 25:1: Wife
    1 Chronicles 1:32: Concubine

    Was Keturah Abraham's Wife or Concubine?

    That is the article title. The title is the exact same thing. You could have copied and pasted what you wrote and put into Google and it would have led you to this link, along with other links as well.

    https://www.gotquestions.org/Keturah-in-the-Bible.html

    https://askjohnmackay.com/keturah-is-called-a-concubine-and-a-wife-when-did-abraham-marry-her-and-when-were-her-children-born/



    6.) https://apologeticspress.org/apcontent.aspx?category=6&article=932

    7.)

    8.)

    9.)

    10.)


    I will give answers to the ones I left blank later. They are #'s 7-10.
  • IdolRocksIdolRocks 49 Pts
    @SilverishGoldNova 


    1.)How many men of the chief did David's captains kill?


    2 Samuel 23:8: They killed 800.

    1 Chronicles 11:11: They killed 300.


    2.) Has anyone ever seen God face to face?


    John 1:18: No

    Exodus 33:11: Yes


    3.) What should we do to homosexuals?


    Leviticus 20:13, Leviticus 18:22: They should be killed.

    1 Kings 15:11-12: They should be exiled.


    4.)Who was Salah's father?


    Genesis 10:24, Genesis 11:12: Arphaxad

    Luke 3:35-36: Cainan


    5.) Was Keturah Abraham's wife or concubine?


    Genesis 25:1: Wife

    1 Chronicles 1:32: Concubine


    6.) Who was Joseph's father?


    Matthew 1:16: Jacob

    Luke 3:23: Heli


    7.) How should the Edomites be treated?


    Deuteronomy 23:7: Treat them with respect.

    2 Kings 14:3, Ezekiel 25:13, Obadiah 1:1, Obadiah 1:8-9: Kill them.


    8.) Does God ever get angry?


    Isaiah 27:4: Never

    Isaiah 34:2, Micah 5:15, Nahum 1:2, ZHebrews 7:3echariah 8:2: He needs anger management classes.


    9.) Are Adam and Eve the ancestors of everyone?


    Genesis 3:20: Yes

    Hebrews 7:3: Not everyone.



    All of these have answers. It is really not difficult to search and find the explanations for these so-called contradictions. It turns out that they are not contradictions at all.


    1.)   http://apologeticspress.org/apcontent.aspx?category=6&article=749




    2.) https://carm.org/has-anyone-seen-god-or-not


    3.)   https://www.rationalchristianity.net/law_killing.html


    https://www.rationalchristianity.net/homosexuality.html


    https://carm.org/leviticus-18-22


    https://www.apologeticspress.org/apcontent.aspx?category=7&article=1419


  • IdolRocksIdolRocks 49 Pts
    @SilverishGoldNova


    When I tried to post the comment including your entire comment, I get an error message. Since I am new to this website and also since I am making this comment late at night, I am just going to post it without your comment and I will break it up too.

    All of these have answers. It is really not difficult to search and find the explanations for these so-called contradictions. It turns out that they are not contradictions at all.


    1.)   http://apologeticspress.org/apcontent.aspx?category=6&article=749


  • IdolRocksIdolRocks 49 Pts
  • IdolRocksIdolRocks 49 Pts
    @SilverishGoldNova

    4.) http://apologeticspress.org/apcontent.aspx?category=6&article=668


    5.) https://apologeticspress.org/AllegedDiscrepancies.aspx?article=804&b=Genesis   This one, the article is like word for word what you have written.


    Was Keturah Abraham's wife or concubine?


    Genesis 25:1: Wife

    1 Chronicles 1:32: Concubine


    Was Keturah Abraham's Wife or Concubine?

    That is the article title. The title is the exact same thing. You could have copied and pasted what you wrote and put into Google and it would have led you to this link, along with other links as well.


    https://www.gotquestions.org/Keturah-in-the-Bible.html


    https://askjohnmackay.com/keturah-is-called-a-concubine-and-a-wife-when-did-abraham-marry-her-and-when-were-her-children-born/


  • IdolRocksIdolRocks 49 Pts
    @SilverishGoldNova

    4.) http://apologeticspress.org/apcontent.aspx?category=6&article=668


    5.) https://apologeticspress.org/AllegedDiscrepancies.aspx?article=804&b=Genesis   This one, the article is like word for word what you have written.


    Was Keturah Abraham's wife or concubine?


    Genesis 25:1: Wife

    1 Chronicles 1:32: Concubine


    Was Keturah Abraham's Wife or Concubine?

    That is the article title. The title is the exact same thing. You could have copied and pasted what you wrote and put into Google and it would have led you to this link, along with other links as well.


    https://www.gotquestions.org/Keturah-in-the-Bible.html


    https://askjohnmackay.com/keturah-is-called-a-concubine-and-a-wife-when-did-abraham-marry-her-and-when-were-her-children-born/


  • IdolRocksIdolRocks 49 Pts
    @SilverishGoldNova


    6.) https://apologeticspress.org/apcontent.aspx?category=6&article=932


    7.)


    8.)


    9.)


    10.)



    I will give answers to the ones I left blank later. They are #'s 7-10.


  • TKDBTKDB 158 Pts
    People still went to church last Sunday, and they'll go to church again today.
    Zombieguy1987
  • SandSand 64 Pts
    800,000 men were fighting in Israel: 2 Samuel 24:9
    1,100,000 men were fighting in Israel: 1 Chronicles 21:5

    If we remember that 2 Samuel and 1 Chronicles were written by two men with different views.
    1 Chronicles 21:6 shows some officers were not included in the number which sheds light on why the different totals.
    One writer from his side counted the full number and then the standing army of the other side omitting the officers, whereas the other writer did the same from his side.

    For example:
    The writer from Judah
    Israel had 800,000 men (Standing men, omitted officers) and Judah had 500,000 men (Total)
    The writer from Israel
    Israel had 1,100,000 men (Total) and Judah had 470,000 men (Standing men, omitted officers)

    454 Children of Adin: Ezra 2:15
    655 Children of Adin: Nehemiah 7:20

    The number of those who registered to return was different from the number who actually did return.

    Ahaziah was 22: 2 Kings 8:26
    Ahaziah was 42: 2 Chronicles 22:2

    You have to remember the King James Version was translated with only a few of the original scrolls. It relied heavily on the Masoretic text, we now have access to 5000 hebrew scrolls, 6000 greek scrolls. When you compare the other scrolls the Masoretic text was in error.

    He was 22 years old.

    Jacob was Joseph's Father: Matthew 1:16
    Heli was Joseph's Father: Luke 3:23

    Heli was Joseph’s  Father-in-law.

    Matthew shows the lineage of Joseph.
    Luke shows the lineage of Mary.

    David Captured 700 Horsemen: 2 Samuel 8:4
    David Captured 7,000 Horsemen: 1 Chronicles 18:4

    One writer shows the total number of horsemen the other shows specific from Hadadezer’s realm. Other scriptures shows totals from the vassal kings, servants, and surrounding areas. Copper, gold shields among other things.(2 Samuel 8:7, 8; 1 Chronicles 18:7, 8; 2 Samuel 10:19.)

    Men have seen God
    No man has seen God

    Bible readers sometimes forget the Angels. They think they were just sitting and watching everything. They represent God, and usually have a message from God. So when they appear to man they will speak as if they are God. and do miraculous things. Man would document it was an Angel and then the words of persons “he saw God”.

    The scriptures you listed do not show man seeing God.
    Gen 32:20; num 14:14
    Gen 32:20 - Jacob sending servants to Esau
    Numbers 14:14 - Moses speaking to God, saying what others would say that Israel saw God face-to-face

    Nevertheless, there are other scriptures that show servants saying they saw God. They were sctually angels.

    That is why Jesus could honestly say that ‘No man has seen God at anytime’.
    Jesus also says ‘No man has heard God at anytime’.

    Because he knows that God sends Angels who represent him.

    God does not keep anger forever
    God keeps anger forever

    God is talking about Israel verses Judah.
    He says so in verse 11.
    And the LORD said to me, “Faithless Israel has proved herself more righteous than treacherous Judah.
    One he will stay angry forever the other he will not stay angry forever.

    God creates man then animals
    God creates animals then man

    The word used is “formed”which is past tense.
    So the scripture is saying animals were made first.

    Man can be righteous
    Man can’t be righteous

    Over a life time men cannot be completely righteous, we are imperfect.
    Although in certain situations and for a time period a person could be considered righteous.

    Two blind men healed on the road
    One blind man healed on the road

    Since Jesus’ conversation evidently was directed particularly toward one person, Mark did not mention the fact that another blind man was present.

    IdolRocks
  • SandSand 64 Pts
    What I can say is to read and study the Bible for yourself, do not solely listen to other websites.
    IdolRocks


  • Can a current pseudo-christian at DebateIsland provide the latest spin doctoring to the blatant CONTRADICTING nature of the two passages below, where Jesus says that one has to HATE HIS BROTHER in the book of Luke, and then states that one is NOT TO HATE THEIR BROTHER in the book of John? When doing so, please provide the exact decoder ring you used and the company that made it. Thanks.

    JESUS STATED: "If anyone comes to me and does not hate father and mother, wife and children, brothers and sisters--yes, even their own life--such a person cannot be my disciple." (Luke 14:26)

    JESUS STATED: "If anyone says, 'I love God,' and hates his brother, he is a liar; for he who does not love his brother whom he has seen cannot love God whom he has not seen." (1 John 4:20 )


  • TKDBTKDB 158 Pts
    Sure there's contradictions in the Bible, humanity is fallable, and lives with its self created contradictions.
    Zombieguy1987



  • @TKDB

    Again, you embarrass yourself in front of the members of DebateIsland Religion forum!

    YOUR UNGODLY QUOTE: “Sure there's contradictions in the Bible, humanity is fallable, and lives with its self created contradictions.”

    You are blatantly missing the point, where humans may be fallable, but your serial killer Yahweh/Jesus’ inspired words CANNOT BE!  What part of the passage shown below do you not understand?!

    “EVERY word of God is flawless; he is a shield to those who take refute in him.” (Proverbs 30:5)

    Therefore, when you mention that there are contradictions within your primitive Bronze and Iron Age bible, then you are DIRECTLY calling your Yahweh/Jesus god a LIAR, because both contradictions cannot be true at the same time! Don’t you realize that when you make a mockery of your primitive god, that he is watching you to determine what your fate will be upon Judgment Day? (Proverbs 5:21-23) This action by you is just another example of the pseudo-christian turning themselves into pretzels in trying in vain to wiggle out of a "Catch-22" situation like this one!

    How utterly embarrassing for you once again.




  • ZeusAres42ZeusAres42 206 Pts
    As with anything man made there are bound to be contradictions somewhere down the line.
    Plaffelvohfen
    "never show someone your entire hand too soon" - Famous Proverb/Idiom.

  • TKDBTKDB 158 Pts
    @21CenturyIconoclast

    What exactly is the mission, behind your individual anti religious philosophical points of view?

    What is your intent, or IE, what are you hoping to teach others through your rhetoric? 

    Please, what are you hoping to accomplish?

    (show someone/something up
    phrasal verb of show
    1. make someone or something conspicuous or clearly visible.
      "a rising moon showed up the wild seascape"
      • expose someone or something as being bad or faulty in some way. )

    You're going to show up, the Bible? 

    Or, you're going to show up, God, or Jesus?

    You're going to show up, the religious buildings across the United States?

    Or, you're going to show up, the religious kids, teenagers, parents, and the senior citizens, who go to a religious building, on a regular basis? 

    Who are you trying to show up, with your below rhetoric?

    "Again, you embarrass yourself in front of the members of DebateIsland Religion forum!

    YOUR UNGODLY QUOTE: “Sure there's contradictions in the Bible, humanity is fallable, and lives with its self created contradictions.”

    You are blatantly missing the point, where humans may be fallable, but your serial killer Yahweh/Jesus’ inspired words CANNOT BE!  What part of the passage shown below do you not understand?!

    “EVERY word of God is flawless; he is a shield to those who take refute in him.” (Proverbs 30:5)

    Therefore, when you mention that there are contradictions within your primitive Bronze and Iron Age bible, then you are DIRECTLY calling your Yahweh/Jesus god a LIAR, because both contradictions cannot be true at the same time! Don’t you realize that when you make a mockery of your primitive god, that he is watching you to determine what your fate will be upon Judgment Day? (Proverbs 5:21-23) This action by you is just another example of the pseudo-christian turning themselves into pretzels in trying in vain to wiggle out of a "Catch-22" situation like this one!

    How utterly embarrassing for you once again. "

    Your very own words, are a gold mine, in how your individual mindset works, by how you express yourself.

    I understand, that you've gone out of your way, to get people's attention, haven't you? 



    Plaffelvohfen



  • @TKDB

    As usual, and for you to save further embarrassment relative to your primitive and disgusting Christian faith, you forgot to address the FACT that you called your brutal serial killer Yahweh/Jesus a LIAR!!! You represent just another pseudo-christian that RUNS AWAY from their faith.


    You take the Satanic position to know more than your killer Jesus’ inspired word, where he has told YOU TO DEFEND THE FAITH, but instead, you RUN AWAY from it!  Why do you do that?  Are you under the control of Satan?

    JESUS' INSPIRED WORDS  STATED: "We destroy arguments and every lofty opinion raised against the knowledge of God, and take every thought captive to obey Christ," (2 Corinthians 10:5) 

    JESUS' INSPIRED WORDS STATED: "He must hold firm to the trustworthy word as taught, so that he may be able to give instruction in sound doctrine and also to rebuke those who contradict it." (Titus 1:9) 

    JESUS' INSPIRED WORDS STATED: "But in your hearts honor Christ the Lord as holy, always being prepared to make a defense to anyone who asks you for a reason for the hope that is in you; yet do it with gentleness and respect," (1 Peter 3:15)


    You are obviously too embarrassed to even "try" to defend your primitive Bronze and Iron Age Christianity relative to its blatant contradictions, therefore slapping Jesus in the face, therefore, why continue to be a pseudo-christian? Jesus is now watching you RUN AWAY from defending his faith!!!!! (Proverbs 5:21-23) Again, how embarrassing for you.











  • IdolRocksIdolRocks 49 Pts
    @ZeusAres42 Oh, so I am sure that the History Books and Textbooks at school are all full of contradictions too, also man-made as well.  Right?
  • ZeusAres42ZeusAres42 206 Pts

    As I said, As with anything man made there are bound to be contradictions somewhere down the line. I didn't say anything was full to the brim of contradictions.

    "never show someone your entire hand too soon" - Famous Proverb/Idiom.

  • IdolRocksIdolRocks 49 Pts
    @ZeusAres42 Okay. Fine. But the Bible does not have any contradictions. They are apparent contradictions that have explanations. Many many books have been written explaining them and many articles on websites as well. Would you like to take a look at some with me and perhaps go through some of the most common ones?
  • DeeDee 382 Pts
    @IdolRocks

    You say ...... But the Bible does not have any contradictions. They are apparent contradictions that have explanations

    My reply .....It certainly does. Now you’re saying it does with “explanations” , so are you saying one should not read the Bible without someone to reinterpret it for you? 

    You say .....Many many books have been written explaining them and many articles on websites as well.

    My reply .....Yes indeed and a lot of them have varied explanations, do you know there are 33,000 denominations of Christianity and not one of them agrees with the others view of what is correct regards the teachings

  • TKDBTKDB 158 Pts
    @21CenturyIconoclast

    You really think that much of your anti religious argument, it would seem?

    "As usual, and for you to save further embarrassment relative to your primitive and disgusting Christian faith, you forgot to address the FACT that you called your brutal serial killer Yahweh/Jesus a LIAR!!! You represent just another pseudo-christian that RUNS AWAY from their faith."

    Do you see me running away from you?

  • IdolRocks said:
    @ZeusAres42 Okay. Fine. But the Bible does not have any contradictions. They are apparent contradictions that have explanations. Many many books have been written explaining them and many articles on websites as well. Would you like to take a look at some with me and perhaps go through some of the most common ones?
    If a text (here the Bible) needs "many many" books to explain incoherencies and apparent contradictions, it speaks of either incredibly bad authorship (funny for an alleged "perfect being" own words...), or it's a scam... I happen to think it's both in the case of the bible... 
    " Adversus absurdum, contumaciter ac ridens! "
  • @TKDB

    YOUR REVEALING QUOTE: "Do you see me running away from you?"

    The obvious and correct answer is, YES! 

    If you have the nerve, scroll up until you reach my post that you are BLATANTLY RUNNING AWAY FROM! This is the revealing post that shows your serial killer Jesus contradicting himself in the two examples shown.  DEBATEISLAND is watching, so do not RUN AWAY again with child like excuses, okay?  

    Pseudo-christians are so predictable when they RUN!


    .
    PlaffelvohfenZombieguy1987
  • TKDBTKDB 158 Pts
    @21CenturyIconoclast

    The below is your evidence, to religion in general, disturbing you peace?

    Evidence example #1
    ("As usual, and for you to save further embarrassment relative to your primitive and disgusting Christian faith, you forgot to address the FACT that you called your brutal serial killer Yahweh/Jesus a LIAR!!! You represent just another pseudo-christian that RUNS AWAY from their faith."

    "YOUR REVEALING QUOTE: "Do you see me running away from you?"

    The obvious and correct answer is, YES!")

    You're sad, what about you, is there to be afraid of?

    Evidence example #2
    ("If you have the nerve, scroll up until you reach my post that you are BLATANTLY RUNNING AWAY FROM! This is the revealing post that shows your serial killer Jesus contradicting himself in the two examples shown.  DEBATEISLAND is watching, so do not RUN AWAY again with child like excuses, okay?  

    Pseudo-christians are so predictable when they RUN!")

    Dude, you couldn't make toddlers run from you, or the religious kids, or parents run from you.

    You're not anyone to be feared, but your self created sadness if very evident, through the way, you carefully craft your anti religious rhetoric, from the comforts of your keyboard, and the internet?

    If the toddlers in a church, or the religious kids, or the religious parents, or a religious building in your own neighborhood is causing you such a fright, why not call the Police, and report that same religious building, for disturbing your peace? 

    Zombieguy1987
  • IdolRocksIdolRocks 49 Pts
    @Plaffelvohfen ;If a text (here the Bible) needs "many many" books to explain incoherencies and apparent contradictions, it speaks of either incredibly bad authorship (funny for an alleged "perfect being" own words...), or it's a scam... I happen to think it's both in the case of the bible... 

    Are you serious?? There are no actual contradictions or inconsistencies, just Skeptics who fail to read them properly. The Books are there to help explain them and explain how they are not a contradiction or inconsistency.

    They are not a bad thing. Them existing is a good thing. They explain what seems to be a contradiction and show how it is not a contradiction.

    For example, Judas death, is a popular one. Well, it has a simple explanation. 

    https://carm.org/bible-difficulties/matthew-mark/how-did-judas-die-hanging-or-falling-down

    https://www.apologeticspress.org/apcontent.aspx?category=6&article=1761

    http://www.apologeticspress.org/DiscoveryPubPage.aspx?pub=2&issue=1219&article=2611

    https://www.gotquestions.org/Judas-die.html

    Here are three different websites explaining how this apparent contradiction is not a contradiction and how it is actually the Skeptic who is in error. 

    If the inconsistencies and contradictions were real, you would have a good point but since there are none that cannot be easily explained, your point does not make sense. 


    Sand
  • IdolRocksIdolRocks 49 Pts
    @21CenturyIconoclast

    Luke 14:26

    https://www.gotquestions.org/hate-father-mother.html

    Q: In 1 Jn 4:19-20, why is it impossible to genuinely say you love God when you hate your brother? 
    A: Scripture does not explicitly say, but there might be a couple of reasons for this. 
    Comparative difficulty: If we are not able to love our Christian brothers and sisters, whom we can see, touch, and talk with directly, it would be more difficult to love God, whom we cannot (yet) set, touch and talk face-to-face. 
    What is inside us: If God Spirit gives us love toward others, and we do not have that love towards others, that would appear that we do not have God’s Spirit in us, and we are not saved. 
     

    Q: In 1 Jn 4:20-21, how are we supposed to love others? 
    A: We are supposed to love others in almost every way. We are to love in actions, not just words (James 2:14-16), sacrificially, and as God loves us (1 John 4:19). Love is the most important of Christian virtues (1 Corinthians 13, especially verses 1-3, 13). 
    The only way we are not supposed to love, is to love anyone, even our own family greater than we love God. If our alleged love for someone causes us to disobey God, then that is misguided or wrong love. 

    http://www.biblequery.org/1jn.html

    It was not difficult to find an explanation for these two verses. You are just looking for something to fuss about. Try going to websites such as ApologeticPress, Carm.org, and GotQuestions, that will explain the confusing verse or the apparent contradiction, first. 




    This book explains 439 alleged contradictions. I suggest checking it out. 

    Sand
  • IdolRocksIdolRocks 49 Pts
    @Dee ;My reply .....Yes indeed and a lot of them have varied explanations, do you know there are 33,000 denominations of Christianity and not one of them agrees with the others view of what is correct regards the teachings

    I am sorry but what does that have to do with the fact that the alleged contradictions have been explained away? 

    https://www.gotquestions.org/denominations-Christian.html

    https://carm.org/what-about-different-denominations


    Sand
  • IdolRocksIdolRocks 49 Pts
    @Dee ;

    You say ...... But the Bible does not have any contradictions. They are apparent contradictions that have explanations

    My reply .....It certainly does. Now you’re saying it does with “explanations”, so are you saying one should not read the Bible without someone to reinterpret it for you? 

    Then you need to give me examples, then? Instead of making baseless claims. I am saying that when one comes across verse that seems to contradict another verse, they should go to websites such as the ones below, along with many more and look for an explanation that will explain the verse that they are confused. There is nothing wrong with being confused about a Verse. If the verse is difficult to understand, as in, there might be a contradiction, then one can simply look up an explanation and try to understand what is going on. 

    I am saying that there are websites that explain the apparent contradiction and show how it isn't a contradiction.

    Like with Judas Death, for example: 

    https://www.gotquestions.org/Judas-die.html

    https://www.apologeticspress.org/apcontent.aspx?category=6&article=1761

    https://carm.org/bible-difficulties/matthew-mark/how-did-judas-die-hanging-or-falling-down


    I own this book, and I highly suggest it for any open-minded person, who may be interested in understanding difficult verses that have apparent contradictions. 
    Sand
  • DeeDee 382 Pts
    @IdolRocks


    You say ......Then you need to give me examples, then? Instead of making baseless claims. 


    My reply ..... I never make baseless claims , I can back every say up 


    You say .....I am saying that when one comes across verse that seems to contradict another verse, they should go to websites such as the ones below, along with many more and look for an explanation that will explain the verse that they are confused. 


    My reply .....But leaving your websites aside for now which of the Christian websites should one use as many disagree with the other , so how do you determine which is right?


    You say ....There is nothing wrong with being confused about a Verse. If the verse is difficult to understand, as in, there might be a contradiction, then one can simply look up an explanation and try to understand what is going on. 


    My reply ....But I’m not confused the words are plain enough it’s Christians who are confused as they jump from verse in an attempt to justify unpalatable truths .Do you not think an all powerful god should have been able to have his words and messages conveyed more clearly?


    Here are 3 clear contradictions to start with .....



    1.....

    • Genesis 6:19-20: 2 of each animal [clean or unclean] into the ark. 2 of each kind of bird.
    • Genesis 7:2-3: Actually, make that 7 of each clean animal into the ark, 7 of each kind of bird, and 2 of each unclean animal.


    2......

    • John 1: No man hath seen God at any time.
    • Exodus 33: The Lord spoke unto Moses face to face, as a man speaketh unto his friend.


    3......

    • Matthew 27: The last words of Christ: "My God, my God, why hast thou forsaken me?".
    • Luke 23: The last words of Christ: "Father, unto thy hands I commend my spirit".
    • John 19: The last words of Christ: "It is finished".





    You say .....I am saying that there are websites that explain the apparent contradiction and show how it isn't a contradiction. 


    My reply .....Indeed and a lot disagree with the other so why believe any?



    You say ....own this book, and I highly suggest it for any open-minded person, who may be interested in understanding difficult verses that have apparent contradictions. 


    My reply .....Open minded?  You’re doing the complete and utter opposite to open mindedness you’re attempting to bury your head in the sand by justifying what cannot be justified 


  • DeeDee 382 Pts
    edited May 25
    @IdolRocks

    You say .....I am sorry but what does that have to do with the fact that the alleged contradictions have been explained away?

    My reply ....It has everything to do with it on your link it states .....As long as a churchbelieves in these essential doctrines, then it is Christian.  However, there are many things in the scriptures that have been interpreted in different ways. 

    So , which interpretation is the correct one regarding biblical contradictions? 

    Your source also states .....Within Christianity there are very few essential doctrines that define what it means to be a Christian.  These essential doctrines are,
    1. Jesus is both God and man (John 1:1148:24Col. 2:91 John 4:1-4).
    2. Jesus rose from the dead physically (John 2:19-211 Cor. 15:14).
    3. Salvation is by grace through faith (Rom. 5:1Eph. 2:8-9Gal. 3:1-2).
    4. The gospel is the death, burial, and resurrection of Jesus (1 Cor. 15:1-4Gal. 1:8-9).
    5. There is only one God (Exodus 20:3Isaiah 43:1044:6,8).
    6. God exists as a Trinity of persons:  Father, Son, and Holy Spirit. (See Trinity).
    7. Jesus was born of the Virgin Mary (nature of incarnation).

    The Wesrboro Baptist Church believes these dictates so using your source you regard them as “Christians “ if not why not?
  • IdolRocksIdolRocks 49 Pts
    @Dee ;My reply .....But leaving your websites aside for now which of the Christian websites should one use as many disagree with the other , so how do you determine which is right?

    I presented you two articles talking about Different Denominations in Christianity, did I not? The Second one, that leads to Carm.org, I will provide it again below:

    https://carm.org/what-about-different-denominations

    I would highly suggest that you read this article. 

    I will provide a small portion of it for you, because I think that this part of it, is important:

    "The reason there are different denominations within Christianity is because the Bible allows for us to have differences of opinions.  Within Christianity there are very few essential doctrines that define what it means to be a Christian.  These essential doctrines are,

    1. Jesus is both God and man (John 1:1148:24Col. 2:91 John 4:1-4).
    2. Jesus rose from the dead physically (John 2:19-211 Cor. 15:14).
    3. Salvation is by grace through faith (Rom. 5:1Eph. 2:8-9Gal. 3:1-2).
    4. The gospel is the death, burial, and resurrection of Jesus (1 Cor. 15:1-4Gal. 1:8-9).
    5. There is only one God (Exodus 20:3Isaiah 43:1044:6,8).
    6. God exists as a Trinity of persons:  Father, Son, and Holy Spirit. (See Trinity).
    7. Jesus was born of the Virgin Mary (nature of incarnation).

    As long as a church believes in these essential doctrines, then it is Christian."

    "My reply ....But I’m not confused the words are plain enough it’s Christians who are confused as they jump from verse in an attempt to justify unpalatable truths .Do you not think an all powerful god should have been able to have his words and messages conveyed more clearly?"

    No. First of all, are we talking about Morality in the Bible, and things that you dislike or are we talking about "Apparent Contradictions". Whichever one we are talking about, lets stick to it. Not both at the same time. So, if it is contradictions, then let it only be Contradictions. But let's not do both at the same time. Okay? 

    "Do you not think an all powerful god should have been able to have his words and messages conveyed more clearly?"

    I think that Humans in their sinful state will have trouble understanding the Bible in certain parts, which is completely fine. There is nothing wrong with Humans having difficulty understanding the Bible. 

    https://www.gotquestions.org/understand-the-Bible.html


    Now as far as the contradictions. First of all, please note, that I will do my best to address all of them at once, but there may be times when I am unable (at the moment) to find an explanation for a particle set of verses, so I may not respond to certain ones, but I will happily give my responses to them, as soon as I find one. 


    First of all, here are two websites dealing with "Bible Difficulties" and "Alleged Discrepancies".

    https://carm.org/genesis-deuteronomy

    http://apologeticspress.org/AllegedDiscrepancies.aspx

    Now, for the "Apparent Contradictions"

    Contradiction #1

    • Genesis 6:19-20: 2 of each animal [clean or unclean] into the ark. 2 of each kind of bird.
    • Genesis 7:2-3: Actually, make that 7 of each clean animal into the ark, 7 of each kind of bird, and 2 of each unclean animal.

    https://carm.org/how-many-kinds-did-noah-bring-ark-two-or-seven

    http://apologeticspress.org/AllegedDiscrepancies.aspx?article=656&b=Genesis

    https://askjohnmackay.com/ark-animals-does-genesis-7-contradict-genesis-6-about-the-number-of-animals-on-the-ark/

    Contradiction #2

    • John 1: No man hath seen God at any time.
    • Exodus 33: The Lord spoke unto Moses face to face, as a man speaketh unto his friend.

    https://carm.org/has-anyone-seen-god-or-not

    http://apologeticspress.org/AllegedDiscrepancies.aspx?article=2682&b=Genesis

    https://answersingenesis.org/who-is-god/face-to-face/

    Contradiction #3

    • Matthew 27: The last words of Christ: "My God, my God, why hast thou forsaken me?".
    • Luke 23: The last words of Christ: "Father, unto thy hands I commend my spirit".
    • John 19: The last words of Christ: "It is finished".

    And you even left Mark out, it seems.

    This one has a lot of links to it.

    https://defendinginerrancy.com/bible-solutions/Matthew_27.37_(cf._Mark_15.26;_Luke_23.38;_John_19.19).php

    https://answersingenesis.org/jesus-christ/crucifixion/crossed-messages/

    http://apologeticspress.org/AllegedDiscrepancies.aspx?article=650

    https://carm.org/bible-difficulties/matthew-mark/what-was-written-sign-cross

    https://www.compellingtruth.org/INRI.html

    Now, if I ever to provide a link with the wrong verses, please, respectfully tell me and I will quickly fix it. 


    Sand
  • IdolRocksIdolRocks 49 Pts
    @Dee ;Open minded?  You’re doing the complete and utter opposite to open mindedness you’re attempting to bury your head in the sand by justifying what cannot be justified.

    Why are you talking about "Justified" and "Not Justified"? I thought we were referring to contradictions. Are we referring to "Contradictions" or "Morality in the Bible"?? 

    And I'm really not doing the opposite of being open-minded. I am sending you stuff responding to what you are saying. There is nothing close-minded about that. I am simply having a conversation with you. 

    https://www.str.org/articles/does-god-have-to-obey-the-ten-commandments#.XOj6C4hKhPZ

    "Why is murder wrong? According to Genesis 9 the reason that murder is wrong is you are destroying something of God's, something that bears His nameplate - His image. You destroy another human being and you will be punished for destroying God's property. Can God destroy God's property? The answer seems to be yes. You see, God is the King of the universe. He is King of the universe not because He is the most powerful, and not by some arbitrary rule, but because He created it and it belongs to Him from the beginning. God can do what He wants with His universe. If He chooses to give life, He can give it. If He chooses to take life, He can take it. It's not immoral for God to take the life of His own property."

    Also, when you talk about things being able to be justified and not be able to be justified, you are referring to personal preferences or IOW, opinions. So, in your opinion, this and that cannot be justified, but it is simply your opinion.

    "Do you have an objective standard of morality by which you can judge whether or not something is morally right or wrong?"

    Also, depending on which verses, you are referring to, they are justified, because they are being taken out of context, to make them say things that they do not say." So, will you please point out some verses that you are referring to. 

    And I know I said to stick to either "Morality" or "Apparent Contradictions", but I realize now, that there is no need for that. As long as we have a separate comment for each, that should help to avoid confusion. 
    Sand
  • IdolRocksIdolRocks 49 Pts
    @TKDB There's not. They can be explained. There are plenty of websites and books available for those who are interested in finding out the truth. I will happily provide some below if you are interested? Are you?
    Sand
  • ethang5ethang5 117 Pts
    edited June 1
    @Zombieguy1987

    >The bible is suppose to be Gods word,....

    Written over a period of 4,000 years. Just as with my history book example, there was a time the american flag had only 42 stars, and another time it had 50. That is no a contradiction. Not o anyone with a functioning brain anyway.

    >yet he/she seems to not even keep track of what they write

    Like I said, you are just ignorant. Do you also believe no one "kept
    track" of the American flag too?

    >Not such an all mighty being after all 

    Not to the terminally stupid I guess.
    Zombieguy1987SandDee
  • DeeDee 382 Pts
    @IdolRocks

    Can you please address my replies to your defence of biblical slavery before we continue with this topic?
  • SandSand 64 Pts
    You have no proof for your claims.
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