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Should mankind's space agencies invest in the exploration of space?

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  • someone234someone234 647 Pts   -  
    @Pogue This is where you are wrong. Why communicate with the people most likely to use their contact against them? They much prefer to contact people who are not nosy and not going to harm them with what they find out.
  • PoguePogue 584 Pts   -  
    @Pogue This is where you are wrong. Why communicate with the people most likely to use their contact against them? They much prefer to contact people who are not nosy and not going to harm them with what they find out.
    And how do you know this besides what you say? There is no way to verify this! You also do not debunk my points. 
    I could either have the future pass me or l could create it. 

    “We are all born ignorant, but one must work hard to remain .” - Benjamin Franklin  So flat Earthers, man-made climate change deniers, and just science deniers.

    I friended myself! 
  • PoguePogue 584 Pts   -  
    "One of the benefits of space exploration is international cooperation. Although the Age of Space began in a fiercely competitive mode, political and funding realities have now shifted the balance toward cooperation. This is particularly true in the case of the International Space Station, with its 16 partner nations. And it promises to be increasingly true with the Vision for Space Exploration.  

    The reality of international cooperation was brought home to me at a recent "International Workshop on Exploration Science," sponsored by NASA and held at College Park Maryland, March 8-10, 2005. The fourth in a series of international meetings over the last year, this one was attended by the space agencies of 21 countries, 13 multinational organizations, and seven U. S. government organizations. It is not so widely known, but true, that international cooperation goes beyond the Space Station itself. Participants pointed out that, for example, fully half of the last 60 space science missions have had international participation. And in the last ten years, NASA has carried out more than 900 agreements with 68 countries." https://www.nasa.gov/exploration/whyweexplore/Why_We_10.html

    So, to your WW2 one. False comparison fallacy. Concentration camps are nothing like space exploration. You also have not challenged my economy point. Space exploration, which you have not provided anything to make it seem negative (besides your unproved string theory alien stuff). It also leads to a greater understanding of our universe. 

    "Undoubtedly, space exploration has answered the question of whether the Earth is round or not and proved that the Earth does revolve around the sun (and not the other way around). But it does much more than that: it gives people a deeper insight into the universe and provides them with more information about the world they live in. It helps them realize that their problems aren’t really that debilitating in the grand scheme of things while reminding them of how fortunate they are to be part of the vast and majestic universe."

    Here are the jobs and economy. No. It was that space travel and exploration has always led to technological advancements and it could be used in medicine. 
    Here are 20 inventions we would not have without it.
    https://www.jpl.nasa.gov/infographics/infographic.view.php?id=11358

    Another advantage is that it creates jobs and opportunities which can be taxed to fund the space agencies and other programs and more people can have more money which means (likely) that since they did not have that money before (poor/middle-class) they would spend it in the economy. 
    "Space exploration doesn’t just involve scientist and astronauts; it also requires the skills and labor of many engineers, research assistants, technicians, mechanics, and other professionals. If space exploration would be stopped today, these people would become jobless, and they won’t have the means to support themselves and their families.

    The good thing about this is that space exploration programs show no signs of stopping, and they’re expected to get bigger in the coming years. This means that more jobs would be created, which can significantly help with the employment problems that many countries face." https://futureofworking.com/7-advantages-and-disadvantages-of-space-exploration/

    Technological advancement. The technology developed for space exploration has and will continue to extend to myriad other things. Image processing moved from the moon to the medical field, and technological advancements in cancer treatment, solar panels, lightweight materials, digital data storage, water purification, and satellite communication systems have all come from space programs and exploration. Not to mention memory foam! Who knows what sort of incredible advancements (and creature comforts) are in store for the future.

    Another reason is that and for our long-term survival. As it stands, all of humanity’s eggs are in one small basket called “Earth”. It is only a matter of time before something happens to our planet that is so devastating that it changes the course of life as we know it. Whether the disaster is natural, like a rogue comet, or self-inflicted, like nuclear war or man-made climate change, it is possible that our home will no longer be habitable. If our planet is not habitable, we could not live here and so, without a second planet, we will be extinct. What happens, then, to all of the accomplishments of the last thousand generations of humans? All of our art, our music, our literature, our science, even our very genes could be wiped out. Unless, of course, there are a few humans living elsewhere in the solar system. Space exploration and colonization of the Moon and Mars are an insurance policy for humanity and all of our achievements. 

    A final point, for now, is that it could help relations with other countries. "Large space exploration projects are almost always the result of international cooperation. The International Space Station is the most obvious example, but the space shuttle regularly has astronauts from other nations, and many robotic missions include instruments built by teams in other countries. As NASA gears up to return to the moon, precursor missions from JapanIndiaChina, and Russia are already in orbit, are planned, or are under construction. Future human Mars missions will almost certainly involve multiple space agencies to spread the cost among several nations." https://martianchronicles.wordpress.com/2008/04/16/nine-good-reasons-for-space-exploration/

    I could either have the future pass me or l could create it. 

    “We are all born ignorant, but one must work hard to remain .” - Benjamin Franklin  So flat Earthers, man-made climate change deniers, and just science deniers.

    I friended myself! 
  • someone234someone234 647 Pts   -  
    @Pogue I am not a flat-Earther, even if the Earth was flat it would be something no one could prove or deduce.and additionally it makes no sense to think anything is 'flat' in the first place given how quantum physics works.
    Pogue
  • someone234someone234 647 Pts   -  
    Everything 'creates jobs and opportunities' it's about what creates the best jobs and best opportunities not 'the most' and even on quantity this isn't the winner.
  • PoguePogue 584 Pts   -  
    @someone234
    Um, I do not care about that. You just do not debunk the points. It is also irrelevant. 
    I could either have the future pass me or l could create it. 

    “We are all born ignorant, but one must work hard to remain .” - Benjamin Franklin  So flat Earthers, man-made climate change deniers, and just science deniers.

    I friended myself! 
  • someone234someone234 647 Pts   -  
    @Pogue Your points included proving the Earth is round.
  • PoguePogue 584 Pts   -  
    @Pogue Your points included proving the Earth is round.
    Exploration did help do that. We had observations that confirmed it way before but a picture helps (if they are willing to believe it). 
    I could either have the future pass me or l could create it. 

    “We are all born ignorant, but one must work hard to remain .” - Benjamin Franklin  So flat Earthers, man-made climate change deniers, and just science deniers.

    I friended myself! 
  • PoguePogue 584 Pts   -  
    Everything 'creates jobs and opportunities' it's about what creates the best jobs and best opportunities not 'the most' and even on quantity this isn't the winner.
    It does not matter if other things do, it is just a benefit to the countless others.
    I could either have the future pass me or l could create it. 

    “We are all born ignorant, but one must work hard to remain .” - Benjamin Franklin  So flat Earthers, man-made climate change deniers, and just science deniers.

    I friended myself! 
  • NopeNope 397 Pts   -   edited March 2018
    Pogue said:
    Nope said:
    Humans should invest more in space exploration. They should start by landing people on the moon again where they can set up a moon base similarly to bases that may be made on mars. This way if something goes wrong they will no before they are not close to home. Many more expiremnets can also be performed on the moon. Mars is also a good destination. Their are also near by comets and asteroids that should be considered as exploration destinations (I still wan't to be the first trillion air).
    What type of experiments and is there any other reason we should do it? Not to be rude, but you should fix your grammar. 
    I am unable to find my grammar mistakes. What are my grammar mistakes?
  • PoguePogue 584 Pts   -  
    @Nope Mars should be capitalized. It is experiments. You also used the wrong form of there. You said "their" while it should be "there". "Near by" should be "nearby". Finally, it should be "want".
    Nope
    I could either have the future pass me or l could create it. 

    “We are all born ignorant, but one must work hard to remain .” - Benjamin Franklin  So flat Earthers, man-made climate change deniers, and just science deniers.

    I friended myself! 
  • PoguePogue 584 Pts   -  
    Nope said:
    Pogue said:
    Nope said:
    Humans should invest more in space exploration. They should start by landing people on the moon again where they can set up a moon base similarly to bases that may be made on mars. This way if something goes wrong they will no before they are not close to home. Many more expiremnets can also be performed on the moon. Mars is also a good destination. Their are also near by comets and asteroids that should be considered as exploration destinations (I still wan't to be the first trillion air).
    What type of experiments and is there any other reason we should do it? Not to be rude, but you should fix your grammar. 
    I am unable to find my grammar mistakes. What is my grammar mistake?
    Also, it is mistakes not mistake and so it should be are, not is. 
    Nope
    I could either have the future pass me or l could create it. 

    “We are all born ignorant, but one must work hard to remain .” - Benjamin Franklin  So flat Earthers, man-made climate change deniers, and just science deniers.

    I friended myself! 
  • someone234someone234 647 Pts   -  
    @Pogue Wong. If other things are going to create as many jobs and opportunities and be more guaranteed in other benefits, they are more worth investment.
  • PoguePogue 584 Pts   -  
    @Pogue Wong. If other things are going to create as many jobs and opportunities and be more guaranteed in other benefits, they are more worth investment.
    But them creating more jobs does not outweigh the other benefits of space exploration and it creating jobs. Also, you have never given any evidence on what creates more jobs. 
    I could either have the future pass me or l could create it. 

    “We are all born ignorant, but one must work hard to remain .” - Benjamin Franklin  So flat Earthers, man-made climate change deniers, and just science deniers.

    I friended myself! 
  • someone234someone234 647 Pts   -  
    @Pogue Investing in space exploration takes money away form investing in other things. 600 billion is not some disposable income lol
    Pogue
  • PoguePogue 584 Pts   -  
    @Pogue Investing in space exploration takes money away form investing in other things. 600 billion is not some disposable income lol
    Investing in space exploration and it, in general, has always led to technological advancements that helped the human race. I never said it was. I just gave a video that showed what NASA could do with $600,000,000,000. So again I must repost it. 
    "Undoubtedly, space exploration has answered the question of whether the Earth is round or not and proved that the Earth does revolve around the sun (and not the other way around). But it does much more than that: it gives people a deeper insight into the universe and provides them with more information about the world they live in. It helps them realize that their problems aren’t really that debilitating in the grand scheme of things while reminding them of how fortunate they are to be part of the vast and majestic universe."

    Here are the jobs and economy. No. It was that space travel and exploration has always led to technological advancements and it could be used in medicine. 
    Here are 20 inventions we would not have without it.
    https://www.jpl.nasa.gov/infographics/infographic.view.php?id=11358

    Another advantage is that it creates jobs and opportunities which can be taxed to fund the space agencies and other programs and more people can have more money which means (likely) that since they did not have that money before (poor/middle-class) they would spend it in the economy. 
    "Space exploration doesn’t just involve scientist and astronauts; it also requires the skills and labor of many engineers, research assistants, technicians, mechanics, and other professionals. If space exploration would be stopped today, these people would become jobless, and they won’t have the means to support themselves and their families.

    The good thing about this is that space exploration programs show no signs of stopping, and they’re expected to get bigger in the coming years. This means that more jobs would be created, which can significantly help with the employment problems that many countries face." https://futureofworking.com/7-advantages-and-disadvantages-of-space-exploration/

    Technological advancement. The technology developed for space exploration has and will continue to extend to myriad other things. Image processing moved from the moon to the medical field, and technological advancements in cancer treatment, solar panels, lightweight materials, digital data storage, water purification, and satellite communication systems have all come from space programs and exploration. Not to mention memory foam! Who knows what sort of incredible advancements (and creature comforts) are in store for the future.

    Another reason is that and for our long-term survival. As it stands, all of humanity’s eggs are in one small basket called “Earth”. It is only a matter of time before something happens to our planet that is so devastating that it changes the course of life as we know it. Whether the disaster is natural, like a rogue comet, or self-inflicted, like nuclear war or man-made climate change, it is possible that our home will no longer be habitable. If our planet is not habitable, we could not live here and so, without a second planet, we will be extinct. What happens, then, to all of the accomplishments of the last thousand generations of humans? All of our art, our music, our literature, our science, even our very genes could be wiped out. Unless, of course, there are a few humans living elsewhere in the solar system. Space exploration and colonization of the Moon and Mars are an insurance policy for humanity and all of our achievements. 

    A final point, for now, is that it could help relations with other countries. "Large space exploration projects are almost always the result of international cooperation. The International Space Station is the most obvious example, but the space shuttle regularly has astronauts from other nations, and many robotic missions include instruments built by teams in other countries. As NASA gears up to return to the moon, precursor missions from JapanIndiaChina, and Russia are already in orbit, are planned, or are under construction. Future human Mars missions will almost certainly involve multiple space agencies to spread the cost among several nations." https://martianchronicles.wordpress.com/2008/04/16/nine-good-reasons-for-space-exploration/

    I could either have the future pass me or l could create it. 

    “We are all born ignorant, but one must work hard to remain .” - Benjamin Franklin  So flat Earthers, man-made climate change deniers, and just science deniers.

    I friended myself! 
  • someone234someone234 647 Pts   -  
    @Pogue Is there not some rule by Aaron to not spam like this?
  • PoguePogue 584 Pts   -  
    @someone234
    I asked him if I could keep posting the same post if it is not debunked and he said yes. 
    I could either have the future pass me or l could create it. 

    “We are all born ignorant, but one must work hard to remain .” - Benjamin Franklin  So flat Earthers, man-made climate change deniers, and just science deniers.

    I friended myself! 
  • someone234someone234 647 Pts   -  
    @Pogue Even people who agree with you are going to find your tactic quite pathetic.

    I'm done talking to a troll.
  • PoguePogue 584 Pts   -  
    @someone234
    What tactic? How am I a troll? You are not debunking my arguments and you only attack a little part of it. When you do that, it is terrible and I debunk it. So, I have to repost it. 
    I could either have the future pass me or l could create it. 

    “We are all born ignorant, but one must work hard to remain .” - Benjamin Franklin  So flat Earthers, man-made climate change deniers, and just science deniers.

    I friended myself! 
  • someone234someone234 647 Pts   -  
    @Pogue Except you don't, you can bring up other points if you want but you do not need to paste what you already said.
  • PoguePogue 584 Pts   -  
    @someone234
    But you are not responding to it. Just ignoring it. So, I have to paste. 
    I could either have the future pass me or l could create it. 

    “We are all born ignorant, but one must work hard to remain .” - Benjamin Franklin  So flat Earthers, man-made climate change deniers, and just science deniers.

    I friended myself! 
  • someone234someone234 647 Pts   -  
    @Pogue You are trying to prove that space exploration and space research has benefits, it does yes just like Nazi Germany had which was the completely correct analogy I raised.

    Having benefits completely ignores weighing benefits of one against another and also ignores weighing against the cons (which include what you could spend the budget portions on instead)
  • PoguePogue 584 Pts   -  
    @Pogue You are trying to prove that space exploration and space research has benefits, it does yes just like Nazi Germany had which was the completely correct analogy I raised.

    Having benefits completely ignores weighing benefits of one against another and also ignores weighing against the cons (which include what you could spend the budget portions on instead)
    However, you have not provided any evidence except for bare assertions with nothing to back it up and saying alien overlords
    I could either have the future pass me or l could create it. 

    “We are all born ignorant, but one must work hard to remain .” - Benjamin Franklin  So flat Earthers, man-made climate change deniers, and just science deniers.

    I friended myself! 
  • PoguePogue 584 Pts   -  
    @Pogue You are trying to prove that space exploration and space research has benefits, it does yes just like Nazi Germany had which was the completely correct analogy I raised.

    Having benefits completely ignores weighing benefits of one against another and also ignores weighing against the cons (which include what you could spend the budget portions on instead)
    No, it is not! If it is correct, you are saying that space agencies kill millions of people. You have given no evidence on why it is bad. 
    I could either have the future pass me or l could create it. 

    “We are all born ignorant, but one must work hard to remain .” - Benjamin Franklin  So flat Earthers, man-made climate change deniers, and just science deniers.

    I friended myself! 
  • someone234someone234 647 Pts   -  
    @Pogue in time you will learn a lot about the world and it won't be nice what you discover.

    They sent innocent dogs to be suffocated in space when experimenting what lack of gravity can do to a being.

    They would sooner rape your family, make you watch it, kill you slowly, revive you and do it again and again to make the slightest improvement in research rather than leave you in peace and make no improvement in research.

    There is no mercy in the mind of highly ambitious scientists, this is true in space research as much as psychology, physiology and basically anything at all in science. Even physicists get brutal when it comes to claiming copyright on the idea (Newton didn't discover gravity and bullied the apprentice of his who came up with it to stay silent by threatening to fire him for something he didn't do).

    You have A LOT to learn about the world if you think science is in any way kind or a good thing for humanity. It always comes at a brutal price and space research is merciless as it comes. The mission always comes first, the people suffocating is worth nothing, the discovery of some new dust on the moon is worth everything.

    I'll tell you and NASA both to your faces, you are horrible people when it comes down to it, you see everyone as a means to an end but that's so hypocritical as you justify it saying "it's to help humanity" which you clearly don't care about.
    Pogue
  • NopeNope 397 Pts   -  
    someone234
    Their are ethical guideline regulations in place which protect people. Also how can one know how and what the other people think. How does NASA not care about humanity? You are making some extreme claims. These claims should be supported by evidence. They did not send dogs to be suffocated in space. That is ridicules. The may have wanted to see how gravity effects them but they were not like "lets get dogs and send them in to space so we can see them suffocate." 
    Pogue
  • someone234someone234 647 Pts   -  
    @Nope They only used dogs because monkeys had too many rights.
  • PoguePogue 584 Pts   -  
    @Nope They only used dogs because monkeys had too many rights.
    False. We have sent chimps and monkeys to space. 

    @Pogue in time you will learn a lot about the world and it won't be nice what you discover.

    They sent innocent dogs to be suffocated in space when experimenting what lack of gravity can do to a being.

    They would sooner rape your family, make you watch it, kill you slowly, revive you and do it again and again to make the slightest improvement in research rather than leave you in peace and make no improvement in research.

    There is no mercy in the mind of highly ambitious scientists, this is true in space research as much as psychology, physiology and basically anything at all in science. Even physicists get brutal when it comes to claiming copyright on the idea (Newton didn't discover gravity and bullied the apprentice of his who came up with it to stay silent by threatening to fire him for something he didn't do).

    You have A LOT to learn about the world if you think science is in any way kind or a good thing for humanity. It always comes at a brutal price and space research is merciless as it comes. The mission always comes first, the people suffocating is worth nothing, the discovery of some new dust on the moon is worth everything.

    I'll tell you and NASA both to your faces, you are horrible people when it comes down to it, you see everyone as a means to an end but that's so hypocritical as you justify it saying "it's to help humanity" which you clearly don't care about.
    I do know the world is not a nice place so there is nothing to discover. 
    Appeal to emotion fallacy. We needed it to test how it will affect humans. Without it, we would not know how medicines would help us or if they are good. 
    What? 
    Do you have evidence? I have evidence that he invented the theory. https://sciencing.com/first-person-discover-gravity-23003.html https://www.newscientist.com/blogs/culturelab/2010/01/newtons-apple-the-real-story.html
    It is a good thing. It allows us to understand things about our universe, invent new technology and medicine. The people willing do it and on Apollo 13, you know the one that exploded, the astronauts were trying to be helped.
    Why am I a horrible person? Ad-hominem fallacy. You have not proven how science does not help people or why I do not care about humanity. A lot of scientists do the job to learn about the universe and to help humanity. 

    Like nope said, there are guidelines that must be followed to do a test. 
    I could either have the future pass me or l could create it. 

    “We are all born ignorant, but one must work hard to remain .” - Benjamin Franklin  So flat Earthers, man-made climate change deniers, and just science deniers.

    I friended myself! 
  • someone234someone234 647 Pts   -  
    @Pogue Yes, and there was an outrage about it so they used dogs instead.
  • PoguePogue 584 Pts   -  
    @Pogue Yes, and there was an outrage about it so they used dogs instead.
    So. You also seem to not have addressed my previous counter argument and my points before. We used to do it so that we can see if something works so we do not put humans in harm's way. "Instead of sending people up in such a risky situation, the United States and Russia sent monkeys, chimps, dogs and other animals into space in order to analyze such effects.

    Unfortunately, since it was so early on in the space race, the design process for constructing the vehicles was trial and error -- if launches or reentry procedures were faulty, the animals had little chances of survival"  https://science.howstuffworks.com/dead-animals-in-space.htm.

    Despite this, space exploration has led to numerous advancements that benefit humans. The cons are very minimal. 

    I could either have the future pass me or l could create it. 

    “We are all born ignorant, but one must work hard to remain .” - Benjamin Franklin  So flat Earthers, man-made climate change deniers, and just science deniers.

    I friended myself! 
  • someone234someone234 647 Pts   -   edited March 2018
    @Pogue The cons are directly severe ethically and in what we encourage aliens to do to us in retaliation.

    On top of that, the indirect cons of wasting budget on the least important research at present are very significant.
  • NopeNope 397 Pts   -  
    @Pogue The cons are directly severe ethically and in what we encourage aliens to do to us in retaliation.

    On top of that, the indirect cons of wasting budget on the least important research at present are very significant.
    What makes space exploration the least important research present? Researcher on stuff like hair products and testing them on animals seems less important the gaining new technology and resources that are not common or don't yet exist. 
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