I support same sex marriage after reviewing the evidence for it. Here is why.

with_all_humility

Mr_Bombastic said:

@with_all_humility
I believe you are replying to the wrong person.

Sorry, I do that a lot to you.  I deeply apologize.

with_all_humility

@etgang5

What fallacy did I commit in my response?

Joeseph

@ethang5

Really , I asked were you the poster of this debate and your reply .......Yes I am. You defined assertion for me. I did not ask for a definition. I asked what assertions you thought I had made, and why Jesus had anything to do with them. 


It appears you’re not exactly the “ sharpest “ tool in the box 

keithprosser

I take the view that homosexuality is defined as a sin in Christian doctrine.   But eating pork is defined as a sin in Judaism, but that doesn't mean eating pork has to be legally prohibited.

No one is forcing gays to marry - certainly not Christian gays.  I'm sympathetic to theological arguments why a church may refuse to perform gay weddings but i don't see any good reason to deny secular gay weddings.

ethang5

@Joeseph

OK. When you can debate, let us know.

Joeseph

@ethang5

ok , when you make up your mind who you are let us know 

Erfisflat

Joeseph said:

@ethang5

ok , when you make up your mind who you are let us know 

ethang5 said:

@Joeseph

OK. When you can debate, let us know.

You guys are getting married? Or at least a room?

dbox

Homosexuality is a sin first and foremost because it misrepresents Christ the groom and the Church His bride. The foundation for our understanding of this is Pauls statement in Ephesians 5: 32 (in the context of 22-33) that marriage refers to Christ and the Church. The biblical definition of marriage is defined by God's institution of it, namely, "The LORD God said, 'It is not good that man should be alone; I will make a helper fit for him...The rib that the LORD God had taken from the man he made into a woman and brought her to the man. THen the man said. 'This, at last, is bone of my bone and flesh of my flesh; she shall be called Woman, for she was taken out of Man. Therefore a man shall leave his father and mother and hold fast to his wife, and they shall become one flesh. And the man and his wife...'" (Genesis 2:18-25). This is reaffirmed as the definition of marriage in Matthew 19 by Jesus, and expounded by Paul in Ephesians 5. There is no justification to say that marriage can mean anything else as the designer of marriage, God, defined it at its founding. 

Joeseph

@Ersflat ;

Well I think he /she , it has multiple personalities so I might get three for the price of one 

dbox

@MayCaesar

I seriously doubt that Jesus would be against a same-sex marriage even at his time, let alone nowadays. It is another matter that in Christianity Jesus was merely a prophet, not the authority, and his views may have differed from those of the God on some matters.

1. Jesus affirmed marriage as between a man and a woman (Matthew 19) as it was instituted in the beginning with Adam and Eve (Genesis 2). 
2. Jesus is God, so His views could not have differed from Gods

John_C_87

keithprosser said:

I don't think there is much doubt that homosexuality is defined as a sin in Christianity, The question is whether it should therefore be a secular crime.  Blurring the distinction between 'sin' and 'crime' is the mark of a theocracy; keeping them distinct is the sign of the proper seperation of church and state.

That is to say the state cannot define what is a sin and the church cannot define what is a crime.

Tampering with a witness is a sin.

Okay there are a couple of problems here when publicly plagiarizing marriage for any reason. In essence that is one issue that has been set by civil action. Plagiarizing a longstanding likely-hood of marriage. The first crime that is occurring is a public witness is forced to committing perjury by the filers of a new public likely-hood. The objection of most witness though often religious is still incidental to a crime which effects a person’s right to vote a crime like perjury. A crime that though is hard to prove, and is most often only caught by the confession of those who are telling the lie on official document, or process. Can actually only make an admission unless they know they have been forced to tell the lie as a witness.

 If fact of common defense is hidden by such things as a use of religious sin, if the covering of civil accusations of slander as gay and lesbian are accusations as well as admission. Additional crimes outside of fraud relating to plagiarism used by council to assuming natural powers defined by the united state of marriage.

Vaulk

YeshuaBought said:

https://www.gaychristian101.com/ I put this in the religion section because I will be discussing religion as well as politics. I met with my job coach today who quote sounded like he was gay. He is a human, so he should have legal protections for his God given rights. I am bisexual, and knew I was different when I was about 13. I did not choose to be this way, and the consenting adult human I happen to love is between my spouse and the person officiating my wedding and Jesus. Marriage is a human right. Why should I feel unsafe or dirty because of the adult that consents to marry me. Show me your objections, every last one of them, and I will disprove them with facts, evidence, and logic. Don't believe me, believe the link I have provided, and review further evidence I will provide for you. I am addressing Jews and my fellow Christians, but will engage anyone who wants to speak with me. One final question: If I am wrong, is God cruel that He would cast me into Hell forever that i am unable to refute the evidence I have read and watched? No. Jesus is a loving God and He knows that I am not. Please click the link I have provided as my introductory evidence, an no lying or attacking anyone, please. Just be respectful, and present your views.

So, here we go.

1. Being a Human being does not justify legal protection for anything, if it did then every Human Being on the planet would have legal protection.  Disprove me.

2. God given rights are rights that are guaranteed by God...being Homosexual is not one of those rights as specified by the word of God.  Disprove me.

3. Marriage is not a Human Right, if it was then a 10 year old child could marry a 30 year old adult.  Disprove me.

4. Attempting to place an adjective like "Cruel" onto an ethereal, supernatural being who exists above and beyond the laws of nature and society, whom we know almost nothing about (Knowing and believing are two different things) is undermining your argument and outlining exactly what you know (Or in this case...don't know) about God.  I'm not a Bible thumping, holier than thou religious freak but I know enough about the Bible to determine that God isn't subject to our rules, opinions or judgments.  So then I'll leave you with this, do you truly believe that God is subject to our Human interpretation of what is or isn't cruel?  If God says "Don't do that" and we do it anyway and justify it with the reasoning "But it feels good"...do we supersede God's will with our Human reasoning?

1 Corinthians, 6-9 (New Testament): Or do you not know that wrongdoers will not inherit the kingdom of God? Do not be deceived: Neither the sexually immoral nor idolaters nor adulterers nor men who have sex with men[a] 10 nor thieves nor the greedy nor drunkards nor slanderers nor swindlers will inherit the kingdom of God.

Also:

YeshuaBought said:

Prove it using the KJV or NRSV. 

NRSV: 9 Do you not know that wrongdoers will not inherit the kingdom of God? Do not be deceived! Fornicators, idolaters, adulterers, male prostitutes, sodomites, 10 thieves, the greedy, drunkards, revilers, robbers—none of these will inherit the kingdom of God. 11 And this is what some of you used to be. But you were washed, you were sanctified, you were justified in the name of the Lord Jesus Christ and in the Spirit of our God.

A Sodomite is someone who engages in sodomy.  So if God says that engaging in Sodomy will disqualify you from Heaven...what does that mean?  Unless you're going to tell me that Gay Men in a sexual relationship somehow DON'T sodomize each other then here is your proof in NRSV as you requested.  Being a Gay Man and committing sodomy equals no heaven.

Ampersand

Vaulk said:

YeshuaBought said:

https://www.gaychristian101.com/ I put this in the religion section because I will be discussing religion as well as politics. I met with my job coach today who quote sounded like he was gay. He is a human, so he should have legal protections for his God given rights. I am bisexual, and knew I was different when I was about 13. I did not choose to be this way, and the consenting adult human I happen to love is between my spouse and the person officiating my wedding and Jesus. Marriage is a human right. Why should I feel unsafe or dirty because of the adult that consents to marry me. Show me your objections, every last one of them, and I will disprove them with facts, evidence, and logic. Don't believe me, believe the link I have provided, and review further evidence I will provide for you. I am addressing Jews and my fellow Christians, but will engage anyone who wants to speak with me. One final question: If I am wrong, is God cruel that He would cast me into Hell forever that i am unable to refute the evidence I have read and watched? No. Jesus is a loving God and He knows that I am not. Please click the link I have provided as my introductory evidence, an no lying or attacking anyone, please. Just be respectful, and present your views.

So, here we go.

1. Being a Human being does not justify legal protection for anything, if it did then every Human Being on the planet would have legal protection.  Disprove me.

2. God given rights are rights that are guaranteed by God...being Homosexual is not one of those rights as specified by the word of God.  Disprove me.

3. Marriage is not a Human Right, if it was then a 10 year old child could marry a 30 year old adult.  Disprove me.

4. Attempting to place an adjective like "Cruel" onto an ethereal, supernatural being who exists above and beyond the laws of nature and society, whom we know almost nothing about (Knowing and believing are two different things) is undermining your argument and outlining exactly what you know (Or in this case...don't know) about God.  I'm not a Bible thumping, holier than thou religious freak but I know enough about the Bible to determine that God isn't subject to our rules, opinions or judgments.  So then I'll leave you with this, do you truly believe that God is subject to our Human interpretation of what is or isn't cruel?  If God says "Don't do that" and we do it anyway and justify it with the reasoning "But it feels good"...do we supersede God's will with our Human reasoning?

1 Corinthians, 6-9 (New Testament): Or do you not know that wrongdoers will not inherit the kingdom of God? Do not be deceived: Neither the sexually immoral nor idolaters nor adulterers nor men who have sex with men[a] 10 nor thieves nor the greedy nor drunkards nor slanderers nor swindlers will inherit the kingdom of God.

Also:

YeshuaBought said:

Prove it using the KJV or NRSV. 

NRSV: 9 Do you not know that wrongdoers will not inherit the kingdom of God? Do not be deceived! Fornicators, idolaters, adulterers, male prostitutes, sodomites, 10 thieves, the greedy, drunkards, revilers, robbers—none of these will inherit the kingdom of God. 11 And this is what some of you used to be. But you were washed, you were sanctified, you were justified in the name of the Lord Jesus Christ and in the Spirit of our God.

A Sodomite is someone who engages in sodomy.  So if God says that engaging in Sodomy will disqualify you from Heaven...what does that mean?  Unless you're going to tell me that Gay Men in a sexual relationship somehow DON'T sodomize each other then here is your proof in NRSV as you requested.  Being a Gay Man and committing sodomy equals no heaven.

Phone posting at the moment but lol, just had to point out the existence of universal human rights and legal protections, including the right for "Men and women of full age, without any limitation due to race, nationality or religion, have the right to marry and to found a family. They are entitled to equal rights as to marriage, during marriage and at its dissolution" under article 16 of the Universal Declaration of Human Rights.

Vaulk

Right: A moral or legal entitlement to have or do something.

Universal: Relating to or done by all people or things in the world or in a particular group; applicable to all cases.

So then I'm to believe that children in Mexico between the ages of Ten and Seventeen are in possession of these "Universal legal protections" that protect them from being coerced into sexual intercourse despite it being perfectly legal there?  I also have to ask...exactly who or what organization is universally administering these "Universal legal protections" to the children in Mexico or any of the other numerous locations in the world where child sex is perfectly legal.

Writing the words "Human Rights and Protections are universal" does not make it so...no matter who or how many sign their name under it.

ethang5

I support same sex marriage after reviewing the evidence for it. Here is why.

Did you post the "evidence" in invisible font? I saw none.

Zombieguy1987

Mr_Bombastic said:

@YeshuaBought

You cannot be a Christian. It's impossible. You're bisexual. Scripture calls homosexuality an abomination unto God. Yes, I know you said bisexual. They are the same thing in God's eyes. A man having sex with another man. Nope. No way you're a Christian. Repent and be saved!

Aaaaaaaaaaaannnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnndddddddddddddddddddddd... This is why religion should be abolished

Zombieguy1987

Mr_Bombastic said:

@YeshuaBought
I showed you what Scripture says about homosexuality. If you are a practicing homosexuality you cannot be a Christian. Nothing you say will ever change that. God calls homosexuality an abomination. That's a fact. Deal with it.

I do hate religion due to its backwards idea but I’m not going deny that Christianity is one of the most homophobic religions (only behind Islam) 

Zombieguy1987

George_Horse said:

Hmmmmm, you're Christian, yet bisexual, looks like you're not going to heaven!

"If a man lies with a male as with a woman, both of them have committed an abomination; they shall surely be put to death; their blood is upon them. (Leviticus 20:13)" 

Who would win?
A religion?
Or
A meme?

John_C_87

All same gender Marriages are saying in writing is by basic principle there is support for criminal fraud publicly. Any-one who likes people of same gender, still can be united by a state of marriage to a person of the opposite gender to produce off-spring who will be a citizen of a nation. This would require two licensed and not one as the union made by couple of any gender are in whole truth corporations already by description of law.

Evidence. I will take you seriously when you post an affidavit signed by some-one of state authority such as a governor, or political governess granting immunity the act of perjury with my name listed on it. The judicial separation process also allows people to object on the grounds a public accusation of Gay and Lesbian are acts of slander under law, this negates marriage by law as precedent. Binivir, UnosMulier, Civil union, and Marriage are nothing more than witness accounts of independent observation made for the legal use without prejudice. Impartial.