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The Border Wall will be the worst decision by a U.S President in history
in Immigration

124»


Arguments

  • @Applesauce ;

    No we don't. The issue that is to be address by Wall has little to do with a Nations border security. It is directly connected to a ongoing Congressional World War. The Drug War. 
  • War is way worse than a stupid wall, and eugenics far surpasses both.
    Zombieguy1987
  • walls have worked to keep people out. I think it is a good idea.
    Zombieguy1987DeeCYDdharta
  • DeeDee 432 Pts
    @calebsica


    American Fundies must be the biggest hypocrites going totally ignoring everything Jesus said, one thing is for sure they seem to hate everyone of the teachings of Jesus that doesn’t suit their narrow minded bigotry 

    When a stranger sojourns with you in your land, you shall not do him wrong. You shall treat the stranger who sojourns with you as the native among you, and you shall love him as yourself, for you were strangers in the land of Egypt: I am the Lord your God. - Leviticus 19:33-34.


    I will be a swift witness against... those who oppress the hired worker in his wages, the widow and the fatherless, against ... those who thrust aside the sojourner, and do not fear me, says the Lord of hosts. Malachi 3:5.


    CYDdhartaZombieguy1987
  • John_C_87John_C_87 149 Pts
    CYDdharta said:
    Or land in a flat field... In which you can then escape without detection...

    Negative, you're not going to land that plane in any old field.  That plane needs a landing strip.
    Well all you need is a privately owned airstrip to land on and it's legal. If there is a group wealthy enough to afford a plane and run a business of smuggling illegals, they can probably afford to buy land out in the desert somewhere. 

    @WordsMatter ;


    Hang glider...….. Parasailing
  • Maybe Trump should give up on the wall.  Instead, he should put up a monument to Angel Families ... all along the border, and make it 30' high.
  • John_C_87John_C_87 149 Pts
    calebsica said:
    walls have worked to keep people out. I think it is a good idea.

    @calebsica ;
    No walls have worked at keeping people in and that is only with the addition of armed guards. A canal connects the Gulf to the Pacific Ocean. The Canal can also be used to generate electric, desalinate water, and accommodate resolution to many nation security issues. 
  • ethang5ethang5 140 Pts
    @CYDdharta

    >That explains why there are no gated communities in the US.  Oh, wait, ALL of the highest end properties in the US are in gates communities. 

    Finally someone said what should be bloody obvious.

    How many of these immigrants can afford a 25 foot ladder? How easy is it to travel with a ladder that long?

    After you climb up 30 feet, how do you get down on the other side? Pull the ladder up as you balance on the wall? The wall has slats, so jumpers risk being seen.

    No security is 100%, but a wall will deter many, and slow down the rest. And how much maintenance does a steel wall need?

    The people against the wall just need to be honest and admit they do not want borders.

    Except around their home though. They understand walls quite well then.
  • mickygmickyg 82 Pts
    i drove from san diego to arizona on march 3 2019 on I-8...the two immigration checkpoints were CLOSED....HOW IS THIS AN EMERGENCY except for sundays....trumps followers are idiots..
    Zombieguy1987CYDdharta
  • searsear 104 Pts
     Z1 originally posted:

    I consider it unlikely that those are the exact words spoken in both cases. But if so it may be another case of Trump plagiarism.
    In any case I don't recall President Clinton advocating building a great great wall on our Southern border, and causing the longest U.S. federal shutdown in history to coerce MOC to bend to expending $Billions for it.
    "I will build a great, great wall on our Southern border. And I will have Mexico pay for that wall, mark my words." Republican primary presidential candidate Donald J. Trump 15/06/16 www.DonaldJTrump.com

  • DylanDylan 37 Pts
    I strongly disagree, I think the wall is a good idea. Many people seem to think that the plan is to just build a wall and leave it there, hoping that will completely solve the problem. However, the wall is not the only part of the plan Donald Trump has proposed to combat the issue of illegal immigration contrary to popular belief. It's not going to be a completely unprotected wall just sitting there waiting to be climbed, there will be people monitoring it at various different checkpoints along the wall to check for things such as people trying to climb over it. At the moment, we currently have hundreds if not thousands of miles of land completely open and unprotected with absolutely nothing stopping someone from crossing the border onto our soil without any regulation or documentation. That needs to change. We deserve to know who is coming into our country and the ideas that Trump has proposed are necessary steps that need to be taken to secure our border, we don't want just ANYBODY to have the ability to be able to just flood into our country freely with nothing preventing them from doing so.

    For starters, illegal immigrants cost taxpayers 116 billion dollars annually just by being here according to an analysis done by the Federation for American Immigration Reform (FAIR). Our legal citizens should not have to pay that for people that people who came here illegally and have no business being here in the first place, they knowingly broke the law to get here. 

    Also, it's completely unfair to legal immigrants. They respect the law and play by the rules to get here and become a citizen LEGALLY, this can sometimes take years. Illegal immigrants completely disregard the law and sneak through the border while legitimate immigrants willingly go through all of that and respect the law, that is unfair to them. Illegal immigrants also overburden our immigration system, making it even more difficult for someone to immigrate here legally.

    There is also a disproportionate amount of crime committed by illegal immigrants, people like that should not be able to just freely flood through the border with nothing stopping them from doing so or without any sort of documentation. Again, we deserve to know just who is coming into our country and we don't want people like that getting in here. Something I often hear in response to a statement like this is "Racist! You're saying all Mexicans are criminals!", but that's just simply not the case. It's not an issue about race, it's about taking steps to combat the issue of illegal immigration which breeds problems such as the disproportionate amount of crime committed by illegal immigrants who have no business being here in the first place and the cost footed to taxpayers each year just by being here.

    I'd also like to quickly address the visa overstays issue. Roughly 40% of undocumented immigrants are due to visa overstays, but that still leaves 60% of illegal immigrants crossing through the border illegally to get here with very little stopping them from doing so. We need to take steps to prevent that, like the plans Trump has put forth which include improving cyber security for the overstayed visas problem. 

    If you look at Israel, it's evident that walls do indeed work. The number of illegals crossing the Israel-Egypt border dropped after the construction of the barrier from more than 16,000 in 2011 to less than 20 in 2016. That is a 99 percent decrease, the results speak for themselves and we should follow in their footsteps. 

    A lot of people seem to think the biggest problem with the wall is the cost, that it isn't economically feasible. In terms of estimates as to how much the wall would cost to build, there have been different numbers thrown out there from as little as $8 billion to $70 billion. However, most estimates I see are roughly $20 billion. Our annual budget is is 4 trillion dollars, which makes up only 20% of U.S economy so the cost of the wall really isn't much in comparison to our annual budget or economy. The cost of the wall is comparable to the annual budget of NASA, which clocks in around $21 billion. That's practically nothing in comparison the annual budget of the U.S, so yes the wall is indeed economically feasible. 

    Would the wall completely solve the problem and stop all illegal immigration? No one is saying that, it's just reasonable to believe that it could have a significant impact and it would greatly benefit us to take steps in that direction. 

    References & Sources:
    https://www.fairus.org/issue/publications-resources/fiscal-burden-illegal-immigration-united-states-taxpayers
    https://www.foxnews.com/opinion/trumps-border-wall-how-much-it-will-actually-cost-according-to-a-statistician
    https://www.litwinlaw.com/Articles/How-Long-Does-it-Take-to-Immigrate-to-the-United-States.shtml
    https://travel.state.gov/content/travel/en/us-visas/immigrate/the-immigrant-visa-process.html
    https://cis.org/Camarota/NonCitizens-Committed-Disproportionate-Share-Federal-Crimes-201116
    https://www.nbcnews.com/news/latino/visa-overstays-outnumber-illegal-border-crossings-trend-expected-continue-n730216
    https://www.hsgac.senate.gov/media/majority-media/chairman-johnson-releases-report-on-israeli-homeland-security-and-applicable-lessons-for-the-united-states
    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Budget_of_NASA
    CYDdharta
  • edited May 21


    Honestly speaking, I was in favour of the US border wall with Mexico to stop the movement of illegal immigrants. However, the previous crackdowns of Trump's government where they adversely arrested illegal Mexican immigrants with kids was disgusting. I remember one of the relatives of my Mexican fellow detained by officers and we were not able to find where she has been located. Later, with the help of an inmate search directory of America and from federal government inmate finder here, we tried to find her, but it was in vain. After a few weeks, finally, we got the news that where she is incarcerated. Her few years old daughter was also kept into another place without her mom. 

    On the other hand, critics say that this big wall wouldn't be a good sign for the environment and wildlife. Cost is also sounded high that is near about $24.4 million per mile. You can read more about from this article here. All in all, in my opinion, instead of a wall, the Government should think to build a proper mechanism to control the security issues at Mexican borders.  
  • RyanHoughRyanHough 71 Pts
    Illegal immigrants should be kicked out and their kids placed with LEGAL families or taken with the parents, asap, as soon as the person becomes legal they will be allowed in the U.S. the border wall is a great decision and it will prove to be effective.
    CYDdharta
  • SharkySharky 60 Pts
    Democratic opponents of a border wall seem to cite the cost of the wall frequently. Seriously? Do these Democrats not understand how effective Congressional Democrats are at wasting taxpayers' dollars? Illegal immigration is estimated by FAIR to cost US taxpayers nearly $135 billion per year. We don't even have a decent estimate of the number of illegals living in our country, hence the "11-22 million illegal immigrants in the United States" cited by TTKDB. Americans should be furious with Congress and our elected representatives should be ashamed of themselves for failing to address this problem decades ago.  

    Democrats raided and squandered the entire Social Security Trust Fund decades ago in their efforts to buy votes with government largesse. Democrats put the welfare state on steroids in 1965 and have blown well over $20 trillion on transfer payments without budging the nation's poverty rate one iota. As an added bonus, they virtually destroyed the family structure in the black community by incentivizing single motherhood, making the problem a vicious cycle of intergenerational dysfunction. It is obvious that the failure to address illegal immigration is a cynical ploy by Democrats in an attempt to turn "11-22 million illegal immigrants" into voters, not a concern for the cost or effectiveness of the wall.

    The cost of a border wall would be chump change compared to the money that Congress flushes down the toilet on an annual basis. As for the effectiveness of a wall, I will defer to the men and women of the Border Patrol to tell us whether a wall will work to stem illegal immigration and drug trafficking. It occurs to me that single individuals climbing over a 20-30 foot wall will enter the country at a much slower rate than caravans crossing on foot unfettered by any barrier, not to mention that walls can easily be designed that will thwart ladder climbers. Trucks loaded with illegal immigrants and drugs will not drive through walls. Tunnels under walls are easily detected. Finally, visa overstays are people who are known to be in the country. Anonymous caravan participants crossing the border could be anyone, including terrorists. The wall needs to be built and the country needs to get serious about controlling who enters our country. 
    CYDdharta
  • all4acttall4actt 34 Pts
    People should litsen more to the people on the frontlines of the problem.  

    Forget the president for a momment and just litsen to what the Boarder Patrol Agency has to say about the wall.

    Litsen to what they as the experts, who deal with the problem on a day to day basis.

    People including Congress need to take the politics out of it and pay attention to what they say would solve the many problems we are currently facing.  
  • all4acttall4actt 34 Pts
    By the way the personn that mentioned the cost of Obama Care.

    According to the bloomburgh report Obama Care cost 685 billion a year in subsidies.
  • I don't understand how people think a border wall will work. There are better ways to stop illegal immigration.

    Don't beleive me?



    A cheap ladder would overpower a huge border wall and make the U.S the laughstock of the world
    What do you believe is a viable solution to failed open border policies? One thing I do suggest is better foreign policies, so people don't want to come here in the first place.
  • SharkySharky 60 Pts
    For those of you who oppose building a border wall and are against treating illegal entry into our country as the criminal offense that it is, can you take a minute to answer these few questions?

    1) We don't know how many illegal immigrants are currently in our country but we do know that they are massively expensive to accommodate. How many more people should we allow in before we get serious about stopping the flow? 

    2) Billions of people from all over the world would like to gain admission to the US because their living conditions in their homelands are poor. How many should we admit on "humanitarian" grounds and how do we decide who is worthy and who isn't? 

    3) When conditions in foreign countries deteriorate to the point that their populations yearn to emigrate to the US, are US taxpayers responsible for correcting those conditions to entice people to stay in their homelands? 

    4) When it is estimated that 11-22 million illegal immigrants are in our country, and large numbers are either incarcerated or living on welfare or other government assistance, how can anyone justify making claims that the population is more law-abiding than US citizens or that people who oppose further illegal immigration are simply "racists"? 
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