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If I support Trump, am I a closet Racist?
in Politics

135


Arguments

  • Dinahj245 said: i think its not racist because at the end of the day ppl have their own opinions about everyone and its not only racist if u think of that person as a outsider alps we are all ppl 
  • @ale5 I am fine with Muslims being here, but not when they force sharia law on us and bring ISIS in.  Protectionism is the right word, not racism.
  • @SuperSith89, agreed.  Just to point out that @Vaulk really did a great job to explain in this debate that it's not racism, and that's word is often misused
    Live Long and Prosper
  • @agsr  Yeah I didn't see that before posting.  He's a very good debater.  
  • edited July 2017
    Religion is culture, and culture can't be tied to race (as anyone can adopt culture), so Trump being racist for attacking an aspect of culture is just irritating.

    And as for the Mexicans deal, that "stereotype" is factually supported around half of our illegal immigration rate.

    "They made up half of all unauthorized immigrants in 2016, according to the Center’s preliminary estimate, marking the first time in at least a decade that they did not account for a clear majority of this population."  http://www.pewresearch.org/fact-tank/2017/04/27/5-facts-about-illegal-immigration-in-the-u-s/ ;

    The article does mention a drop, but at one point the accounted for the majority! Now they're around an even split, congrats for those stellar drop rates border control.
    (By the way the rest come from the continent of Eurasia, not one country but a continent!, which makes it harder to pinpoint and eradicate the problem.)

    Look @ale5, illegal immigration is a huge problem with the potential to become an even bigger pain in our asses, and when half of  all the illegal immigrants come from one country, that's an indication of where the biggest problem lies.

    It's not a stereotype it's a fact, your friendly neighborhood abuelita, is also a national cross country master.
    CuriousGeorgeSilverishGoldNova
  • @ale5 Islam is not a race. Also it's not a full on immigration ban or "muslim ban".
  • ale5 said:
    @Vaulk, although I am still strongly against what Trump is doing regarding foreigners, I have to say that I now have a different perspective after reviewing your argument. I now understand that we shouldn't say that Trump supporters are racists.  I get your point about latinos and Muslims not being a race. That is not accurate.  So I concede.  I also just signed up for the Premium membership to support DebateIsland, and you get my very first persuaded badge.  Great debate! Very impressive.
    @SilverishGoldNova, I already conceded that point as per @Vaulk's argument.
    It's kind of fun to do the impossible
    - Walt Disney
  • @love2debate

    Coming from a Liberal-Democrat, I don't believe that Trump supporters are racist (at least not all of them).
  • Ban Mexicans? No. Ban illegals? Yes. Trump does not want to deport all Mexicans, he said he wants to deport illegal Mexicans because they are sending "rapists and drugs". Studies have shown that approximatly 80% of Central American women that cross the boarder from Mexico to USA get raped. 80%. Also its a well known fact that the illegal drug trade as ties back to Mexico. He never said he wanted to fully ban Mexicans so that's wrong. He put on a partial "Muslim Ban" which isn't really a Muslim ban because he didn't block out many countries that have a majority of Muslims. Obama had the same Muslim ban when he was in office and no one gave him crap, why the double standard? Also being Muslim means you practice the ways of Islam so it's a religion. You can't be racist against a religion. @thecomeotitor_19391
  • Trump supporters want to ban muslims and Mexicans due to stereotypes. That's racist.
    Muslims are not a race and so are Mexicans.
    Nathaniel_B
    "Is God willing to prevent evil, but not able? Then he is not omnipotent. Is he able, but not willing? Then he is malevolent. Is he both able and willing? Then whence cometh evil? Is he neither able nor willing? Then why call him God? " ~Epicurus

    "We must question the story logic of having an all-knowing all-powerful God, who creates faulty Humans, and then blames them for his own mistakes." ~Gene Roddenberry

    "A communist is like a crocodile" ~Winston Churchill
  • Simply because you want to secure the border and put Americans first doesn't make you a racist. Sorry Liberals.
    George_HorseZombieguy1987
  • @inc4t First off, When you talk about the travel ban you need to realize that in order for the government to protect the citizens of the United States it is necessary to take zero risks in regard to importing people from places that have been known to produce terrorists. Just take a look at Europe. Many of their nations have accepted vast numbers of refugees into their borders which has resulted in a rapid spike in Islamic Terror attacks and Sweden has become the rape capital of the Western World. It's certainly prudent to halt the entrance of refugees until we come up with a way to reliably put these people through a vetting process to ensure that we don't let in a large number of people that want to tear our civilization apart.
    George_Horse
  • VaulkVaulk 560 Pts
    edited September 2017
    @George_Horse

    Alright, I'll bite, so your logic is that because Trump supporters want to ban Muslims and Mexicans because of stereotypes...then that's racist.

    So then I have to ask you George, since being racist requires that you discriminate against a race of people...what Race are all Muslims? 

    Secondly, what race are all Mexicans?

    I'm curious to see you answer these questions without retracting your statement in the least.


    "If there's no such thing as a stupid question then what kind of questions do stupid people ask"?

    "There's going to be a special place in Hell for people who spread lies through the veil of logical fallacies disguised as rational argument".

    "Oh, you don't like my sarcasm?  Well I don't much appreciate your stupid".


  • Whenever one makes a choice between multiple options, they weigh the upsides and the downsides of each option against each other and choose the one for which the upsides outweigh the downsides the most, in their eyes.

    Imagine a hypothetical scenario where Bernie Sanders was running against Donald Trump, with no other viable candidates present. In this case I would support Trump over Sanders: I dislike patriotism, nationalism and racism - but I dislike statism, socialism and collectivism more. Both are incredibly poor candidates, but Trump's upsides versus downsides seem more acceptable to me than Sanders'.

    So, the answer is: not necessarily. It heavily depends on what causes you to support Trump and why.
    George_Horse
  • Vaulk said:
    @George_Horse

    Alright, I'll bite, so your logic is that because Trump supporters want to ban Muslims and Mexicans because of stereotypes...then that's racist.

    So then I have to ask you George, since being racist requires that you discriminate against a race of people...what Race are all Muslims? 

    Secondly, what race are all Mexicans?

    I'm curious to see you answer these questions without retracting your statement in the least.



    "Alright, I'll bite, so your logic is that because Trump supporters want to ban Muslims and Mexicans because of stereotypes...then that's racist."

    We're not advocating the banning of Muslims and Mexicans due to stereotypes. We do not want illegals, and we do not want terrorists, because of Europe's poor immigration system, many terrorists disguised as innocent refugees have committed many terrorist attacks. So would it be fine and logical to "let them ALL in"?

    "what Race are all Muslims?"

    Muslims are of different races, though they could be classified as white or brown (alternative "see: A category used by racialist scientists") being from different countries (North Africa, Middle East), then some being African (Black). Here are some images that I am going to include:

     

    (Green: Caucasian Race distribution after the Pleistocene)


    An Afghan man of Iranid type (classified as being part of the Caucasian race by the article and other research)

    "Secondly, what race are all Mexicans?"

    Same thing. All Mexicans are not of the same race, most would be of Hispanic origin, and some are of different backgrounds/ancestries. Not all Mexicans are Hispanic, some are white, so being against illegals and wrongdoers is not being "racist". It is as if people do not know it's actual definition anymore. The only thing that is favored by the the rational people is legal immigration, and strict screening for refugees, so we do not have a flow of unidentified people running around like barbarians and causing chaos. 


    Zombieguy1987Nathaniel_B
    "Is God willing to prevent evil, but not able? Then he is not omnipotent. Is he able, but not willing? Then he is malevolent. Is he both able and willing? Then whence cometh evil? Is he neither able nor willing? Then why call him God? " ~Epicurus

    "We must question the story logic of having an all-knowing all-powerful God, who creates faulty Humans, and then blames them for his own mistakes." ~Gene Roddenberry

    "A communist is like a crocodile" ~Winston Churchill
  • @CYDdharta and how about Richard Spencer and David Duke? You can make the claim that resists also supported Hillary, but that just means racists supported both candidates but both had some "very fine people on reach side"
  • @CYDdharta and how about Richard Spencer and David Duke? You can make the claim that resists also supported Hillary, but that just means racists supported both candidates but both had some "very fine people on reach side"

    Of course racists supported both candidates; but just because you supported one candidate or the other doesn't make you a racist.
  • I wouldn't say they are all racist, however, I would say that they are supporting someone who is racist. Trump is racist and he is not to blame. He is racist because he is ignorant and cannot empathize with people who are not like him. Everyone is ignorant in some way or another. For example, he pays Mexican workers less than minimum wage and when they retaliate, he threatens to send them back to their country. He is awkward around colored people saying things like "look at my African American right there". Who says that haha. But he has said done worse things like calling african countries a " hole" and he has refused to rent his apartment to African Americans. If he was put into the shoes of these people then he would truly understand them but he doesn't so he does not feel bad for what they go through. I have met many Trump supporters who are 100% in fact racist though, but it would be stigmatic to say all trump fans are racist.
    George_Horse
  • I wouldn't say they are all racist, however, I would say that they are supporting someone who is racist. Trump is racist and he is not to blame. He is racist because he is ignorant and cannot empathize with people who are not like him. Everyone is ignorant in some way or another. For example, he pays Mexican workers less than minimum wage and when they retaliate, he threatens to send them back to their country. He is awkward around colored people saying things like "look at my African American right there". Who says that haha. But he has said done worse things like calling african countries a " hole" and he has refused to rent his apartment to African Americans. If he was put into the shoes of these people then he would truly understand them but he doesn't so he does not feel bad for what they go through. I have met many Trump supporters who are 100% in fact racist though, but it would be stigmatic to say all trump fans are racist.
    Trump is a racist?!?  Really?!?  So they let just anyone on stage with Rosa Parks and Muhammad Ali and pass out Ellis Island Medals of Honor?



    George_Horsebeckysmith
  • I wouldn't say they are all racist, however, I would say that they are supporting someone who is racist. Trump is racist and he is not to blame. He is racist because he is ignorant and cannot empathize with people who are not like him. Everyone is ignorant in some way or another. For example, he pays Mexican workers less than minimum wage and when they retaliate, he threatens to send them back to their country. He is awkward around colored people saying things like "look at my African American right there". Who says that haha. But he has said done worse things like calling african countries a " hole" and he has refused to rent his apartment to African Americans. If he was put into the shoes of these people then he would truly understand them but he doesn't so he does not feel bad for what they go through. I have met many Trump supporters who are 100% in fact racist though, but it would be stigmatic to say all trump fans are racist.

    "I wouldn't say they are all racist, however, I would say that they are supporting someone who is racist."

    Where is your evidence/sources to support your claim?

    "But he has said done worse things like calling african countries a " hole" "

    Which has NOT been verified to be true. And even if he did say that, he would not be calling the people bad, but their countries bad. 

    Your entire argument is just a bunch of claims. 
    beckysmith
    "Is God willing to prevent evil, but not able? Then he is not omnipotent. Is he able, but not willing? Then he is malevolent. Is he both able and willing? Then whence cometh evil? Is he neither able nor willing? Then why call him God? " ~Epicurus

    "We must question the story logic of having an all-knowing all-powerful God, who creates faulty Humans, and then blames them for his own mistakes." ~Gene Roddenberry

    "A communist is like a crocodile" ~Winston Churchill
  • I wouldn't say they are all racist, however, I would say that they are supporting someone who is racist. Trump is racist and he is not to blame. He is racist because he is ignorant and cannot empathize with people who are not like him. Everyone is ignorant in some way or another. For example, he pays Mexican workers less than minimum wage and when they retaliate, he threatens to send them back to their country. He is awkward around colored people saying things like "look at my African American right there". Who says that haha. But he has said done worse things like calling african countries a " hole" and he has refused to rent his apartment to African Americans. If he was put into the shoes of these people then he would truly understand them but he doesn't so he does not feel bad for what they go through. I have met many Trump supporters who are 100% in fact racist though, but it would be stigmatic to say all trump fans are racist.

    "I wouldn't say they are all racist, however, I would say that they are supporting someone who is racist."

    Where is your evidence/sources to support your claim?

    "But he has said done worse things like calling african countries a " hole" "

    Which has NOT been verified to be true. And even if he did say that, he would not be calling the people bad, but their countries bad. 

    Your entire argument is just a bunch of claims. 
    haha are you serious? You think it is false that trump called African countries a hole? enjoy this video then 
    Im not going to waste my time finding exact videos so here are some compilations for you to enjoy :)


    If seeing and hearing the words he says in these videos don't prove to you that he is racist, then you do not understand the definition of racist. How do you explain his comment on Lebron James right after he built a school for children which includes  free breakfast, lunch, snacks and drinks, access to a fitness trainer, free bicycles, free college tuition accordingly and more. And what does trump say to commend him on doing good? He calls him dumb. You are proof that everyone is ignorant in some shape or form and I am glad to rid you of your ignorance on Trumps cultural views :) 

    George_Horse
  • CYDdharta said:
    I wouldn't say they are all racist, however, I would say that they are supporting someone who is racist. Trump is racist and he is not to blame. He is racist because he is ignorant and cannot empathize with people who are not like him. Everyone is ignorant in some way or another. For example, he pays Mexican workers less than minimum wage and when they retaliate, he threatens to send them back to their country. He is awkward around colored people saying things like "look at my African American right there". Who says that haha. But he has said done worse things like calling african countries a " hole" and he has refused to rent his apartment to African Americans. If he was put into the shoes of these people then he would truly understand them but he doesn't so he does not feel bad for what they go through. I have met many Trump supporters who are 100% in fact racist though, but it would be stigmatic to say all trump fans are racist.
    Trump is a racist?!?  Really?!?  So they let just anyone on stage with Rosa Parks and Muhammad Ali and pass out Ellis Island Medals of Honor?



    haha so? There are a lot of black, asian, and mexican people who like trump. That doesn't deny the fact that he was racist. There were jews who liked hitler, does that mean hitler was good? c'mon 
  • edited September 1
    CYDdharta said:
    I wouldn't say they are all racist, however, I would say that they are supporting someone who is racist. Trump is racist and he is not to blame. He is racist because he is ignorant and cannot empathize with people who are not like him. Everyone is ignorant in some way or another. For example, he pays Mexican workers less than minimum wage and when they retaliate, he threatens to send them back to their country. He is awkward around colored people saying things like "look at my African American right there". Who says that haha. But he has said done worse things like calling african countries a " hole" and he has refused to rent his apartment to African Americans. If he was put into the shoes of these people then he would truly understand them but he doesn't so he does not feel bad for what they go through. I have met many Trump supporters who are 100% in fact racist though, but it would be stigmatic to say all trump fans are racist.
    Trump is a racist?!?  Really?!?  So they let just anyone on stage with Rosa Parks and Muhammad Ali and pass out Ellis Island Medals of Honor?



    haha so? There are a lot of black, asian, and mexican people who like trump. That doesn't deny the fact that he was racist. There were jews who liked hitler, does that mean hitler was good? c'mon 

    A lot of prominent and politically connected Jews supported Hitler AFTER he rose to power?!?  Feel free to name them. While you're at it, name all the Jews Hitler appointed to positions of power.  This is such a load of crap.
    George_Horse
  • CYDdharta said:
    CYDdharta said:
    I wouldn't say they are all racist, however, I would say that they are supporting someone who is racist. Trump is racist and he is not to blame. He is racist because he is ignorant and cannot empathize with people who are not like him. Everyone is ignorant in some way or another. For example, he pays Mexican workers less than minimum wage and when they retaliate, he threatens to send them back to their country. He is awkward around colored people saying things like "look at my African American right there". Who says that haha. But he has said done worse things like calling african countries a " hole" and he has refused to rent his apartment to African Americans. If he was put into the shoes of these people then he would truly understand them but he doesn't so he does not feel bad for what they go through. I have met many Trump supporters who are 100% in fact racist though, but it would be stigmatic to say all trump fans are racist.
    Trump is a racist?!?  Really?!?  So they let just anyone on stage with Rosa Parks and Muhammad Ali and pass out Ellis Island Medals of Honor?



    haha so? There are a lot of black, asian, and mexican people who like trump. That doesn't deny the fact that he was racist. There were jews who liked hitler, does that mean hitler was good? c'mon 

    A lot of prominent and politically connected Jews supported Hitler AFTER he rose to power?!?  Feel free to name them. This is such a load of crap.
    I like how you ignored my first point. But I guess were talking about hitler now. If you took history class you probably heard of the Association of German National Jews which is a jewish organization who supported hitler during Nazi Germany. You can look it up if you want details. I personally see a correlation between hitler praisers and trump fans (NOT ALL OF THEM) but just the ones who don't open their eyes to what they actually stand for. 
  • I like how you ignored my first point. But I guess were talking about hitler now. If you took history class you probably heard of the Association of German National Jews which is a jewish organization who supported hitler during Nazi Germany. You can look it up if you want details. I personally see a correlation between hitler praisers and trump fans (NOT ALL OF THEM) but just the ones who don't open their eyes to what they actually stand for. 
    You're only other point was your erroneous opinion that Trump is a racist.  The Association of German National Jews didn't support Hitler after he came to power; they couldn't, his government disband their organization.  There is no similarity whatsoever between that and Trump.  This is simply more of the left's over-reliance on the race card.
  • WordsMatterWordsMatter 160 Pts
    edited September 1
    @CYDdharta the fact that he settled with the Justice department when he was accused of racist business practices means nothing to you? 

    "He settled! That clearly means he's not guilty! It's a liberal ploy to sink him unfairly!" - you, probably

    Just so you don't put words in my mouth I'm not saying this proves he's racist, but the facts fall against his favor.
    beckysmith
  • @CYDdharta the fact that he settled with the Justice department when he was accused of racist business practices means nothing to you? 

    "He settled! That clearly means he's not guilty! It's a liberal ploy to sink him unfairly!" - you, probably

    Just so you don't put words in my mouth I'm not saying this proves he's racist, but the facts fall against his favor.

    50 year old allegations?  No it really doesn't mean very much.  If Trump were actually a racist, you wouldn't need to go back half a century for examples, such as they are.
  • CYDdharta said:
    I like how you ignored my first point. But I guess were talking about hitler now. If you took history class you probably heard of the Association of German National Jews which is a jewish organization who supported hitler during Nazi Germany. You can look it up if you want details. I personally see a correlation between hitler praisers and trump fans (NOT ALL OF THEM) but just the ones who don't open their eyes to what they actually stand for. 
    You're only other point was your erroneous opinion that Trump is a racist.  The Association of German National Jews didn't support Hitler after he came to power; they couldn't, his government disband their organization.  There is no similarity whatsoever between that and Trump.  This is simply more of the left's over-reliance on the race card.
    Tell me why he treated Lebron poorly for opening an affordable school then? Why did he deny African Americans from renting his apartment? why did he call African countries a hole? why does he use Mexicans like slaves and threaten them if they retaliate? Why does he make fun of asians? You think i'm just playing the race card while facts are right in your face. Or even better, show me a racist public figure and then tell me what makes that person racist and not trump. "There is no similarity whatsoever between that and Trump" Many of you trump fans create this cult where you become denial of all bad things that he's done. He has his positives, he is an intelligent man, but you have to also understand his negatives. Its ignorance. Open your eyes and ears.
  • Oh, the "All trump supporters are racist" trope
    saying all trump supporters are racists is like saying all germans are Nazi's.
    that's stereotyping
    and it needs to stop.
    that's how racism starts
    beckysmithCYDdharta
  • Yes, because Donald Trump inflicted a toxic ideology that fueled the flames of division.
    Zombieguy1987
  • @inc4t First off, When you talk about the travel ban you need to realize that in order for the government to protect the citizens of the United States it is necessary to take zero risks in regard to importing people from places that have been known to produce terrorists. Just take a look at Europe. Many of their nations have accepted vast numbers of refugees into their borders which has resulted in a rapid spike in Islamic Terror attacks and Sweden has become the rape capital of the Western World. It's certainly prudent to halt the entrance of refugees until we come up with a way to reliably put these people through a vetting process to ensure that we don't let in a large number of people that want to tear our civilization apart.
    Immigrants.

    Economically: If were talking about immigration, nearly 90% of economists agree that immigrants are not a burden to America, but actually contribute to the economy's GDP growth significantly. It is a fallacy that they come and steal jobs but they actually create jobs by stimulating consumer spending. If you look at history, the United States today would never be the powerhouse without immigrants. We might've even lost WW2 if it weren't for immigrants working in factories to supply our American troops. It is factual that through history immigrants make up and have contributed to the United State's successes.

    Culturally: Diversity is highly valued in business. It is the key to making business prosper. Why? It brings different viewpoints, (more ideas), new inventions, and skillsets. Outside the workplace it is they are controversial and liked or frowned upon based on personal opinion. Some don't like cultural diversity and some do.

    Safety: This seems to be the biggest concern in the eyes of the American people, understandably. It is the "land of the free" after all. This has been studied for years as the debate continues. Some studies show that "immigrants - regardless of legal status-commit crimes at lower rates than Native-born citizens", "Higher levels of immigration may have contributed to the historic drop in crime rates", and "police chiefs believe intensifying immigration law enforcement undermines public safety". Statistics show that 66% of crimes committed by immigrants is immigration law, followed by 24% drug, 8% non violent and 2% violent. The offenses were totaling 29,166 in 2015. While there has 5 attacks called "terrorist attacks" within the past two years, these totaled to 10 deaths and 42 injured. I am not saying this is okay or a not bad by any means, but why focus on immigrant attacks when our own people killed 109 people injured 904 people in the same time. Now your probably saying thats biased because we have more people. Well, the 109 killed and 904 injured was caused by two events only each done by one person. Again why are immigrants the big issue when we are doing more damage to ourselves? 

    Their point of view. Moving to the United States for them is a no brainer. Put yourself in their shoes. If they move to the States their quality of life increases by multiple times. Their pay increases, safety, benefits, and for their kids; education, environment may all increase. I'm sure you would move if you could.




  • CYDdharta said:
    I like how you ignored my first point. But I guess were talking about hitler now. If you took history class you probably heard of the Association of German National Jews which is a jewish organization who supported hitler during Nazi Germany. You can look it up if you want details. I personally see a correlation between hitler praisers and trump fans (NOT ALL OF THEM) but just the ones who don't open their eyes to what they actually stand for. 
    You're only other point was your erroneous opinion that Trump is a racist.  The Association of German National Jews didn't support Hitler after he came to power; they couldn't, his government disband their organization.  There is no similarity whatsoever between that and Trump.  This is simply more of the left's over-reliance on the race card.
    Tell me why he treated Lebron poorly for opening an affordable school then? Why did he deny African Americans from renting his apartment? why did he call African countries a hole? why does he use Mexicans like slaves and threaten them if they retaliate? Why does he make fun of asians? You think i'm just playing the race card while facts are right in your face. Or even better, show me a racist public figure and then tell me what makes that person racist and not trump. "There is no similarity whatsoever between that and Trump" Many of you trump fans create this cult where you become denial of all bad things that he's done. He has his positives, he is an intelligent man, but you have to also understand his negatives. Its ignorance. Open your eyes and ears.
    Trump treated Lebron poorly for opening an affordable school?!?  Do tell, or are you just making this up?  Why might Trump have allegedly called the countries that top the list of the most corrupt nations on Earth "shitholes"?  Gee, I wonder.  If that's racist, than reality is racist.  If you want to see real racism, look here;

  • haha are you serious? You think it is false that trump called African countries a hole? enjoy this video then
    Im not going to waste my time finding exact videos so here are some compilations for you to enjoy :)

    If seeing and hearing the words he says in these videos don't prove to you that he is racist, then you do not understand the definition of racist. How do you explain his comment on Lebron James right after he built a school for children which includes  free breakfast, lunch, snacks and drinks, access to a fitness trainer, free bicycles, free college tuition accordingly and more. And what does trump say to commend him on doing good? He calls him dumb. You are proof that everyone is ignorant in some shape or form and I am glad to rid you of your ignorance on Trumps cultural views :) 


    Using a SNL piece as a source and CNN



    How about using ACTUAL news organization article links/sources instead of your favorite liberal news outlets? That nonsense won't fly around here. 
    beckysmith
    "Is God willing to prevent evil, but not able? Then he is not omnipotent. Is he able, but not willing? Then he is malevolent. Is he both able and willing? Then whence cometh evil? Is he neither able nor willing? Then why call him God? " ~Epicurus

    "We must question the story logic of having an all-knowing all-powerful God, who creates faulty Humans, and then blames them for his own mistakes." ~Gene Roddenberry

    "A communist is like a crocodile" ~Winston Churchill
  • @JohnChristian Or. or. or. oooooooooooorrrrrrrrrrrrrrrr

    maybe. just. maybe.

    Trump wants to curb illegal immigration (Even though I think the wall is a waste of money because humans invented this flying device called an airplane which is the wall's kryptonite) But is nevertheless trying to curb illegal immigration because illegals are taking jobs from legal citizens are committing crime.

    The travel ban is meant to prevent terrorists from countries that are PROVEN to harbor terrorists (except for Saudi Arabia because "Muh Oil!"
    Remember all those terror attacks in Europe? The reason those happen is because of the E.U's shitty immigration policy of allowing any immigrants to come into Europe. Trump is trying to stop that by using this travel ban.


    beckysmithGeorge_HorseJohnChristian
  • @beckysmith

    Calling horrible countries names is a poor style (and definitely not one fit for a president of a mighty nation) - but it is hardly racist. Countries like North Korea, Haiti or Equatorial Guinea are, indeed, holes; it has nothing to do with the race of people living there, but everything to do with the quality of life there, the government, the mentality of the average citizen and so on.

    As much as I dislike Trump, I have never heard him say anything outright racist. I have seen him say some despicable things, and his stereotyping of Mexicans and Muslims based on their marginal groups is nothing short of shameful - however, it in itself is not racism. It is xenophobia, but xenophobia and racism are very different things.
    His business practices are another matter. My impression is that they were based on the interests of his customer base, rather than his personal beliefs. In general, he is not the kind of guy who has many beliefs beyond what sounds good to his target audience. And he even explicitly stated it in one of his books: something along the lines of "The truth is what your client wants it to be."

    "Racism" means having a prejudice against a group of people based on their race. I have not seen that from Trump. Given his general narrative, I would not be surprised if he also was a white supremacist - but if so, he does a pretty good job keeping it down.

    George_Horsebeckysmith
  • MayCaesar said:
    @beckysmith

    Calling horrible countries names is a poor style (and definitely not one fit for a president of a mighty nation) - but it is hardly racist. Countries like North Korea, Haiti or Equatorial Guinea are, indeed, holes; it has nothing to do with the race of people living there, but everything to do with the quality of life there, the government, the mentality of the average citizen and so on.

    As much as I dislike Trump, I have never heard him say anything outright racist. I have seen him say some despicable things, and his stereotyping of Mexicans and Muslims based on their marginal groups is nothing short of shameful - however, it in itself is not racism. It is xenophobia, but xenophobia and racism are very different things.
    His business practices are another matter. My impression is that they were based on the interests of his customer base, rather than his personal beliefs. In general, he is not the kind of guy who has many beliefs beyond what sounds good to his target audience. And he even explicitly stated it in one of his books: something along the lines of "The truth is what your client wants it to be."

    "Racism" means having a prejudice against a group of people based on their race. I have not seen that from Trump. Given his general narrative, I would not be surprised if he also was a white supremacist - but if so, he does a pretty good job keeping it down.

    I like your argument I think it was the most genuine and unbiased one i've heard yet, however I still can't be convinced that he is not racist. While he may not have "said" anything racist, what about his litigation for not allowing African Americans for renting his apartment, or his comments on Lebron James for building an affordable school for children (calls him dumb). Besides African Americans, he takes advantage of Mexican workers, he called them all rapists and criminals the list goes on. All these little things make me convinced that he is racist.
    George_Horse
  • CYDdharta said:
    CYDdharta said:
    I like how you ignored my first point. But I guess were talking about hitler now. If you took history class you probably heard of the Association of German National Jews which is a jewish organization who supported hitler during Nazi Germany. You can look it up if you want details. I personally see a correlation between hitler praisers and trump fans (NOT ALL OF THEM) but just the ones who don't open their eyes to what they actually stand for. 
    You're only other point was your erroneous opinion that Trump is a racist.  The Association of German National Jews didn't support Hitler after he came to power; they couldn't, his government disband their organization.  There is no similarity whatsoever between that and Trump.  This is simply more of the left's over-reliance on the race card.
    Tell me why he treated Lebron poorly for opening an affordable school then? Why did he deny African Americans from renting his apartment? why did he call African countries a hole? why does he use Mexicans like slaves and threaten them if they retaliate? Why does he make fun of asians? You think i'm just playing the race card while facts are right in your face. Or even better, show me a racist public figure and then tell me what makes that person racist and not trump. "There is no similarity whatsoever between that and Trump" Many of you trump fans create this cult where you become denial of all bad things that he's done. He has his positives, he is an intelligent man, but you have to also understand his negatives. Its ignorance. Open your eyes and ears.
    Trump treated Lebron poorly for opening an affordable school?!?  Do tell, or are you just making this up?  Why might Trump have allegedly called the countries that top the list of the most corrupt nations on Earth "shitholes"?  Gee, I wonder.  If that's racist, than reality is racist.  If you want to see real racism, look here;

    Why are you showing me a video of people who hates whites? I never said that is an okay thing and every person who wrote that is racist. It saddens me to see stuff like that but that is not the point of the argument. What I am saying is Donald Trump is racist. I can't believe you haven't heard of his comments on Lebron James building the school it was everywhere. He tweeted:

    If you want to see the interview he is commenting about it is this one: 
    Please explain why he had the right to say that about this interview? 
    Also, I don't know about you or Trump but I have lived in Guinea for about three years. (Thats one of the countries Trump called a " hole") And I can tell you first hand that if Guinea is a hole, then the United States is a hole as well. I'm not sure what Trump used to judge his assumptions on, but unless you go experience it for yourself, him or nobody else has the right to judge. They may not have an economy or the infrastructure that the United States has, but by no means is it a " hole" country. I bet if a foreign president called the United States a hole country then the citizens wouldn't be happy about it so why do you think the people he has insulted are okay with it?
  • haha are you serious? You think it is false that trump called African countries a hole? enjoy this video then
    Im not going to waste my time finding exact videos so here are some compilations for you to enjoy :)

    If seeing and hearing the words he says in these videos don't prove to you that he is racist, then you do not understand the definition of racist. How do you explain his comment on Lebron James right after he built a school for children which includes  free breakfast, lunch, snacks and drinks, access to a fitness trainer, free bicycles, free college tuition accordingly and more. And what does trump say to commend him on doing good? He calls him dumb. You are proof that everyone is ignorant in some shape or form and I am glad to rid you of your ignorance on Trumps cultural views :) 


    Using a SNL piece as a source and CNN



    How about using ACTUAL news organization article links/sources instead of your favorite liberal news outlets? That nonsense won't fly around here. 
    If you actually watched the SNL piece you would see that in the middle of the video there is a clip of trump calling African countries " holes" because you are in denial that he actually said it. I am giving you video evidence or is the truth too painful?
  • edited September 2

    Why are you showing me a video of people who hates whites? I never said that is an okay thing and every person who wrote that is racist. It saddens me to see stuff like that but that is not the point of the argument. What I am saying is Donald Trump is racist. I can't believe you haven't heard of his comments on Lebron James building the school it was everywhere. He tweeted:

    If you want to see the interview he is commenting about it is this one: 
    Please explain why he had the right to say that about this interview? 
    Also, I don't know about you or Trump but I have lived in Guinea for about three years. (Thats one of the countries Trump called a " hole") And I can tell you first hand that if Guinea is a hole, then the United States is a hole as well. I'm not sure what Trump used to judge his assumptions on, but unless you go experience it for yourself, him or nobody else has the right to judge. They may not have an economy or the infrastructure that the United States has, but by no means is it a " hole" country. I bet if a foreign president called the United States a hole country then the citizens wouldn't be happy about it so why do you think the people he has insulted are okay with it?


    You asked for examples of real racism, you said, "Or even better, show me a racist public figure and then tell me what makes that person racist and not trump".  People saying "I hate whites", "FՍck white people", "White people are bad", “Dumbass white people marking up the internet with their opinions like dogs pissing on fire hydrants”; those are examples of real racism.  Every single account has been verified by Twitter with a blue check-mark.  The last one is from the New York Times newest editor.  Do you hear an outcry over over the racism from these public figures?  Me neither.  Apparently racism isn't as important an issue as people make it out to be. Instead, we get crap like your LeBron James story, which I KNEW you lying about.  LeBron takes a number of swings at Trump on Twitter, Trump takes a swing back, Trump must be racist.  Gimme a break.  I knew Trump didn't say anything about LeBron's school.  In fact, the only one who did was Melania,
    It looks like LeBron James is working to do good things on behalf of our next generation and just as she always has, the First Lady encourages everyone to have an open dialogue about issues facing children today,

    As far as your experiences in Guinea; it probably seemed hunky dory in the bubble in which you were, no doubt, visiting.  The people who live there have a different experience and opinion, number 148 out of 180 on the Corruption Perception Index.  





    George_Horse
  • haha are you serious? You think it is false that trump called African countries a hole? enjoy this video then
    Im not going to waste my time finding exact videos so here are some compilations for you to enjoy :)

    If seeing and hearing the words he says in these videos don't prove to you that he is racist, then you do not understand the definition of racist. How do you explain his comment on Lebron James right after he built a school for children which includes  free breakfast, lunch, snacks and drinks, access to a fitness trainer, free bicycles, free college tuition accordingly and more. And what does trump say to commend him on doing good? He calls him dumb. You are proof that everyone is ignorant in some shape or form and I am glad to rid you of your ignorance on Trumps cultural views :) 


    Using a SNL piece as a source and CNN



    How about using ACTUAL news organization article links/sources instead of your favorite liberal news outlets? That nonsense won't fly around here. 
    If you actually watched the SNL piece you would see that in the middle of the video there is a clip of trump calling African countries " holes" because you are in denial that he actually said it. I am giving you video evidence or is the truth too painful?
    And did the ones who said that testify under oath that Trump TRULY made that statement towards Haiti and African countries? Is there recorded evidence that he said this, other than a piece of text on a screen claiming that he used the word? And I'm not being in denial either. SNL is not a credible news outlet, and so is CNN, unless I don't hear recorded evidence, and that the claimants do not testify under oath, then it is merely a unproved claim, plain and simple. 
    "Is God willing to prevent evil, but not able? Then he is not omnipotent. Is he able, but not willing? Then he is malevolent. Is he both able and willing? Then whence cometh evil? Is he neither able nor willing? Then why call him God? " ~Epicurus

    "We must question the story logic of having an all-knowing all-powerful God, who creates faulty Humans, and then blames them for his own mistakes." ~Gene Roddenberry

    "A communist is like a crocodile" ~Winston Churchill
  • MayCaesarMayCaesar 541 Pts
    edited September 2
    beckysmith said:

    I like your argument I think it was the most genuine and unbiased one i've heard yet, however I still can't be convinced that he is not racist. While he may not have "said" anything racist, what about his litigation for not allowing African Americans for renting his apartment, or his comments on Lebron James for building an affordable school for children (calls him dumb). Besides African Americans, he takes advantage of Mexican workers, he called them all rapists and criminals the list goes on. All these little things make me convinced that he is racist.
    Yes, I agree, given everything he has said and done, it is unlikely that he is not, at least, slightly racist - and even if he is not, then he certainly likes pandering to racist groups for his personal benefit. I think, however, that we should follow the principle of presumption of innocence in all cases, including this one, and conclude that, at least, for now there is no hard evidence suggesting that Trump has racist views.

    Regarding African-Americans banning from renting from his apartment complex, I did not study that situation very deeply, but my understanding is that it was done purely for business purposes. Whether we like it or not, there are people who do not want to live in communities with African-American people in them. It is a sad state of affairs, but on the other hand, in a free society those people should be able to have their wish fulfilled. Trump simply provided them with an opportunity to get the apartment they want - and given the shortage of such apartments on the market, having this type of exclusivity certainly allowed him to charge the people living there for more.

    I disagree that such business practices should be illegal. But are they racist? I would say this is a grey area: while the policy itself is definitely racist, racism is not what drives it - supply/demand balance is what does. If we want to reduce the supply, we need to reduce the demand, and that is a difficult undertaking.

    The bottom line is, I do not think that his business practices imply that he is a racist - rather, they imply, at the very least, that racists are one of the recognized groups within his consumer base, and he does not shy away from catering to their preferences.

    beckysmith
  • haha are you serious? You think it is false that trump called African countries a hole? enjoy this video then
    Im not going to waste my time finding exact videos so here are some compilations for you to enjoy :)

    If seeing and hearing the words he says in these videos don't prove to you that he is racist, then you do not understand the definition of racist. How do you explain his comment on Lebron James right after he built a school for children which includes  free breakfast, lunch, snacks and drinks, access to a fitness trainer, free bicycles, free college tuition accordingly and more. And what does trump say to commend him on doing good? He calls him dumb. You are proof that everyone is ignorant in some shape or form and I am glad to rid you of your ignorance on Trumps cultural views :) 


    Using a SNL piece as a source and CNN



    How about using ACTUAL news organization article links/sources instead of your favorite liberal news outlets? That nonsense won't fly around here. 
    If you actually watched the SNL piece you would see that in the middle of the video there is a clip of trump calling African countries " holes" because you are in denial that he actually said it. I am giving you video evidence or is the truth too painful?
    And did the ones who said that testify under oath that Trump TRULY made that statement towards Haiti and African countries? Is there recorded evidence that he said this, other than a piece of text on a screen claiming that he used the word? And I'm not being in denial either. SNL is not a credible news outlet, and so is CNN, unless I don't hear recorded evidence, and that the claimants do not testify under oath, then it is merely a unproved claim, plain and simple. 
    Just watch it lol. There is an unedited video with audio filming him saying it. It is not just text on a screen or anything. It is a video of him saying it. just watch it
  • MayCaesar said:
    beckysmith said:

    I like your argument I think it was the most genuine and unbiased one i've heard yet, however I still can't be convinced that he is not racist. While he may not have "said" anything racist, what about his litigation for not allowing African Americans for renting his apartment, or his comments on Lebron James for building an affordable school for children (calls him dumb). Besides African Americans, he takes advantage of Mexican workers, he called them all rapists and criminals the list goes on. All these little things make me convinced that he is racist.
    Yes, I agree, given everything he has said and done, it is unlikely that he is not, at least, slightly racist - and even if he is not, then he certainly likes pandering to racist groups for his personal benefit. I think, however, that we should follow the principle of presumption of innocence in all cases, including this one, and conclude that, at least, for now there is no hard evidence suggesting that Trump has racist views.

    Regarding African-Americans banning from renting from his apartment complex, I did not study that situation very deeply, but my understanding is that it was done purely for business purposes. Whether we like it or not, there are people who do not want to live in communities with African-American people in them. It is a sad state of affairs, but on the other hand, in a free society those people should be able to have their wish fulfilled. Trump simply provided them with an opportunity to get the apartment they want - and given the shortage of such apartments on the market, having this type of exclusivity certainly allowed him to charge the people living there for more.

    I disagree that such business practices should be illegal. But are they racist? I would say this is a grey area: while the policy itself is definitely racist, racism is not what drives it - supply/demand balance is what does. If we want to reduce the supply, we need to reduce the demand, and that is a difficult undertaking.

    The bottom line is, I do not think that his business practices imply that he is a racist - rather, they imply, at the very least, that racists are one of the recognized groups within his consumer base, and he does not shy away from catering to their preferences.

    I agree with your view, however, there are some actions and statements that give me the impression that he is racist, even just the slightest. For example, outside of business, the incident with Lebron James. I follow Trump on twitter because he is the president and he he has enormous power so I would like to stay updated with him. I don't think there is any justification for why he would insult an athlete who has never gotten in serious trouble his whole career, he is a role model to millions, and its safe to say Lebron is a great person. Why would Trump insult him after opening an affordable school? Looking back on his twitter history has also feuded with other notable colored athletes like Stephen Curry, keapernick, and basically all black NFL players. I admit to be biased on this point but I have read many articles talking about Trump dividing our country on the one thing that brings us together; sports. Black, white, asian, indian - no matter what ethnicity comes together to support their team and Trump is feuding with players for peacefully protesting through sports, or with NBA athletes for a reason that i'm not sure of. So while you may be right that there is no hard evidence, you must understand that to me and to others it's clearly enough to justify that he is racist.
  • Just watch it lol. There is an unedited video with audio filming him saying it. It is not just text on a screen or anything. It is a video of him saying it. just watch it
    I did, and I did not see ANY recording or evidence besides an unproved allegation. Again, STOP using SNL as your source, and link an actual credible news outlet that proves that Trump made that statement instead of rambling on with nonsense. 
    beckysmith
    "Is God willing to prevent evil, but not able? Then he is not omnipotent. Is he able, but not willing? Then he is malevolent. Is he both able and willing? Then whence cometh evil? Is he neither able nor willing? Then why call him God? " ~Epicurus

    "We must question the story logic of having an all-knowing all-powerful God, who creates faulty Humans, and then blames them for his own mistakes." ~Gene Roddenberry

    "A communist is like a crocodile" ~Winston Churchill
  • His age alone does not gaurente he is a racist, but people his age tend to be racist. When he was a child public lynchings of black people, where communities would get together, bring the kids or have a date night, and watch a lynching. Of course if you grow up in an environment like this you are more likely to develop racist views. It's that very reason that it's harder to personally hold racism against people like Trump or Roseanne. 
    beckysmith
  • His age alone does not gaurente he is a racist, but people his age tend to be racist. When he was a child public lynchings of black people, where communities would get together, bring the kids or have a date night, and watch a lynching. Of course if you grow up in an environment like this you are more likely to develop racist views. It's that very reason that it's harder to personally hold racism against people like Trump or Roseanne. 
    There were pubic lynchings in New York?  Who knew?
    George_Horse
  • Just watch it lol. There is an unedited video with audio filming him saying it. It is not just text on a screen or anything. It is a video of him saying it. just watch it
    I did, and I did not see ANY recording or evidence besides an unproved allegation. Again, STOP using SNL as your source, and link an actual credible news outlet that proves that Trump made that statement instead of rambling on with nonsense. 
    Okay, if you're so against the SNL source, you completely ignored the other two videos I sent you. How do you justify the other things he has said? what about the lebron situation? So far nobody on this debate in favor of trump has explained why he said that about Lebron James for building a school. How about the CNN link do you think CNN is not credible? In that video there are clips with proof of the things Lebron has said. The last video I attached was a long compilation of controversial racist things he has said. Can you justify each of them?
  • Just watch it lol. There is an unedited video with audio filming him saying it. It is not just text on a screen or anything. It is a video of him saying it. just watch it
    I did, and I did not see ANY recording or evidence besides an unproved allegation. Again, STOP using SNL as your source, and link an actual credible news outlet that proves that Trump made that statement instead of rambling on with nonsense. 
    Okay, if you're so against the SNL source, you completely ignored the other two videos I sent you. How do you justify the other things he has said? what about the lebron situation? So far nobody on this debate in favor of trump has explained why he said that about Lebron James for building a school. How about the CNN link do you think CNN is not credible? In that video there are clips with proof of the things Lebron has said. The last video I attached was a long compilation of controversial racist things he has said. Can you justify each of them?
    At this sad point, I am beginning to lose hope. I watched them too, just unproved allegations. The claimants did NOT testify under oath, and there is NO recorded evidence that he made that statement. While I'm still playing sonic the hedgehog, I will await your next argument, hopefully you linking actual credible news outlets/websites, instead of continuously rambling on with even MORE nonsense. 
    "Is God willing to prevent evil, but not able? Then he is not omnipotent. Is he able, but not willing? Then he is malevolent. Is he both able and willing? Then whence cometh evil? Is he neither able nor willing? Then why call him God? " ~Epicurus

    "We must question the story logic of having an all-knowing all-powerful God, who creates faulty Humans, and then blames them for his own mistakes." ~Gene Roddenberry

    "A communist is like a crocodile" ~Winston Churchill
  • WordsMatterWordsMatter 160 Pts
    edited September 2
    @CYDdharta in fact there were. Northerners like to pretend lynchings only happened in the South but they went on everywhere.
     https://www.loc.gov/resource/g3701e.ct002012/?r=0.017,0.1,0.4,0.519,0

    Next time do a quick Google search before making an ignorant comment. How many illegals have you seen cross the border? Or are you aware of illegals crossing the border because we live in a time where that's common?
  • @CYDdharta in fact there were. Northerners like to pretend lynchings only happened in the South but they went on everywhere.
     https://www.loc.gov/resource/g3701e.ct002012/?r=0.017,0.1,0.4,0.519,0

    Next time do a quick Google search before making an ignorant comment. How many illegals have you seen cross the border? Or are you aware of illegals crossing the border because we live in a time where that's common?

    *Posts a map of lynchings by state before Trump was even born*



    Cmon! That was the best result? 
    "Is God willing to prevent evil, but not able? Then he is not omnipotent. Is he able, but not willing? Then he is malevolent. Is he both able and willing? Then whence cometh evil? Is he neither able nor willing? Then why call him God? " ~Epicurus

    "We must question the story logic of having an all-knowing all-powerful God, who creates faulty Humans, and then blames them for his own mistakes." ~Gene Roddenberry

    "A communist is like a crocodile" ~Winston Churchill
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