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Do you believe that Catholicism is the same as christianity.
in Religion

By JohnBellJohnBell 12 Pts
Catholicism historically was founded by a pagan, adopted pagan beliefs, and made pagan deities saints and continually persecuted actual christians.
Also theologically speaking that if someone believes what the catholic church says is true, you can be sure they won't make it to heaven.



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  • piloteerpiloteer 467 Pts
    If you believe Jesus Christ is your Lord and savior, then you're a Christian. Catholics believe Jesus Christ is their Lord and savior, therefore they are Christian. It doesn't matter who founded Catholicism.
    JoshBaileyAlofRI
  • Catholicism was founded by Jesus Christ. All beliefs are derived out of scripture and Christian Tradition. Theologically speaking Catholics profess the true Christian faith. 

    What examples do you have to substantiate any of your claims?
    jesusisGod777
  • @piloteer

    >>If you believe Jesus Christ is your Lord and savior, then you're a Christian. Catholics believe Jesus Christ is their Lord and savior, therefore they are Christian. 

    For if indeed he that comes preaches another Jesus, whom we have not preached, or ye get a different Spirit, which ye have not got, or a different glad tidings, which ye have not received, ye might well bear with it. (2 Cor 11:4)

    Actually there are many who and will claim to be Jesus, you have to believe in the right Jesus to be a true Christian.

    Then if anyone says to you, ‘Look, here is the Christ!’ or ‘There he is!’ do not believe it. "For false Christs and false prophets will arise and will show great signs and wonders, so as to mislead, if possible, even the elect. (Mat. 24:23-24)

    >>It doesn't matter who founded Catholicism.

    What matters is if the teachings or doctrines are in align with the Bible. 

    All Scripture is breathed out by God and profitable for teaching, for reproof, for correction, and for training in righteousness, that the man of God may be complete, equipped for every good work. (2 Timothy 3:17)

    The Roman Catholic Church is different in that; as the Second Vatican Council affirmed that “both Scripture and Tradition must be accepted and honoured with equal feelings of devotion and reverence” (Vatican II documents, “Dogmatic Constitution on Divine Revelation,” Chap. 2, 9, p. 682). 

    However their doctrines do not align with Scripture, nor do their traditions.

    Of the last sayings of Christ on the cross, none is more important or more poignant than, “It is finished.” Found only in the Gospel of John, the Greek word translated “it is finished” is tetelestai, an accounting term that means “paid in full.”

    When Jesus uttered those words, He was declaring the debt owed to His Father was wiped away completely and forever. Not that Jesus wiped away any debt that He owed to the Father; rather, Jesus eliminated the debt owed by mankind—the debt of sin.

    Otherwise Christ would have had to suffer many times since the creation of the world. But he has appeared once for all at the culmination of the ages to do away with sin by the sacrifice of himself. (Hebrews 9:26)

    And by that will, we have been made holy through the sacrifice of the body of Jesus Christ once for all. (Hebrews 10:10)

    Yet, on Coptic and Greek Orthodox, and Catholic altars, we find another Christ, another Jesus, who must continually be immolated at their mass rituals since what their Jesus did was apparently not finished, the debt was not apparently fully paid....

    The truth however can be found in Scripture;

    Unlike the other high priests, he does not need to offer sacrifices day after day, first for his own sins, and then for the sins of the people. He sacrificed for their sins once for all when he offered himself. (Hebrews 7:27)

    Scripture could not be more clear, the sacrifice was once and for all. There is also no remission of sins without the shedding of blood, yet the eucharistic liturgy is still considered a bloodless sacrifice.

    In fact, the law requires that nearly everything be cleansed with blood, and without the shedding of blood there is no forgiveness. (Hebrews 9:22)

    We have evidence that goes to show the Babylonian origin of the idea of that "unbloody sacrifice" very distinctly. From Tacitus we learn that no blood was allowed to be offered on the altars of Paphian Venus. Victims were used for the purposes of the Haruspex, that presages of the issues of events might be drawn from the inspection of the entrails of these victims; but the altars of the Paphian goddess were required to be kept pure from blood.

    The bread and wine are only symbolic. In Matthew 26:28, Jesus is speaking and refers to his coming sacrifice on the cross, "For this is my blood of the new testament, which is shed for many for the remission of sins." He also says why it is done, "... do this in remembrance of me" (Luke 22:19), nothing is ever said that it is for the forgiveness of sin, it is a memorial, nothing else, it was His sacrifice on the cross that was the one time act for the remission of sins.

    The Eucharistic liturgy is not Christian, but completely pagan in its origin, nothing to do with the true King of Kings, Lord of Lords, it is truly an abomination.

    "Come out of her, my people! Run for your lives! Run from the fierce anger of the LORD. (Jeremiah 51:45)

    Then I heard another voice from heaven say: "'Come out of her, my people,' so that you will not share in her sins, so that you will not receive any of her plagues (Revelation 18:4)

    There are many more doctrines of this so called universal church that do not align with Scripture;

    1) Salvation through the church

    2) Salvation through good works

    3) The church forgives sins

    4) Baptism saves

    5) The Pope: Vicar of Christ

    6) The Pope: Infallible

    7) The sacraments save

    8) The Sin of Presumption

    9) Transubstantiation

    10) Eucharist (Mass)

    11) Mary

    12) The Mass

    13) Purgatory

    14) Praying to saints

    15) Praying for the dead

    16) Confirmation

    17) Confessing Sins to a Priest

    18) Indulgences

    19) Penance

    20) Celibacy

    21) Clergy

    If you would like to learn more about those that have escaped this false church visit https://excatholicsforchrist.com/ 

    VaulkWordsMatter
  • VaulkVaulk 639 Pts
    While I don't really appreciate being grouped up with Catholicism in regards to my faith, I also understand that, for the sake of the argument being fair, it is technically fair to say that Catholicism is part of Christianity.  

    That said, it's important to take note that the Catholic faith supports, promotes, teaches and, historically speaking, enforces an entirely made up doctrine while using the Bible to justify it.

    Prayer beads, worshipping Mary, worshipping the apostles, worship of saints, baptism by sprinkling water instead of submersion, confessing your sins to a Human for forgiveness, families paying money to the priests for prayers that will get their loved ones into heaven AFTER they're already dead...these are all examples of wicked practices that have NOTHING to do with the Bible, aren't scriptural, cannot be justified with doctrine and are completely wrong.

    Catholicism has successfully bastardized the Bible and the Doctrine of Jesus Christ and convinced millions of people to follow it in hopes of finding forgiveness and making it into heaven.
    "If there's no such thing as a stupid question then what kind of questions do stupid people ask"?

    "There's going to be a special place in Hell for people who spread lies through the veil of logical fallacies disguised as rational argument".

    "Oh, you don't like my sarcasm?  Well I don't much appreciate your stupid".


  • MayCaesarMayCaesar 1872 Pts
    Catholicism, Protestantism, Orthodox Christianity, etc. are just different derivatives from the same initial assumption. They all use the Bible to guide them, but they derive different conclusions from it and interpret its passages differently.

    There are no "true" or "false" Christians, there are just some groups of Christians disagreeing with other groups of Christians.
    OppolzerPlaffelvohfen
  • VaulkVaulk 639 Pts
    I really don't like to admit that the way @MayCaesar put that was the truth, but for the sake of the argument, it's accurate.  There are objective requirements in order to be a Christian but in the grand scheme of things, when looking over the masses of religions in the world...Christian is Christian no matter what flavor you claim to be.

    "If there's no such thing as a stupid question then what kind of questions do stupid people ask"?

    "There's going to be a special place in Hell for people who spread lies through the veil of logical fallacies disguised as rational argument".

    "Oh, you don't like my sarcasm?  Well I don't much appreciate your stupid".


  • DeeDee 703 Pts
    @Vaulk

    You say .......While I don't really appreciate being grouped up with Catholicism in regards to my faith, I also understand that, for the sake of the argument being fair, it is technically fair to say that Catholicism is part of Christianity.  


    My reply ......As a former Roman Catholic we definitely did not appreciate being grouped with any other Christian denomination and perceived ourselves “ as the one true church “ 

    To be honest most branches of Christianity were looked at with pity and a lot of the American branches of Christianity were called cults 


    You say ......That said, it's important to take note that the Catholic faith supports, promotes, teaches and, historically speaking, enforces an entirely made up doctrine while using the Bible to justify it.


    My reply ......


    And that is exactly what they would say about any non Catholic denominations

    Roman Catholicism itself maintains that the Roman Catholic Church was established by Christ when he gave direction to the Apostle Peteras the head of the church. This belief is based on Matthew 16:18, when Jesus Christ said to Peter:


    "And I tell you that you are Peter, and on this rock I will build my church, and the gates of Hades will not overcome it." (NIV).


    You say .....Prayer beads, worshipping Mary, worshipping the apostles, worship of saints, baptism by sprinkling water instead of submersion, confessing your sins to a Human for forgiveness, families paying money to the priests for prayers that will get their loved ones into heaven AFTER they're already dead...these are all examples of wicked practices that have NOTHING to do with the Bible, aren't scriptural, cannot be justified with doctrine and are completely wrong.


    My reply .....I think it’s truly tragic that you as a Christian judge the practices of other Christians as wicked , I’m married to a Catholic and most my family are and they’re (mostly) good decent people , they respect and mix with other Christians and the days of demonizing other Christians are thankfully a remnant of the past as now the religion is a lot more inclusive.


     Maybe you could answer ( or not) why are American Christians so hostile and aggressive towards mainly Catholics? 


    I’ve witnessed in times past the absolute hatred of Catholics and Protestants against each other in my country but nothing comes close to certain American Christians groupings for a different level of hatred against fellow Christians 


    You say .......Catholicism has successfully bastardized the Bible and the Doctrine of Jesus Christ and convinced millions of people to follow it in hopes of finding forgiveness and making it into heaven.


    My reply .....It’s terrible that certain Christians cannot appreciate that their brothers and sisters in Christ are just like them products of their own religious upbringing and doing what they do because they firmly believe it’s right and correct.


    Some even believe “judge not lest you be judged” 


    No offence but your thinking sounds similar to that used traditionally by different religions including Catholicism to wage war and destruction on those taking part in “wicked practices “ 

  • @edster911

    No you're absolutely wrong.

    The Catholic Church expierienced something called the great schism when people like Martin Luther, William tyndale and napolean Bonaparte had noticed the Vatican was a political Enterprise.

    Historially, people could not read the Bible in it's original language and required it to be read to them. The Catholic Church falsely misrepresented the Bible throughtout it's entire history and still does.

    When William tyndale translated the Bible from Latin, and people started reading it they started forming their own church's and withdrew from the satanic culture that is the catholic building.

    The apocrypha books, are not Canon as each is individually contradictorary.

    Such as Enoch.

    Enoch couldn't have been written by Enoch because it was written in the Ethiopian and slavonic language 1. A.D.

    Enoch was a Jew.

    Second there are two Enochs from human ancestry.

    Other apocrypha books are even more absurd.

    Second Mary states she needs Jesus just as much as anyone else in Luke because she's a sinner.

    Female worship actually traces it's its roots back into the occult.

    The Catholic building practices nothing but the occult.

    If anyone actually looked up what the pope said it's obvious the Pope's going to hell. All Pope's have died due to sickness AKA pissing Jesus off.

    In Peter it states the Bible has a natural meaning and is not open to anyone's interpretation. I reject the catholic false church and  it's constituents who aren't ignorant are going to hell.

    Jesus is Lord.
    Vaulk
  • Hey Debra your obviously not an aid your an ar
  • @Vaulk @MayCaesar

    >>it is technically fair to say that Catholicism is part of Christianity. 
       
        In as much as it is technically fair to say that Islam is part of Christianity since they have a Jesus too. This is a loosely defined sense of the word and in use today and has lost its meaning.

    If defined as the religion derived from Jesus Christ, based on the Bible as sacred scripture, then Catholicism does not qualify. 

    The term best used to describe this organization, being far removed from the doctrines we find in Scripture, would be cult. They "the hierarchy" (not the laity, their victims) use Christianity as a mask to hide their true ambitions of wealth and power. They are no different from the Pagans read about in "Bel and the Dragon". 

    They sell forgiveness of sins for money, called indulgences, still in effect today in the form of mass cards in order to shorten time spent in the make believe place they call purgatory, how is this still in the realm of Christianity? If I put rocks in place of your cookies and still kept them in same cookie box are they now somehow classified as cookies? If I put chocolate chips on the rocks will those rocks now be part of the baked goods world? A cult is a cult, no matter what cover you put them in or how you dress them up.

    They in no way use the Bible to guide them, and only deceptively claim to derive different conclusions from it and interpret its passages differently. If someone believes that when the Bible says white and they say Black that this is somehow a legitimate interpretation, well that someone is welcome to entertain erroneous beliefs, but only deceive themselves.

    >>>There are no "true" or "false" Christians, there are just some groups of Christians disagreeing with other groups of Christians.

    That's the same as saying there are no "true" or 'false" teachers, there are just some groups of teachers disagreeing with other groups of teachers. Sorry, but the Bible contains unambiguous doctrines and if you entertain ideas that are contrary to those doctrines you are indeed false on a particular issue or an all out charlatan. Scripture is not made up of ambiguous suppositions as your trying to belittle it into. If not, use the Bible in it's entirety to justify the Co-Redemptrix role of Mary as claimed by the so called "Catholic church". 

    A cult is a cult. Roman Catholics, like the members of other cults, need to be treated with compassion, warned of cultic lies, and presented with the true gospel which alone can save them.

    Roman Catholic teachings did not originate with Christ or the Bible, but were adopted from ancient pagan Babylonian religion, and given Christian names...

    ...If the position I have laid down can be maintained, she must be stripped of the name of a Christian Church altogether; for if it was a Church of Christ that was convened on that night, when the pontiff-king of Babylon, in the midst of his thousand lords, "praised the gods of gold, and of silver, and of wood, and of stone" (Dan 5:4), then the Church of Rome is entitled to the name of a Christian Church; but not otherwise. - The Two Babylons by Alexander Hislop

      Rome's greatest enemy is God's Word. Rome's hostility to the free circulation of the Bible is a matter of history. Even to this day in Roman Catholic countries, the Bible is almost unknown, and the public burning the Bibles (sent out by the Bible Societies) in South America is an object lesson how she still seeks to hinder the circulation of God's own Book whenever she has the power. Bibles were burnt in Rome as recently as 1923, in the public street. - Heresies Exposed by William C Irvine
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