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Political correctness has gotten out of hand
in General

By all4acttall4actt 71 Pts
In the world we now live people have become overly sensitive to words. As for example Berekly, Ca. changing all gender specific words in their municipal codes, such as manhole changed to personhole.

https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.sfchronicle.com/bayarea/amp/Banned-words-Berkeley-drops-he-she-14102930.php

Demand for such changes to be made is rediculous.  Why do these words offend people?  Why are people that sensitive?

It has gotten to the point where you can't even be sure of what pronoun you should use because you may offend someone.

It is not just pronouns that are a problem it's what is considered politically correct to call a person on the basis' of their disability, race, sexual orientation, employment and many other classifications.  What is even worse is that the politically correct terms are constantly changing or are personal to whomever you are referring to. So you never really know if you are using the correct term or not.

Why can't things go back to the days where people weren't so outraged and sensitive about every little thing?
  1. Live Poll

    Are people becoming overly sensitive?

    11 votes
    1. Yes, people are being overly sensitive
      81.82%
    2. No, people are not being overly sensitive.
      18.18%



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  • Are you sure you're not the one who's gone mad with political correctness? You're the one that's complaining that they have to be called manholes or firemen.

    The article linked is about a rewording of municipal codes to be gender neutral. You don't get arrested for not doing it, it's just changing the norm and you're the one throwing a fit over it. 
    LibertineStates
  • Political Correctness? Now there's an oxymoron for morons.
    all4acttLibertineStatesAmericanFurryBoy

    “It is impossible for someone to lie unless he thinks he knows the truth. Producing bullsh*t requires no such conviction…”
    ― Ben Goldacre, Bad Science




  • @Ampersand

    Not in an uproar I just find it to be rediculous, unnecessary and probably expensive to have to make everything gender nuetral b/c some people are so ultra sensitive about words that are societal norms.  Really, who cares if the entrance to a sewer is called a manhole?  Is it really an offence to ones sensibilities?  

    There are so many other things to worry about in life.  Why are people so worried about things like this? Why make it an issue?
  • TKDBTKDB 290 Pts
    edited October 26
    Some examples of political correctness:

    An abortion clinic, being referred to as a Family Planning Center?

    A Sanctuary City giving sanctuary to some of the Illegal Immigrants that are in the United States illegally, and jeopardizing the Quality of Life, for the rest of the Law Abiding citizens, who are having the Illegal Immigrants being pushed unto the same Law Abiding citizens, in their own cities, because a Liberal Politician wrote a sanctuary law to appease the Illegal Immigrant supporters, and to garner future votes, from those same Illegal Immigrant supporters?

    Two prime examples of bizarre political correctness, at the cost of the Quality of Life standards, for the rest of the Public. 
    Zombieguy1987
  • It's only an issue if you make it one. Why should manholes not be called personholes? Is language not allowed to evolve or diversify because it is not 'edgy' or 'traditional' enough?

    Sorry, but it seems to me like you're making mountains out of personholes. As far as I know, there's no law here prohibiting usage of the word 'manhole', and any efforts towards that are not gaining much ground.
    CYDdharta
  • Indeed they are, and our language is being hijacked in the process.  San Fran has decided calling felons felons is too traumatic, instead they're to be referred to as "justice-involved individuals" or even "returning residents."  In fact, they're perverting the language so badly that;

    Someone whose car was broken into by a recently released offender, on parole with a drug problem; would be conveyed as

    A person who has come in contact with a returning resident who was involved with the justice system and who is currently under supervision with a history of substance use.



    all4acttLibertineStatesZombieguy1987
  • DeeDee 813 Pts
    I ignore these P C terms as they don’t impact me , I address people the way I always have and call objects as they are,  if anyone takes offense at such they can go F themselves
    ZeusAres42
  • MayCaesarMayCaesar 2030 Pts
    edited October 24
    As the quality of life in the society increases and life becomes easier, people naturally grow less resistant to psychological pressure, and it may come to the point where one single innocent word can psychologically upset the person. This is an unfortunate effect of the known pattern:

    Strong people create good times.
    Good times create weak people.
    Weak people create hard times.
    Hard times create strong people.

    Bear in mind though that all these rules are very arbitrary and hard to enforce. You do not have to speak in a way others expect you to. And while it is true that there are countries where "offensive" speech is prosecuted, and it is also true that the US might become such a country one day - in practice, in order to get in trouble, you need to say something really provocative, otherwise no one will bother suing you.
    I do not know any of those newspeak words and speak the same words as I always have. No issues so far. It is much less of a problem when you do not take these norms seriously, than when you do and feel the pressure to conform.

    Finally, note that the actual number of people who take those norms seriously is much smaller, than you would think. As always, media attract people's attention to marginal outrageous cases. Some ridiculous university administration recommended using the word "personhole" instead of "manhole", but thousands more university administrations did not. These are mostly irrelevant cases that will only bother you if you purposefully seek them out.
    대왕광개토Zombieguy1987LibertineStates
  •  We can't expect every word to remain as it is. Just like word 'negroes' has been changed to 'African-American,' many words will and do undergo changes in their names. Such kind of harmless word transformation doesn't seem harmful. However, I acknowledge that extreme PC that causes people who uses offensive words to get beaten, fired, or prosecuted is problematic. Today's PC quite often abandons peaceful way of convincing others of its values, and that is what those who support PC should fix. Apart from this, I think that those who deliberately use extremely offensive words are at least as problematic as extreme PC supporters. 
    LibertineStates
  • It's only an issue if you make it one. Why should manholes not be called personholes? Is language not allowed to evolve or diversify because it is not 'edgy' or 'traditional' enough?

    Sorry, but it seems to me like you're making mountains out of personholes. As far as I know, there's no law here prohibiting usage of the word 'manhole', and any efforts towards that are not gaining much ground.
    Isn't it an issue to the people who want to change certain words in the first place? Also, what's wrong with calling a personhole a manhole? It works both ways @LibertineStates

    With that being said, I personally do not have an issue whether someone calls an inspection chamber a manhole or a personhole.


    “It is impossible for someone to lie unless he thinks he knows the truth. Producing bullsh*t requires no such conviction…”
    ― Ben Goldacre, Bad Science




  • @all4actt

    Right, when other people have opinions avout how things should be named a certain way it's political correctness gone mad and ridiculous.

    When you do it, it's all good and fine.
  • The issue I do have is that I just don't like the phrase "Political Correctness." To me this phrase connotes dictatorship, control, totalitarianism, subservience to the state, preaching etc.

    On the other hand I much more prefer the phrase "Human Decency."  This phrase here to me connotes honesty, fairness, sensitivity to peoples needs, respectfulness, and so forth. 

    Stephen Fry says it best here:





    CYDdhartaLibertineStates

    “It is impossible for someone to lie unless he thinks he knows the truth. Producing bullsh*t requires no such conviction…”
    ― Ben Goldacre, Bad Science




  • @ZeusAres42

    I would say that decency and oversensitivity are mutually exclusive. There cannot be decency when people are afraid to say anything that could, by someone, be interpreted in a certain offensive way. There is human decency, which includes things like not throwing insults around and picking on people's looks/hobbies/sexuality, and then there is oversensitivity, which includes modifying regular English words, because a tiny fraction of the population *may* in theory misinterpret their meaning.

    It is right to follow general human norms and to not do things that are universally accepted as aggressive; it is wrong to purposefully look for something some people may randomly get offended by and censor one's own speech.

    Remember when Obama said that he played basketball as though he was on paralympic games, and a lot of media reporters lashed at him for being so insensitive? This is the kind of a situation that goes beyond the realm of expecting human decency. Picking on the guy for an innocent joke that makes logical sense, just because some disabled people might not like this attribution, is ridiculous. It is clear that Obama meant no offence and just wanted to make a joke, and everyone who still gets offended, or, even worse, takes offence on behalf of someone else, is being completely unreasonable.
    all4actt
  • MayCaesar said:
    @ZeusAres42

    I would say that decency and oversensitivity are mutually exclusive. There cannot be decency when people are afraid to say anything that could, by someone, be interpreted in a certain offensive way. There is human decency, which includes things like not throwing insults around and picking on people's looks/hobbies/sexuality, and then there is oversensitivity, which includes modifying regular English words, because a tiny fraction of the population *may* in theory misinterpret their meaning.
    If this was in reference to me making a statement that involved being sensitive to other people's needs then I would just like to point out that I do not put the terms "Sensitivity" and "oversensitivity" on the same par as one another.

    So, yeah, I agree people can be oversensitive at times. But, by the same token they can also be senseless.

    It is right to follow general human norms and to not do things that are universally accepted as aggressive; it is wrong to purposefully look for something some people may randomly get offended by and censor one's own speech.

    Remember when Obama said that he played basketball as though he was on paralympic games, and a lot of media reporters lashed at him for being so insensitive? This is the kind of a situation that goes beyond the realm of expecting human decency. Picking on the guy for an innocent joke that makes logical sense, just because some disabled people might not like this attribution, is ridiculous. It is clear that Obama meant no offence and just wanted to make a joke, and everyone who still gets offended, or, even worse, takes offence on behalf of someone else, is being completely unreasonable.

    I was unaware that Obama said this. However, I personally I think making jokes at the expense of disabled people especially in public are an indecent as well as an empty-headed thing to do. Sorry, but I do not call the reporters being oversensitive here; Obama made a stupid comment and should have known better.

    An example of something that I would call being oversensitive as well as ridiculous are people suggesting that "Manager" should be changed to "Personager." I am not sure if there are any advocates of this specifically, but there are examples out there as ludicrous as this particular one across the globe.


    CYDdhartaall4actt

    “It is impossible for someone to lie unless he thinks he knows the truth. Producing bullsh*t requires no such conviction…”
    ― Ben Goldacre, Bad Science





  • I was unaware that Obama said this. However, I personally I think making jokes at the expense of disabled people especially in public are an indecent as well as an empty-headed thing to do. Sorry, but I do not call the reporters being oversensitive here; Obama made a stupid comment and should have known better.



    That's about the same as people taking umbrage of Wesley Snipes, Woody Harrelson, Ron Shelton, and/or 20th Century Fox for producing a film titled "White Men Can't Jump".



    ZeusAres42LibertineStates
  • CYDdharta said:

    I was unaware that Obama said this. However, I personally I think making jokes at the expense of disabled people especially in public are an indecent as well as an empty-headed thing to do. Sorry, but I do not call the reporters being oversensitive here; Obama made a stupid comment and should have known better.



    That's about the same as people taking umbrage of Wesley Snipes, Woody Harrelson, Ron Shelton, and/or 20th Century Fox for producing a film titled "White Men Can't Jump".



    I'm afraid taking offence at something and finding something indecent are two different things. So, no, that's not the same as taking umbrage of a move called "White Men Jump."

    In short, ridiculing disabled people and producing a comedy called "White men can't jump" are miles apart from being analogous to one another.
    CYDdharta

    “It is impossible for someone to lie unless he thinks he knows the truth. Producing bullsh*t requires no such conviction…”
    ― Ben Goldacre, Bad Science




  • CYDdharta said:

    I was unaware that Obama said this. However, I personally I think making jokes at the expense of disabled people especially in public are an indecent as well as an empty-headed thing to do. Sorry, but I do not call the reporters being oversensitive here; Obama made a stupid comment and should have known better.



    That's about the same as people taking umbrage of Wesley Snipes, Woody Harrelson, Ron Shelton, and/or 20th Century Fox for producing a film titled "White Men Can't Jump".



    I'm afraid taking offence at something and finding something indecent are two different things. So, no, that's not the same as taking umbrage of a move called "White Men Jump."

    In short, ridiculing disabled people and producing a comedy called "White men can't jump" are miles apart from being analogous to one another.

    0bama was no more ridiculing disabled people than Snipes, Harrelson, Shelton, or 20th Century Fox was ridiculing white people.

    ZeusAres42
  • MayCaesarMayCaesar 2030 Pts
    edited October 25
    @ZeusAres42

    But it is a fact that disabled people are less capable at physical sports, in general, than regular people. Using it as part of one's joke is hardly indecent. It would be indecent to explicitly laugh at disabled people for that, but simply making attribution to this fact is hardly indecent, at least, in my eyes.

    I am a foreigner in the US, and I am completely fine with people making friendly jokes about my nationality or ethnicity and stereotypes associated with them.
    The world of fun opens before us when we stop taking offence over everything that was not intended to offend us in the first place, and start pumping each other up by making our differences less of a deal. It is when we take our differences seriously and become sensitive over them that the barriers between us start being erected, and we lose connection to each other.
    ZeusAres42
  • ZeusAres42ZeusAres42 685 Pts
    edited October 25
    MayCaesar said:
    @ZeusAres42

    But it is a fact that disabled people are less capable at physical sports, in general, than regular people. Using it as part of one's joke is hardly indecent. It would be indecent to explicitly laugh at disabled people for that, but simply making attribution to this fact is hardly indecent, at least, in my eyes.

    I am a foreigner in the US, and I am completely fine with people making friendly jokes about my nationality or ethnicity and stereotypes associated with them.
    The world of fun opens before us when we stop taking offence over everything that was not intended to offend us in the first place, and start pumping each other up by making our differences less of a deal. It is when we take our differences seriously and become sensitive over them that the barriers between us start being erected, and we lose connection to each other.
    When you put it like that you do have a point. I guess at times I too need to lightening up lol.

    On another note, I still ascribe to Stephen Fry's argument which is in part that it doesn't actually work as pointed out in a previous post. And another part being that some things that a great many of us would call political correctness now are actually just basic acts of human decency. Such as for example, treating others how you would want to be treated.

    “It is impossible for someone to lie unless he thinks he knows the truth. Producing bullsh*t requires no such conviction…”
    ― Ben Goldacre, Bad Science




  • @Ampersand When I do what? Ridicule the fact that some people have found it necessary to try and completely change the english language to appease the few who find it offensive to the point of actually making it an issue.My questions really are:  Why do people find commonly used nouns and pronouns so aggregious? Why they feel it so deeply that they make it an issue? Why do they expect the entire english speaking population to have to learn a new way of communicating?

    As @ZeusAres42 pointed out Stephen Fry's lecture is a great lecture about political correctnes.
  • all4actt said:


    As @ZeusAres42 pointed out Stephen Fry's lecture is a great lecture about political correctnes.
    Did you watch the video? I don't really think anyone on here has yet. I think some people might be assuming that Stephen Fry is arguing for political correctness which isn't the case. Pace some other people's possible assumptions Stephen Fry is actually arguing against it, and I just happen to think it's a great argument.

    “It is impossible for someone to lie unless he thinks he knows the truth. Producing bullsh*t requires no such conviction…”
    ― Ben Goldacre, Bad Science




  • @ZeusAres42

    I did watch it and I do know he was debating against political correctness.  I do think he makes good points.
    ZeusAres42
  • CYDdhartaCYDdharta 1203 Pts
    edited October 26
    This just seems apropos to the discussion;

    Motorcyclist Who Identifies As Bicyclist Sets Cycling World Record

    NEW YORK, NY—In an inspiring story from the world of professional cycling, a motorcyclist who identifies as a bicyclist has crushed all the regular bicyclists, setting an unbelievable world record.


    In a local qualifying race for the World Road Cycling League, the motorcyclist crushed the previous 100-mile record of 3 hours, 13 minutes with his amazing new score of well under an hour.

    Professional motorcycle racer Judd E. Banner, the brave trans-vehicle rider, was allowed to race after he told league organizers he's always felt like a bicyclist in a motorcyclist's body.

    "Look, my ride has handlebars, two wheels, and a seat," he told reporters as he accepted a trophy for his incredible time trial. "Just because I've got a little extra hardware, such as an 1170-cc flat-twin engine with 110 horsepower doesn't mean I have any kind of inherent advantage here."

    Banner also said he painted the word "HUFFY" on the side of his bike, ensuring he has no advantage over the bikes that came out of the factory as bicycles.

    Some critics say he needs to cut off his motor in order to make the competition fairer, but he quickly called these people bigots, and they were immediately banned from professional cycle racing.
    https://babylonbee.com/news/motorcycle-that-identifies-as-bicycle-sets-world-cycling-record

  • well duh
    The passion for destruction is also a creative passion. Mikhail Bakunin

  • Anyway, without getting into too much of a deep philosophical discussion about this I currently ascribe to the argument that Political Correctness does not work, as well as being against a centralized system of control. As adults, we do not need to be condescendingly preached on how to treat and be respectful to others. 

    In addition to the above I would also like to point out that political correctness is no more than a subjective sense of how one sees what is right or wrong in any given context. In short, it's not objective; and basically no more than an illusion, much like morality. Sorry, said I wasn't going to go deep but think I might have done a bit here haha.
    MayCaesarPlaffelvohfen

    “It is impossible for someone to lie unless he thinks he knows the truth. Producing bullsh*t requires no such conviction…”
    ― Ben Goldacre, Bad Science




  • Do you mean those things that are Culvert pipe covers?
  • @John_C_87

    No I meant the ones that give access to the sewers tunnels which I am fairly sure also access the street drainage too, but never having been down one I wouldn't know.
  • Oh! You me septic cover.
  • John_C_87 said:
    Oh! You me septic cover.
    No, he means manhole covers.
  • Well, this was rather amusing about political correctness.

    CYDdhartaall4actt

    “It is impossible for someone to lie unless he thinks he knows the truth. Producing bullsh*t requires no such conviction…”
    ― Ben Goldacre, Bad Science




  • @ZeusAres42

    Perfect example of how political correctmess has become rediculous and frustrating.
    ZeusAres42
  • CYDdhartaCYDdharta 1203 Pts
    edited November 6
    Yes, it does appear to be out of hand.



    all4actt
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