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scarey?

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if fear is instinctive, then how can it be an emotion?



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  • PlaffelvohfenPlaffelvohfen 3985 Pts   -  
    @maxx

    Instincts are preconditioned responses to stimuli while emotions are a perceptive state, they are how you feel about something.. 

    An emotional response is often an instinctual response, but an instinctual response is not always an emotional response, for example, babies turning their faces towards warmth, or rats turning towards certain scents. Instinctual responses can often have an emotional component, but do not necessarily entail one.

    Instinct and emotions are 2 terms that describe different processes and these processes are not mutually exclusive. Using your example, fear is an emotional component or expression of our survival instinct... 
    DeeZeusAres42
    " Adversus absurdum, contumaciter ac ridens! "
  • Experience is how fear becomes emotional.

  • maxxmaxx 1131 Pts   -  
    I think we are attaching a completely different emotion to fear; it is instinctive and it depends on what emotion we attach to it that depends on what kind of fear we experience . for example, one may attach anger to fear  or hate.  the fear is not an emotion, but  we put emotions onto instinctive behavior.@John_C_87
  • Okay …….
    Go on......
  • maxxmaxx 1131 Pts   -  
    that is about it, we are not born with emotions, just thje capacity to learn them, and fear is really the only thing we are born with@maxx
    Plaffelvohfen
  • Fear is an emotion that is the result of autonomic response to stimuli.



  • maxxmaxx 1131 Pts   -  
    fear is something we are born with so that makes it an instinct 

    @ZeusAres42
  • ZeusAres42ZeusAres42 Emerald Premium Member 2670 Pts   -   edited November 2019

    fear is something we are born with so that makes it an instinct

    Technically, it's not the fear that we're born with. It's a neurological response that is initiated upon perceived threats that result in the emotion known as fear. This can be said to be instinctive, sometimes for the right reasons as well as sometimes for the wrong reasons; hence a reason for common anxiety disorders.

    Moreover, all emotions are the result of a neurological and encephalon activity.




    Plaffelvohfen



  • maxxmaxx 1131 Pts   -  
    if you wish to bring it down to that level we are born with nothing but neurons firing until we learn something. i contend we are born with one emotion and that is fear; everything else is just what we learn from fear.  babies are not born knowing anything else but fear.@ZeusAres42
    ZeusAres42Dee
  • MayCaesarMayCaesar 5968 Pts   -  
    I think there is a difference between "physical fear" and "intellectual fear".

    "Physical fear" is something occurring purely on the instinctive level, where the human being fears something purely because their body reacts in a certain way to external stimuli - for example, when a human sees a bear in the wilds, they experience this strong fear, regardless of whether the bear presents a threat to them in reality, or not.

    "Intellectual fear" is something occurring as a result of human envisioning the future and seeing the possibility of negative outcome. It can arise, for example, when asking out an attractive person, or when talking to a boss about the raise: the human is not endangered in any meaningful way, however they envision the possibility of rejection and the negative consequences that come with it, cannot stop thinking about it and, hence, are strongly afraid of it.

    If you explore carefully your own physiology, you will notice that these two types of fears are felt differently. "Physical fear" is felt as a strong contraction and shiver; it is an almost irresistible feeling changing one's entire psychology, and a very harsh training is needed for one to learn to overcome the fear. "Intellectual fear", on the other hand, feels more like "butterflies" in the stomach, does not feature shiver, and the contraction occurs in a slightly different part of the body - this fear is much easier to overcome, and one can often do it without any training by just utilising their willpower.

    "Physical fear" is an instinctive feeling, and "intellectual fear" is an emotion. Our language, unfortunately, does not really distinguish between the two, although often "fear" refers to the "physical fear", and "intellectual fear" is called "anxiety".
  • ZeusAres42ZeusAres42 Emerald Premium Member 2670 Pts   -   edited November 2019
    maxx said:
     i contend we are born with one emotion and that is fear; everything else is just what we learn from fear.  babies are not born knowing anything else but fear.
    That's not correct either. Newborn babies do not have much fear of anything due to their  undeveloped and immature nervous system. 

    What they do have,  however, is a thing called Moro reflexes (AKA startle reflexes) which are mainly triggered by loud noises or the feeling of falling. 

    As the baby develops over a period of time more fears tend to develop such as separation anxiety for instance. @maxx


    PlaffelvohfenDee



  • maxxmaxx 1131 Pts   -  
    I have read both  sides of this issue and while it is true that the majority believe that fear is not present at birth, others claim that since we are born with specific hormones that trigger the fight/flight response, and since being startled cause our nerves to produce a reflex action which triggers these hormones, then this is the same as fear. even as an adult our reflexes occur just before our brain realizes it is scared. attempting to classify newborns as a bundle of nothing more than nerves and neurons is a bit mis- leading.  we are born with hormones that trigger certain processes of course, but we are also born with certain personality traits we inherit from our ancestors; such as being stubborn, or angry and so on. you seem to be saying that babies need to learn fear due to association with pain or a threat of something. as due to a constant conditioned reflexes which is an old fashioned idea. I am not going to go as far as to state, that once that baby is pulled from the warmth and safety of the womb, it is automatically afraid but it is possible. @ZeusAres42
    ZeusAres42
  • @MayCaesar

    MayCaesar said:
    I think there is a difference between "physical fear" and "intellectual fear".

    "Physical fear" is something occurring purely on the instinctive level, where the human being fears something purely because their body reacts in a certain way to external stimuli - for example, when a human sees a bear in the wilds, they experience this strong fear, regardless of whether the bear presents a threat to them in reality, or not.

    "Intellectual fear" is something occurring as a result of human envisioning the future and seeing the possibility of negative outcome. It can arise, for example, when asking out an attractive person, or when talking to a boss about the raise: the human is not endangered in any meaningful way, however they envision the possibility of rejection and the negative consequences that come with it, cannot stop thinking about it and, hence, are strongly afraid of it.

    If you explore carefully your own physiology, you will notice that these two types of fears are felt differently. "Physical fear" is felt as a strong contraction and shiver; it is an almost irresistible feeling changing one's entire psychology, and a very harsh training is needed for one to learn to overcome the fear. "Intellectual fear", on the other hand, feels more like "butterflies" in the stomach, does not feature shiver, and the contraction occurs in a slightly different part of the body - this fear is much easier to overcome, and one can often do it without any training by just utilising their willpower.

    "Physical fear" is an instinctive feeling, and "intellectual fear" is an emotion. Our language, unfortunately, does not really distinguish between the two, although often "fear" refers to the "physical fear", and "intellectual fear" is called "anxiety".
    What you're describing by intellectual fear denotes to our cognition. Therefore, I think it might be more apt to call "intellectual fear" "cognitive" fear instead.

    Moreover, I think we need to classify the overall distinction between fear and anxiety, albeit they are very similar. "Anxiety is a vague unpleasant emotional state with qualities of apprehension, dread, distress, and uneasiness. In addition it is objectless. Fear is similar to anxiety except that fear has a specific object" (Carissa Kelvens, spring 1997, http://www.csun.edu/~vcpsy00h/students/fear.htm).

    Furthermore, both fear and anxiety are not something that we're just born with. In fact, they denote three major perspectives which are biological, cognitive and behavioral/learning perspectives.  It is also important to note that these perspectives are also often very complimentary.

    Also, the physiological response to stimuli which refers to the biological aspect is pretty much the same generally speaking, whether the fear is triggered by something internal i.e. our cognition or something external such as something going around us. In essence, we feel the same physical feelings of fear and anxiety regardless of them being internal or external. Of course, everyone is an individual and will experience differentiating symptoms from one another, however, the physiological mechanism is the same regardless of internal or external events.

    To conclude, the physiological response to stimuli upon perceived threats is instinctive, while fear and anxiety, in general, bespeak all biological, cognitive and learning/behavioral perspectives. Some of these fears and/or anxieties are irrational while other types serve us well from an evolutionary survival standpoint. 

    References and Further reading:





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