There are two genders change my mind.....

AlofRI

I wouldn't try. You have your mind made up. Instead I'll rely on the learned experts that are not intimidated by, or under the control of, ancient ideologies. I would not go by the insistence of people who say this planet is 6000 years old, that only God can appear from nothing and eating an apple turned the world into a sinful place. 
HUMANS …. keep an open mind and continue to learn. Good god!

Nope

mannyfritz18
If you are taking about reproductive biological traits then I think you are taking about an individuals sex. Gender is often about the social and cultural factors not biological.

mannyfritz18

Part of my reasoning is based off of ancient ideologies but also is proof from science that there are 2 genders.... also I am open to here the other side and what they think of this topic... plus the world became a sinful place not because of god but the sinful actions of the disobeience of Adam and Eve doing directly against of what he told them too God didn't create a sinful atmosphere and there are many reasons to show that god exists and also those believe in a THEORY (Big bang Theory) of which came from a speck of dust which caused a "bang" and began the universe as "we" know it so from that theory I don't know if you believe in that also comes from nothing... There are also many of instances of where god has helped others and made life better for others yes bad things happen, but they are all apart of his plan!!!

mannyfritz18

@AlofRI Gender is said to be different from sex, but also Gender is based off of sex and you can't control what you are, but you can say you're now a male or female, but truly you are what you're born as and that is what I believe is that you cannot truly change what you are based off of feelings of what you are I am going call that person on what you are based off of a biological standpoint. 

Happy_Killbot

@mannyfritz18
Unlike some, I will try because I consider this topic to mundane to take seriously.

Not everyone is born XX or XY some are born XXY, a condition known as Klinefelter syndrome:
https://ghr.nlm.nih.gov/condition/klinefelter-syndrome

Gender is different from sex. Sex is determined by biology, which is far simpler than the human mind. Gender is based on who you are, so it is based on neurobiology which is the study of the brain as a physical organ. The brain and the genitals form at different times during pregnancy, so differences in hormones or genetic sensitivity to certain chemicals can lead to gender dysphoria, or the condition where someone who believes they are a different sex from what they are biologically.


I am an agnostic atheist, however I was raised Christian and I find it hard to understand why so many Christians would be opposed to someone being who they are. The bible says: Psalms 139:13 "For you created my inmost being; you knit me together in my mother's womb." and repeats a similar theme in a number of places, such as in Galatians 1:15, Judges 16:17, and Jeremiah 1:5. In all situations, the message is clear. If you believe in the Abrahamic god depicted in the bible, he created everyone to be who they are, and because science shows that individuals with gender dysphoria are indeed something separate from the two traditional genders, it would therefore follow, that god created them to be who they are, and it would only be reasonable from this perspective that there should be more than two genders the way god intended.

mannyfritz18

@Happy_Killbot thank you for taking this topic seriously yes there are people born with this RARE disease but it also is a rare situation and is the only situation that is acceptable for them to identify as either and yes the bible does state that in those verses, but god created man and women, Adam and Eve for a reason and from my standpoint yes he created you to be who your are and that's true, but also remember he created just a man and women for a reason...

Sex is what you're born as biologically but gender is what you identify yes I get those differences, but gender is based off of sex and yes you can call yourself whatever you want to call yourself whatever you call yourself, but I am going to call you what you were born as man or woman. 

xlJ_dolphin_473

There are two sexes, correct. But there are not two genders. Here is the definition of gender.
Either of the two sexes (male and female), especially when considered with reference to social and cultural differences rather than biological ones.
And here is the definition of sex (meaning male/female rather than sexual intercourse).
Either of the two main categories (male and female) into which humans and most other living things are divided on the basis of their reproductive functions.
They are different. Gender is a social term. Sex is a purely biological term. Socially there is about 5 genders, male, female, genderfluid, bigender and pangender. Not to mention nonconformist, agender and simply 'other'. Confused yet?

MayCaesar

XX and XY chromosomes are not the only ones you can be born with. Regardless, it is irrelevant to your questions: gender in biology is determined by a variety of factors, with chromosomes being just one of them.

Biologists typically split animals in genders based on their roles in reproduction: females give birth and males do not. I am oversimplifying it, as not every female gives - or even capable to give - birth, but that is the gist of it. From this perspective, depending on the species, there can be 1 or 2 genders, but no more and no less. There are certain species considered genderless or genderfluid, but they still can be put into one or two genders somewhat informally.

Gender roles are a different thing entirely, and there can be infinity of them, in principle. For the purposes of human interaction it makes more sense to categorise people by genders based on the roles they play in the society, so you *could* say that there are more than two genders socially, albeit it would be a non-scientific statement.

mannyfritz18

@xlJ_dolphin_473 I am not confused I just believe sex and gender are dependent upon each other and sex yes is what you are biologically which I believe is what gender goes along with what you are biologically I am not going to call someone who is born a MAN a woman or vice versa a woman born a WOMAN a man because that is not what they are sorry if you disagree with that, but I firmly believe that if you're born with 2 X chromosomes you are a female and if you have an XY pair of chromosomes you are a male there are some instances where someone is born with a disorder where they have an XXY chromosome pair which again is a rarity and I don't believe gender is something that you can change because if you're born a man you're a man or born a woman you're born a woman it's that simple. 

mannyfritz18

@MayCaesar This whole conversation is based on humans not animals so I don't see the need to bring animals into this and a big factor on what your gender is dependent on is chromosomes XX, XY, and RARELY XXY which again is VERY rare and as children we are taught people have 10 fingers and yet there are rarities to where people can have 11-12 fingers as we are taught there are XX, and XY chromosomes and there is a rarity to where people are born with the XXY pair of chromosomes and we are also taught there are 2 genders as we grow up MALE and FEMALE not an infinite amount of genders and I don't recognize others as what they identify as because I am not modifying biology it effects the someone subjective opinion on what they believe they are and you're born as male or female no other option, and you shouldn't be able to identify to whatever you want to identify as. 

We_are_accountable

@AlofRI

Do you mean like your first single cell magically appeared from nothing? Do you ever think before spewing your hate towards Christians?

You are the biggest Science denier on this site. You actually think that Homosexuality is a natural normal sexual orientation. Take Biology once again because you have been brainwashed by LGBT activists and the Democrat Party.
 Good God!

We_are_accountable

@mannyfritz18

You are speaking common sense, and the Democrats tearing you down for stating the obvious, are anti Christian bigots who are rebelling against God and Christians.

They are denying the Science of Biolgy because of their hatred towards Christianity. How insecure can people be to believe this LGBT lunacy? It's all about rebelling against Christianity because God had the nerve to say that Homosexuality was a sin. They can't handle God or Science not embracing their disorder.

The people going through dangerous surgeries and life long drug use are finding out that their sex change has not brought the peace they craved. They have disorders, and rather than getting help, the Left allows these people to beleive that dangerous sex change surgeries will make them feel good about themselves.

Doctors and Phycologists have been threatened, and taken to court if they do not sanction Transgenderism and Homosexuality as natural normal sexual orientations. It's truly sick how the Democrat Party has given LGBT activists the power to force their agendas on our nation and our children. Democrats can't give a speech without cheer leading LGBT groups.

Plaffelvohfen

I personally think gender to be fundamentally irrelevant (except grammatically) and I find it fascinating that some people will make such a fuss about something irrelevant...

MayCaesar

@mannyfritz18

So you are just going to ignore all points I have made and repeat the same thing you said before? Nobody can change your mind when this is your approach.

Humans are animals; mammals, to be specific. The attribution to animals is relevant, because the concept of gender is universal to all animals; it is not special when it comes to humans in any way.

mannyfritz18

@MayCaesar I am not repeating what I am saying I made a complete new point to you by bringing up our conversation is not about animals but the fact of humans and there only 2 genders and animals don't have the brain capacity to go out and decide to change their gender I believe that firmly animals "mammals" don't have that capacity... and also brought up other points on what we are taught as children so............

Plaffelvohfen

@MayCaesar

because the concept of gender is universal to all animals

?? You'll have to explain this to me... I understand gender as a mental and social construct, not all mammals (in fact, at the moment I can't think of any other than humans) have the ability to conceptualize those sort of high abstractions...

MichaelElpers

The way i understand it gender and sex originally were virtually interchangeable until feminism and liberal humanities changed the meaning to fit a narrative.This can be seen by the fact that when medical professions and nearly everything else asked for sex or gender, male and female were the responses.
My own ethics professor got mad that there were pink and purple legos specifically placed in the girls section because that is only a social construct.  How about its just marketing and thats what the majority of girls like. You think patriarchy cared enough about what color you like enough to force it into a social fabric.  No one cares and boys are free to buy those legos.

I  thought we had words to describe women and men who strayed from the regular gender contructs...tomboy,  feminine men, ect. We had a word to describe your specific identity and we called it personality.
Also dont understand how one can be bigender if it exists on a spectrum.  Bi would indicate that there are 2.

I dont frankly care what they want to change the definition to, but politics they try to push by doing it, such as men and women are only different because of social construct and allowing the opposite sex to enter bathrooms just by claiming to be gender fluid is ridiculous.

Plaffelvohfen

@MichaelElpers

On this whole thing of gender, I think that language relates to this a lot... Do you know a bit of french? I'm a native speaker and unlike English, all french nouns also have a gender: masculine or feminine, sometimes both... In french, a fly is always feminine regardless of the actual sex of said fly... A table is always feminine while a bed is always masculine... Morality is feminine, communism is masculine, Love is masculine when singular but feminine when plural, our whole language is like that... 

The point I'm trying to make, or rather the question I ask is, could english be limiting the mental space to manage the concept of gender? I've been speaking french my whole life, it permeates my thinking patterns, to me the very idea of gender is ontologically fluid because of the language I grew up speaking... To hear people say that gender is not fluid is extremely weird to me...

Happy_Killbot

@mannyfritz18

mannyfritz18 said:

@Happy_Killbot thank you for taking this topic seriously yes there are people born with this RARE disease but it also is a rare situation and is the only situation that is acceptable for them to identify as either and yes the bible does state that in those verses, but god created man and women, Adam and Eve for a reason and from my standpoint yes he created you to be who your are and that's true, but also remember he created just a man and women for a reason...

Sex is what you're born as biologically but gender is what you identify yes I get those differences, but gender is based off of sex and yes you can call yourself whatever you want to call yourself whatever you call yourself, but I am going to call you what you were born as man or woman. 

As to the Adam and Eve aspect of the creation story, I would simply ask that you put yourself in the shoes of your creator for a second, and desire to populate the earth with people.

If you were to make two people who were to be the mother and father of all humans, you would want them to be male and female, as well as have a gender which matches their biological nature, so that they would have both the motivation and the capability to populate the world, because if they were not then they would not want to or would be incapable of having kids. Thus there is a perfectly valid reason for God as depicted in the book of Genesis to create just a man and woman, which doesn't violate the possibility that other genders could exist.

I think the assumption that gender and sex much match stems from two assumptions, one is that the world should make sense and be simple, and the second is that those who claim to be a gender separate from what they are either lying or delusional.

As to the first assumption, I too would rather things were simple rather than complex, but I understand that the world is far beyond my personal capacity for knowledge and far to complex to ever be understood by everyone, let alone one person.

The second assumption is a little trickier, because it is apparent that some people are indeed, pretending for attention or are delusional, however I am not convinced that this is true in all cases, and because clinical conditions appear in transsexuals that disappear with treatment, namely sex reassignment surgery or therapy, I find it hard to believe that there is not something fundamentally different about these individuals which would be sufficient to deserve a unique semantic identity.

Speaking of semantics, and this isn't the most relevant to the debate but just something interesting, is there are languages that have as part of their structure many more than just three genders, and some that have none. For example, the Tuyuca language has 140 noun classes which serve the same semantic role that genders do in English. I know that this isn't exactly what we are talking about, but hey, some languages have a gender for peeling wood and knowing something.

mannyfritz18

@Plaffelvohfen That's a strong argument and I get where you're coming from and I don't believe gender is fluid I'm sorry if you disagree, but to me gender is not fluid because there is only 2 given genders and 2 given sexes we learn that as we grow up maybe the way you grew up and the way you talk influences the way you think and talk and that may be weird for you, but for me it is a very normal thing and based off of my principles as I grew up is that there are only 2 genders.

Plaffelvohfen

@mannyfritz18

So neither of us can be demonstrated to be objectively wrong then, is that what you conclude?

mannyfritz18

@Happy_Killbot There are some key differences those trans individuals struggle with some mental health issues involving depression and anxiety and which have lead to many suicides, and many of them reach out for help or some sort of treatment for those mental health issues they are having.
https://medicine.yale.edu/news-article/21447/ 

I do not believe that they go out to seek attention or a delusional I believe they are simply confused on what they are and maybe that's how their feeling, but I truly still believe there are only 2 genders no more than 2 and maybe its acceptable in other cultures as you brought up with Tuyuca language and by which is setting a socially acceptable thing in our culture and now is expected to accepted by our culture. As slavery was acceptable at one sets that standard to where that is also okay or a new thing our topic that is acceptable. These two topic have no relation, but gives an example of how different things are set in society as okay, but are not really okay because it really doesn't matter what other socities values are so we have to start to accept them. There are 2 genders and there are really no other option but the 2 again male and female.

Happy_Killbot

@mannyfritz18 Just to clarify a previous point, when I say that some people might be pretending or delusional, I mean this the same way that some people (annoyingly) pretend to have allergies for example. Someone might use this as an excuse to get out of a lunch with someone they just don't like, but they won't go as far as to pretend to have a life threatening reaction.

Let's suppose that we created a new gender. I'm a huge sci-fi nerd, so lets say that in the future some technology makes it so that there are people who are capable of giving birth through parthenogenesis (basically they give birth to a clone of themselves, some fish and lizards do this) or make it so that more than two people are needed to make a baby, possibly through some advanced DNA mixing (what I mean is that three or more people could have a baby that would be theirs)

All these examples are not as far fetched as you might think, already there are ways that it could be done within known science, and as pointed out parthenogenesis exists in nature, so presumably it is possible to somehow make it happen in humans.

This all begs the question: If it is theoretically possible to produce new sexes, should it also therefore be possible for more than two genders to exist?

mannyfritz18

@Happy_Killbot Theoretically is the main word definition "1 : existing only in theory : hypothetical gave as an example a theoretical situation. 2a : relating to or having the character of theory : abstract. b : confined to theory or speculation often in contrast to practical applications : speculative theoretical physics." and it is not possible to create new sexes nor is it possible to create new genders just because it's a theoretical situation doesn't mean that it can happen and I don't see why you would bring something that cannot happen like theoretically creating a new sex which can never happen and the topic being that there are two genders which sex determines gender and gender is a topic that is opinionated, but really in reality there are two genders proven scientifically proven through biology and the make up of every human that has ever been born on this earth. 

CYDdharta

There are 2 sexes.  There are as many genders as people will delude themselves into believing in.

CYDdharta

Plaffelvohfen said:

@MichaelElpers

The point I'm trying to make, or rather the question I ask is, could english be limiting the mental space to manage the concept of gender? I've been speaking french my whole life, it permeates my thinking patterns, to me the very idea of gender is ontologically fluid because of the language I grew up speaking... To hear people say that gender is not fluid is extremely weird to me...

Have you ever considered that it's the other way around, that your French vocabulary has corrupted your way of thinking?  I don't know any French, but I've had enough German to know what you're describing.  It has never made any sense to me why "garden" is masculine or "door" is feminine.

xlJ_dolphin_473

mannyfritz18 said:

@xlJ_dolphin_473 I am not confused I just believe sex and gender are dependent upon each other and sex yes is what you are biologically which I believe is what gender goes along with what you are biologically I am not going to call someone who is born a MAN a woman or vice versa a woman born a WOMAN a man because that is not what they are sorry if you disagree with that, but I firmly believe that if you're born with 2 X chromosomes you are a female and if you have an XY pair of chromosomes you are a male there are some instances where someone is born with a disorder where they have an XXY chromosome pair which again is a rarity and I don't believe gender is something that you can change because if you're born a man you're a man or born a woman you're born a woman it's that simple. 

Well, you are entitled to your belief, but most people around you are going to disagree. What about transgender people? If someone was a man, for example, and then got surgery to become a trans woman, would you call them a man?  No. Of course not. Although they are still biologically a man, they have changed their social position to become a woman, and we must respect that. Sex and gender are not mutually dependent.

MayCaesar

mannyfritz18 said:

@MayCaesar I am not repeating what I am saying I made a complete new point to you by bringing up our conversation is not about animals but the fact of humans and there only 2 genders and animals don't have the brain capacity to go out and decide to change their gender I believe that firmly animals "mammals" don't have that capacity... and also brought up other points on what we are taught as children so............

You repeated the chromosome part, which, as I explained, does not define gender. In fact, if it did, then, by your own reasoning, you would have to conclude that there are more than 2 genders, since there are more than 2 possible chromosomes - and it absolutely does not matter how rare some of them are, it is sufficient that they exist.

Once again, humans are animals; if our conversation is about humans, then it is about animals. "Gender" is a fairly broad term, and without comparing human genders with those of other animals the term becomes fairly meaningless.

I fail to see what the capacity to change gender has to do with existence of genders.

What we are taught as children is quite irrelevant; we are taught a lot of different things. What matters is what the facts are.

MayCaesar

Plaffelvohfen said:

?? You'll have to explain this to me... I understand gender as a mental and social construct, not all mammals (in fact, at the moment I can't think of any other than humans) have the ability to conceptualize those sort of high abstractions...

Do not underestimate other mammals; you would be surprised at their level of understanding of gender roles. Many mammals, for example, will organise themselves to defend fertile females to the death, and do so with extreme efficiency. Mammals also have very intricate courting habits which are strongly gender-dependent.

Humans are quite late to the party; gender roles are likely hundreds millions years old.

MichaelElpers

@Plaffelvohfen. It seems like the french language is only assigning 2 different genders then.  It either relates more to a female or a male.  Many languages do this, for example spanish often ends in a relating to female while male o.

If they thought those existed on a spectrum youd think the language would have nuance to those, like holding the signifying vowel longer if it was more female or male.

To me if gender is fluid and people are using that to describe their identity the term really loses it meaning.  I feel as though that would mean i have to classify myself accordingly with something like im 91.2% male and 8.9% female according to societal norms, which is just dumb. If anything this will also just make us define male and female roles even more, which is the opposite of what most of the proponents want. Everyone is an individual with different personalities, i dont think gender is the term used to describe that.

mannyfritz18

@xlJ_dolphin_473 Even with the surgery they are still a man as you said biologically a man I will continue to call them a man because that's the way  they were born and that's what they are.

mannyfritz18

@MayCaesar This conversation is regarding to the only 2 genders in humans never did I did bring other animals or mammals into the conversation I don't see the need to bring other animals into this conversation when its solely based off of humans... If you're basing your view of gender off of facts which the facts are that in humans that there are two genders biologically which biology is based off of facts and science so in that way you are contradicting your beliefs by saying you're basing your view off of the facts and saying that there are more than two genders which is not factually true, but science is true and factually proves that there are two genders.

xlJ_dolphin_473

mannyfritz18 said:

@xlJ_dolphin_473 Even with the surgery they are still a man as you said biologically a man I will continue to call them a man because that's the way  they were born and that's what they are.

What? So you will disrespect their societal position simply because of what they were at birth? Just because you used to be someone doesn't mean you continue to be that person. For example if someone robs a bank that does not make them a bank robber for life. They may serve their due prison sentence of 2 to 7 years, and then come out and become a perfectly nice, normal, non-criminal human being. Do you not agree?

xlJ_dolphin_473

MichaelElpers said:

@Plaffelvohfen. It seems like the french language is only assigning 2 different genders then.  It either relates more to a female or a male.  Many languages do this, for example spanish often ends in a relating to female while male o.

If they thought those existed on a spectrum youd think the language would have nuance to those, like holding the signifying vowel longer if it was more female or male.

To me if gender is fluid and people are using that to describe their identity the term really loses it meaning.  I feel as though that would mean i have to classify myself accordingly with something like im 91.2% male and 8.9% female according to societal norms, which is just dumb. If anything this will also just make us define male and female roles even more, which is the opposite of what most of the proponents want. Everyone is an individual with different personalities, i dont think gender is the term used to describe that.

91.2 and 8.9 do not add up to 100. Your mathematics is flawed. Sorry. Many languages, English included, have no gender, and many others have gender-neutral versions of nouns.

MichaelElpers

@xlJ_dolphin_473. Lol whoops meant 8.8, but the point still stands.

Also i was responding to someone who was claiming his language agreed with fluidity, by assigning genders to words.  Gender neutral also doesnt display any proof that gender in on a spectrum.

You didnt respond to any of my arguments.

xlJ_dolphin_473

MichaelElpers said:

@xlJ_dolphin_473. Lol whoops meant 8.8, but the point still stands.

Also i was responding to someone who was claiming his language agreed with fluidity, by assigning genders to words.  Gender neutral also doesnt display any proof that gender in on a spectrum.

You didnt respond to any of my arguments.

Well which of your arguments did I not respond to?

Plaffelvohfen

@MichaelElpers

I didn't mean fluid as a "spectrum", what I mean is that gender is not a physical characteristic that relates exclusively to determined sex since I can ascribe it to objects, ideas, etc... My main point regarding this issue is that gender appears to me as inherently irrelevant as both biological determinate sexes (female/male) can play any gender role...  I see no point to it except with regards to language and even then only as a matter of aesthetics.as in the musicality of language... In any case, it's totally arbitrary really... Why should anybody care that someone identifies as a he/she/it/whatever? 

MichaelElpers

@Plaffelvohfen. If gender can be applied to almost anything, what is a gender role.  You say it is not attached to sex but then use gender role as if to mean normally male/female which seems to contradict.

Again i dont really care except when people use it to call hate speech if you get a pronoun wrong, use it to play the victim, and use these dumb expressions to institute policies like letting men play sports or letting the opposite sex enter lockerooms/restrooms. The english language is complicated enough, come up with your own singular pronoun fine but using they for a singular person doesnt make since (sounds like schizophrenia) and dont blow up if someone gets it wrong..
Thats asking for someone to stereotype you and get it right everytime.

MichaelElpers

@xlJ_dolphin_473

Do you not agree if it exists on a spectrum that is how we should be saying our gender?

Would this not just make us have to define male/female roles more than we already do?  I thought we were supposed to be getting rid of traditional roles.

According most many gender proponents men and women are the same, patriarchal society has made us different...why would you want to identify yourself on a societal spectrum you believe to be corrupt patriarchal hogwash.

How can one be bigender if on a spectrum?

xlJ_dolphin_473

MichaelElpers said:

@xlJ_dolphin_473

Do you not agree if it exists on a spectrum that is how we should be saying our gender?

Would this not just make us have to define male/female roles more than we already do?  I thought we were supposed to be getting rid of traditional roles.

According most many gender proponents men and women are the same, patriarchal society has made us different...why would you want to identify yourself on a societal spectrum you believe to be corrupt patriarchal hogwash.

How can one be bigender if on a spectrum?

If one is bigender, one is at both ends of the spectrum simultaneously. The society I live in is not patriarchal, so that doesn't really apply. 

MichaelElpers

@xlJ_dolphin_473. That answers 1.5 questions, but how in the world does existing at complete opposite ends of the spectrum at the same time make any sense.  I didnt know something could be boiling and freezing or someone could be mad and happy at the same moment.

According to most proponents all societies are patriarchal because how long men have ruled.

MayCaesar

mannyfritz18 said:

@MayCaesar This conversation is regarding to the only 2 genders in humans never did I did bring other animals or mammals into the conversation I don't see the need to bring other animals into this conversation when its solely based off of humans... If you're basing your view of gender off of facts which the facts are that in humans that there are two genders biologically which biology is based off of facts and science so in that way you are contradicting your beliefs by saying you're basing your view off of the facts and saying that there are more than two genders which is not factually true, but science is true and factually proves that there are two genders.

I brought up other animals to explain what gender scientifically is and where this concept comes from. If you only look at humans, then you will not reach any conclusion: gender is bigger than humans, and is not defined for humans specifically.

I did not say there are more than two genders; I said the exact opposite. Re-read my first comment: there is a difference between gender as a biological term, and gender role as a social term. There is infinity of potentially possible gender roles, but there can only be two genders by definition - however, the definition does not have anything to do with chromosomes, and there are only two genders for a very different reason.

Happy_Killbot

@mannyfritz18

mannyfritz18 said:

@Happy_Killbot Theoretically is the main word definition "1 : existing only in theory : hypothetical gave as an example a theoretical situation. 2a : relating to or having the character of theory : abstract. b : confined to theory or speculation often in contrast to practical applications : speculative theoretical physics." and it is not possible to create new sexes nor is it possible to create new genders just because it's a theoretical situation doesn't mean that it can happen and I don't see why you would bring something that cannot happen like theoretically creating a new sex which can never happen and the topic being that there are two genders which sex determines gender and gender is a topic that is opinionated, but really in reality there are two genders proven scientifically proven through biology and the make up of every human that has ever been born on this earth. 

I'm sorry, but I'm having a lot of trouble understanding what you are trying to say, because your argument doesn't make any sense.

When something is theoretical, that doesn't mean that it can't be true, for example general relativity is a theory, but if we didn't take relativistic effects into consideration, GPS satellites wouldn't work.

When I say it is theoretically possible to give humans a third or more sexes, I mean we have no reason to think it couldn't be possible, and since it already exists in nature such as the example of lizards, it already is real, just not in humans.

On another note, and I hate to get back into semantics, but English already has three genders, male, female, and neuter. If there are only two genders, than what gender should a toaster be?

xlJ_dolphin_473

MichaelElpers said:

@xlJ_dolphin_473. That answers 1.5 questions, but how in the world does existing at complete opposite ends of the spectrum at the same time make any sense.  I didnt know something could be boiling and freezing or someone could be mad and happy at the same moment.

According to most proponents all societies are patriarchal because how long men have ruled.

All right, some societies used to be patriarchal, but no longer are. America is an example of this. Others were never patriarchal, and women had the vote, equal pay, etc... right from the start. I do not think it is useful to think about a spectrum when it comes to gender. It is just not a very good analogy.

onethinhandle56

 

A_Lesbian_Libral

Hello there! I see you have already debated with others on this topic, but I'm wondering if I could debate with you as well. Although I am new here, and my arguments may not be up to par with others, I consider myself a passionate young woman who stands up for what I believe in. May we please debate this topic?

RickeyD

@A_Lesbian_Libral ;  Why not debate our Creator...maybe you could change His mind as well?

MichaelElpers

@A_Lesbian_Libral. If you want an actual debate instead of constant religious quotes you can debate me instead.

MayCaesar

@RickeyD

Except it is not the creator's mind, but the minds of those people who invented the concept of a creator. You are literally reading what other humans wrote and prescribing it divine properties... Is there nothing wrong with it, in your opinion?

As Feynman once said, "I would rather have questions that cannot be answered than answers that cannot be questioned". Everything can be and should be debated, and if something is not up to debate, then that something does not belong in the space of collective human knowledge.