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how many genders are there?
in Science

By joecavalryjoecavalry 425 Pts
How many generals are there?
lsmith5177
  1. Live Poll

    ?

    23 votes
    1. 2
      78.26%
    2. More than 2
      21.74%
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  • DeeDee 1905 Pts
    edited April 21
    2 , unless you’re a ......

    Absorbgender: A gender that changes to conform to the genders of those around you. As you are around more people, even if some leave, they continue to add to the genders you feel. You remain as the genders that you have taken in until you hit a max of some sort. At that point you become like a blank slate, being only one gender (it doesn’t have to be agender or neutral, it can be any gender and the base gender can be different each time).

    If you absorb one gender more easily than other genders, you can replace gender in the term with the gender you absorb best. Like absorgirl, absornonbinary, absordemiboy, etc.



    • Hydrogender: a gender which shares qualities with water
    • Existigender: a gender that only exists or feels present when thought about or when a conscious effort is made to notice it
    • Venngender: when two genders overlap creating an entirely new gender; like a Venn diagram

    Or maybe a ....

    demisexual is a person who does not experience sexual attraction unless they form a strong emotional connection with someone. It's more commonly seen in but by no means confined to romantic relationships.

    xlJ_dolphin_473
  • @Dee
    is there a place that I could learn more about this kind of thing? Like a government agencies website or a healthcare providers website?
    Not every quote you read on the internet is true- Abraham Lincoln
  • DeeDee 1905 Pts
  • gbn1002gbn1002 15 Pts
    There are two genders. Male. Female. These genders are assigned in your genetic code and can not be changed. Just the same as you can not change your age. A woman who identified as a man would not be taken to hospital as a man should she be in a car accident. They will treat her by her biological gender which is unchangeable because men and women are different beyond just their genitals. The idea of there being more than 2 genders (which there have been for all of human history) is complete insanity and should be considered as a mental illness. 
    FatherTedcatfishedoneSav_fowler
  • Happy_KillbotHappy_Killbot 1824 Pts
    edited April 23
    @gbn1002 ;

    What about people with two XYY chromosomes, or XXY, a condition known as klinefelter syndrome?

    If it is in your genetics, then these ought to be other genders as well right?

    Also, what about other objects that don't have genes?

    What gender is a toaster if there are only male and female?

    The fact is, English has 3 genders, male, female, neuter. So already there are more than 2.
    PlaffelvohfenZeusAres42xlJ_dolphin_473
    At some point in the distant past, the universe went through a phase of cosmic inflation, Stars formed, planets coalesced, and on at least one of them life took root and developed into the human race, who conquered fire, built societies and developed technology .
    All of that so we can argue about nothing.
  • WinstonCWinstonC 163 Pts
    @Happy_Killbot "What about people with two XYY chromosomes, or XXY, a condition known as klinefelter syndrome?"

    Given that we are talking about gender as a sociocultural phenomenon rather than biological sex per se, what are the sociocultural expectations of an XYY or XXY person? What are the features of these gender roles/identities?

    "The fact is, English has 3 genders, male, female, neuter. So already there are more than 2."

    If something is said to not have a gender, why would that be another gender, instead of merely a lack of gender?
    FatherTed
  • @FatherTed ;

    If you accept that errors in the genetic code do result in occasional mutations in the sex chromosomes, then then this rebuttal renders the claim made by @gbn1002 " There are two genders. Male. Female. These genders are assigned in your genetic code and can not be changed." is null and void.

    In this case, there is no evidence provided thus far to suggest that there are less than 3 genders. Remember, gender is not the same as sex. In fact, the word gender comes from the Latin word "genus" which you will recognize is the same as the English word genus indicating different varieties of closely related organisms. The meaning of the word has changed, with the Latin root meaning something more like birth, family, or nation.

    It is important that you do not conflate the two. There are 2 sexes in human beings, male and female, but that does not mean that there are only 2 genders, as I have pointed out with inanimate objects, which do have a gender, and are therefore relevant to this discussion. In any case, there are organisms that are asexual, for example some plants, sea sponges and some jellyfish. At any rate, these organisms, who are asexual, need a gender anyways. Thus the problem is not dimminished.
    At some point in the distant past, the universe went through a phase of cosmic inflation, Stars formed, planets coalesced, and on at least one of them life took root and developed into the human race, who conquered fire, built societies and developed technology .
    All of that so we can argue about nothing.
  • @WinstonC ;
    Given that we are talking about gender as a sociocultural phenomenon rather than biological sex per se, what are the sociocultural expectations of an XYY or XXY person? What are the features of these gender roles/identities?
    The point of the statement is as a rebuttal to the notion that biology is the determining factor in gender. There is no claim here about sociocultural expectations beyond that if we use genetics as the determining factor for gender, then these individuals should by necessity have their own genders assigned to them which would increase the number of genders beyond 2.
    If something is said to not have a gender, why would that be another gender, instead of merely a lack of gender?
    Is 0 not a number? The concept of gender is entirely linguistic. There are some languages that have many genders, and the Tuyuca language has 140 noun classes which effectively function as genders. The purpose of a gender is to modify the noun for specificity.

    For example, I could say "Melisa and James have a toaster, she named it Steve and he called it Kara. They can not decide on a name."

    so "iI" is still a gender, as is "They" which is a plural of genders. So if we consider that something which doesn't have a gender should not be counted, then what do we do with plurals? The problem is that even though neuter genders do not count as a positive of a gender (definition identity) it is still a positive term which needs to be counted. Either way there are at least 3 genders, and theoretically there can be as many as we need.
    At some point in the distant past, the universe went through a phase of cosmic inflation, Stars formed, planets coalesced, and on at least one of them life took root and developed into the human race, who conquered fire, built societies and developed technology .
    All of that so we can argue about nothing.
  • @FatherTed ;

    FatherTed said:
    @Happy_Killbot

    The meaning of gender has not changed in scholastic use, only changed for propagandist use.   Gender means male or femaile and sex means copulation.   You have been diddled by misinformation and repeat the misinformation to reflect dis-information because the defintions you provide are not the longstanding definitions used over many centuries, but a modern perversion of the definitions to justify the LGBQT Agenda.   They are not scholars.   They are not linguists nor definers of language.   They are using propagandised definitions to serve their Agenda, the same definitions you have adopted, but which are incorrect.

    There are only two genders for living creatures - male and femaile.   Neuter is not a gender for living creatures and thus is irrelevant to the LGBQT abuse of the definition of gender and irrelevant to the debate.
    No, this is completely wrong and I can prove it. For example, I might say: "The sex of this puppy is male" That's a perfectly coherent and normal use of the word "sex" that has nothing to do with copulation. Actually, "Sex" is a slang for "sexual intercourse" thereby showing that the scholastic use of the word to mean copulation is a derivative of the original meaning.

    There are still asexual creatures that are neither male nor female, and hermaphrodite creatures that contain both male and female parts. You argument as it stands is in blatant contradiction of reality.

    Suppose I throw your argument back on you. Suppose I say that the narrative that there are only 2 genders is a dis-information campaign that is corrupting the historic use of the term "gender" as a noun modifier to mean "sexes" to justify an anti-LGBTQ agenda? It's a two way street and I can show you facts that justify that this is the way it is, and in fact you have been "diddled by misinformation" (Who says that?)

    Look at the Merriam-Webster definition of the word "Gender"
    https://www.merriam-webster.com/dictionary/gender

    Gender verb)
    a: a subclass within a grammatical class (such as noun, pronoun, adjective, or verb) of a language that is partly arbitrary but also partly based on distinguishable characteristics (such as shape, social rank, manner of existence, or sex) and that determines agreement with and selection of other words or grammatical forms
    b: membership of a word or a grammatical form in such a subclass
    c: an inflectional form (see INFLECTION sense 2a) showing membership in such a subclass

    2a: SEX sense 1athe feminine gender
    b: the behavioral, cultural, or psychological traits typically associated with one sex

    Based on these definitions alone, I can show that it is you, and not I, who has a fundamental incomprehension in the meaning of the word "Gender". People are who they are and there is no reason to put restrictions on who can marry who, or who can have sex with who.
    At some point in the distant past, the universe went through a phase of cosmic inflation, Stars formed, planets coalesced, and on at least one of them life took root and developed into the human race, who conquered fire, built societies and developed technology .
    All of that so we can argue about nothing.
  • @FatherTed ;

    I doubt you will ever read this, but if you do congrats, you found the secrete loophole.

    "Sex" means copulation and not categories for the type of people are divided based on reproductive function.

    You clearly know how the English language works:

    Sex: noun
    1. either of the two main categories (male and female) into which humans and most other living things are divided on the basis of their reproductive functions.
      "adults of both sexes"
    [/sarcasm]
    At some point in the distant past, the universe went through a phase of cosmic inflation, Stars formed, planets coalesced, and on at least one of them life took root and developed into the human race, who conquered fire, built societies and developed technology .
    All of that so we can argue about nothing.
  • MichaelElpersMichaelElpers 262 Pts
    edited April 25
    @Happy_Killbot I dont really know what you think gender is yet. You use klindfelters syndrome (that would be an appeal to biology). That is an anomaly like having 6 fingers on a hand, and if that is your appeal only people with chromosomes other than the regular XX or XY would be able to identify as something other than male or female.

    A toaster is not a living being so i dont really believe it deserves an assigned gender.  It biologically is not male or female and socially im not sure why someone would think a toaster is more male or female.

    A spectrum doesnt really get us anywhere because then there are endless possibilities, so it doesnt really mean anything.  Also i find it Ironic because a spectrum is pushed by feminist LGBTQ activists that like to believe Men and women are very similar, while also pushing the idea that men and women are only drawn to certain things like trucks (men) and dolls (women) because of society/patriarchy telling them to behave that way.  To be able to correctly place people on a spectrum the only way to do so would be to stereotype/ specifically identify how masculine or feminine every object/idea is...the exact thing they are fighting in the first place.
  • @MichaelElpers ;
    You have to read my point about Kindfelters syndrome in context. It's a rebuttal to the idea proposed by gbn1002 "There are two genders. Male. Female. These genders are assigned in your genetic code and can not be changed."

    What I am saying is that genes and in fact biology are not a good way to determine gender, so technically I am pointing out the appeal to biology fallacy in an indirect way.

    A toaster still has a gender though, it's gender is neuter. It is neither male nor female, yet it still has a gender assigned to it, that gender being "it". Thus English has at least 3 genders, male, female, neuter.

    I don't think I talk anywhere about a spectrum, and I agree that having one makes no sense. What I am really arguing against here is just that gender isn't binary either.

    To put it simply, a gender is a noun modifier that classifies or categorizes a particular thing. For example "he/his/him" refers to being male of masculine, and "She/her/hers" refers to being feminine. I think the real confusion about this whole ordeal is that people like to use "gender" and "sex" interchangeably, but they are not the same thing at all. I think that this Orwellian modification to our language has been pushed by anti-LGBTQ persons for a while and it is really kind of annoying.

    The questions: "How many genders are there?" Vs. "How many sexes are there?" are not the same question and have very different answers. However, neither of these answers is 2.
    At some point in the distant past, the universe went through a phase of cosmic inflation, Stars formed, planets coalesced, and on at least one of them life took root and developed into the human race, who conquered fire, built societies and developed technology .
    All of that so we can argue about nothing.
  • @Happy_Killbot. If not based on biology then what is it based on? I just havent heard what you think it is yet.

    I disagree with the neutral gender, again i dont think objects get a gender just like they dont have a sex.  A toaster not being a he or she doesnt mean there are 3 sexes.  In the human case i dont refer to other humans as "it", that generally would confer a lack of respect.

    I think in the beginning gender and sex were synonymous and later it was changed.
  • @MichaelElpers ;
    I actually detailed this above, but the word "Gender" is derived from the Latin root "Genus" which means birth, family, or nation. The meaning is preserved in the English word "genus" used to describe similar organisms which can not interbreed. Gender and sex have never been synonymous, the confusion is a  common misunderstanding from the fact that a lot of languages only have 2 genders, masculine and feminine (not to be confused with male and female) such as Spanish where there are two, "el" and "la". (a toaster is feminine, but it is somewhat arbitrary)

    There is a subtle distinction between sex and gender, but at the end of the day, gender isn't based on anything in particular, or rather it can be based on anything arbitrarily. Most languages use the masculine and feminine distinction because it's convenient and for lack of a better description, sexy. For example, you could have a language with just one gender, but that might get confusing when referring to multiple people, for example

    "Marie told Dave that she bought a new car. It was fancy" 
    We can all interpret this clearly, there is no confusion.

    "Marie told Dave that it bought a new car. It was fancy"
    This could have several meanings. Did Marie buy the car, or did Dave and then he forgot? Was the car fancy, or was Marie's words to Dave? Or was Marie or Dave fancy? We don't know.

    Some languages distinguish between more than just the 3 in English, for example Tuyuca has 50-140 noun modifiers which function identically to genders in English.This can get sort of confusing, when you have a word to describe not only sex and qualities of sex, but also if it is living or dead, colors, and textures. This can get a little unwielding at times.

    so having 2-4 genders is convenient and rather specific, but there is no reason there can not be more than that. Like all linguistic everything, it is just made up arbitrarily.
    MichaelElpers
    At some point in the distant past, the universe went through a phase of cosmic inflation, Stars formed, planets coalesced, and on at least one of them life took root and developed into the human race, who conquered fire, built societies and developed technology .
    All of that so we can argue about nothing.
  • WinstonCWinstonC 163 Pts
    @Happy_Killbot "The point of the statement is as a rebuttal to the notion that biology is the determining factor in gender."

    Would you agree that gender roles and sociocultural expectations ultimately come from biological realities? Such as the fact that men are on average more dominant, and women are on average more nurturing?

    "The concept of gender is entirely linguistic. There are some languages that have many genders, and the Tuyuca language has 140 noun classes which effectively function as genders. The purpose of a gender is to modify the noun for specificity."

    I see, so you are talking about grammatical gender rather than sociocultural gender identity and expression. I personally would consider "genderless" as not a gender by definition, however everyone is free to create their own category structures to describe the world as they wish.
  • @Happy_Killbot. Interesting!  When looking at it like that its hard, because if the linguistic way words are given gender is arbitrary it would seem to differ from language to language and person to person.  Its almost if the word itself doesnt have much of a real concrete meaning at all.  This suggests to me that we should rarely ever be using the word gender, and it is being incorrectly used 99% of the time by nearly everyone, including myself.

    Anyways i found this article interesting on the subject. I also agree with many of the dos and donts at the bottom.
    https://thefederalist.com/2016/05/31/why-you-should-stop-using-the-word-gender/
    Happy_KillbotWinstonC
  • @WinstonC ;
    Would you agree that gender roles and sociocultural expectations ultimately come from biological realities? Such as the fact that men are on average more dominant, and women are on average more nurturing?
    Yes, however what is important to recognize here is that what we use to define our genders is totally arbitrary. We use sex to define our genders because it is easy to know on sight, but it could just as easily be anything else, such as color, profession, or identity.

    I see, so you are talking about grammatical gender rather than sociocultural gender identity and expression. I personally would consider "genderless" as not a gender by definition, however everyone is free to create their own category structures to describe the world as they wish.
    Even in a sociocultural context, there are still at least 3 genders, because "neuter" ( words like it, them, they) is still a gender, it is not gender-less the gender is neuter. What it is not is a sex, because sex and gender are not the same thing. We use sex to define our genders, however having a gender does not define a sex. Does that make sense?
    At some point in the distant past, the universe went through a phase of cosmic inflation, Stars formed, planets coalesced, and on at least one of them life took root and developed into the human race, who conquered fire, built societies and developed technology .
    All of that so we can argue about nothing.
  • WinstonCWinstonC 163 Pts
    @Happy_Killbot "We use sex to define our genders because it is easy to know on sight, but it could just as easily be anything else, such as color, profession, or identity."

    We could do that, though what then would be the difference between a gender and an adjective?

    "Even in a sociocultural context, there are still at least 3 genders, because "neuter" ( words like it, them, they) is still a gender, it is not gender-less the gender is neuter."


    That's a grammatical context. This is semantic, however, because implicitly we are accepting that there are only masculine and feminine attributes. There aren't any "neuter" attributes that I can think of.
  • @WinstonC ;

    The difference between an adjective and a gender is, simply that a gender can take the place of a noun because it is the class to which the noun belongs. All nouns have a gender, but not all adjectives can be used to describe all nouns.

    The "neuter" attribute is that it has no sex. Examples would include ideas, asexual creatures, and toasters. The fact that these things don't have masculine or feminine attributes (with a few exceptions such as ships and cities) demonstrates that there are other categories besides these two. 
    At some point in the distant past, the universe went through a phase of cosmic inflation, Stars formed, planets coalesced, and on at least one of them life took root and developed into the human race, who conquered fire, built societies and developed technology .
    All of that so we can argue about nothing.
  • WinstonCWinstonC 163 Pts
    edited May 1
    @Happy_Killbot "All nouns have a gender, but not all adjectives can be used to describe all nouns."

    That's only because you define a lack of gender as a gender, though. The reason I raised the point is because you said that we could define gender by color or profession.

    "The "neuter" attribute is that it has no sex. The fact that these things don't have masculine or feminine attributes (with a few exceptions such as ships and cities) demonstrates that there are other categories besides these two."

    I get the point that you're making, and it's valid, but it seems semantic. It feels like you want to say "The "neuter" attribute is that it has no..." (gender). The reason I say this is because you go on to define neuter as lacking in both masculine and feminine attributes. Sex organs and chromosomes are never mentioned.

    Would you at least agree that a category which merely lacks the attributes of the genders could validly be construed as not a gender? Like how being unemployed could validly be construed as not a profession.
  • Happy_KillbotHappy_Killbot 1824 Pts
    @WinstonC ;
    I don't think you quite understand what I am saying. I am not saying that "a lack of gender is a gender" There is no such thing as a lack of gender. What I'm saying is that a lack of sex is a gender, specifically that gender is neuter.

    in fact, if we look at the definition of "neuter" it defines that it is a gender in the definition when used as an adjective or a noun:
    neu·ter
    /ˈn(y)o͞odər/
    adjective
    1. 1.
      of or denoting a gender of nouns in some languages, typically contrasting with masculine and feminine or common.
      "it is a neuter word in Greek"
    2. 2.
      (of an animal) lacking developed sexual organs, or having had them removed
    noun
    1. 1.
      GRAMMAR
      a neuter word.
    2. 2.
      a nonfertile caste of social insect, especially a worker bee or ant.
    verb
    1. castrate or spay (a domestic animal).
      "a neutered tomcat"

    There is a difference between sex and gender. We use sex to define gender, but that doesn't mean that it works backwards, the same way we can say that all women are human but not all humans are women.

    Would you at least agree that a category which merely lacks the attributes of the genders could validly be construed as not a gender? Like how being unemployed could validly be construed as not a profession.
    No, for the simple reason that i can't think of anything that fits into this category. Since neuter is a gender, specifically the gender that lacks masculine or feminine qualities. Everything that we know can be masculine, feminine, or neuter already, and I can't think of a single thing that could possibly be described in this way.
    At some point in the distant past, the universe went through a phase of cosmic inflation, Stars formed, planets coalesced, and on at least one of them life took root and developed into the human race, who conquered fire, built societies and developed technology .
    All of that so we can argue about nothing.
  • WinstonCWinstonC 163 Pts
    @Happy_Killbot "I don't think you quite understand what I am saying. I am not saying that "a lack of gender is a gender" There is no such thing as a lack of gender. What I'm saying is that a lack of sex is a gender, specifically that gender is neuter."

    So you don't see how a lack of masculine or feminine attributes could be perceived by another as a lack of gender?

    "1.
    of or denoting a gender of nouns in some languages, typically contrasting with masculine and feminine or common.
    "it is a neuter word in Greek""

    Once again though, this is grammatical gender, which we have distinguished from sociocultural gender.

    "There is a difference between sex and gender. We use sex to define gender, but that doesn't mean that it works backwards, the same way we can say that all women are human but not all humans are women."

    My point here was that you state neuter means sexless but then describe neuter as lacking masculine and feminine attributes. In other words the sex doesn't seem to be relevant, but the gender (masculinity and femininity) does.

    "No, for the simple reason that i can't think of anything that fits into this category. Since neuter is a gender, specifically the gender that lacks masculine or feminine qualities. Everything that we know can be masculine, feminine, or neuter already, and I can't think of a single thing that could possibly be described in this way."

    What if someone defines masculine and feminine as genders and neuter as gender-less? After all, neuter is defined as lacking gendered attributes. Is this not a valid way of categorizing the world?
  • Happy_KillbotHappy_Killbot 1824 Pts
    @WinstonC ;
    So you don't see how a lack of masculine or feminine attributes could be perceived by another as a lack of gender?
    Of course not, because there are more attributes than just masculine or feminine. Theoretically, there are an infinite amount.
    Once again though, this is grammatical gender, which we have distinguished from sociocultural gender.
    The above is true, even in a sociocultural sense. Consider a sentient android, or some sort of genetic eunuch which lacks both X and Y chromosomes, something we could theoretically create. Entities such as these lack traditional gender roles.
    My point here was that you state neuter means sexless but then describe neuter as lacking masculine and feminine attributes. In other words the sex doesn't seem to be relevant, but the gender (masculinity and femininity) does.
    Why should it matter if objects and entities which I consider neuter are sexless if they also lack masculine and feminine characteristics? Neither of these things really matter. From a logical stance, defining something as lacking masculine and feminine characteristics is the same as saying it is sexless.
    What if someone defines masculine and feminine as genders and neuter as gender-less? After all, neuter is defined as lacking gendered attributes. Is this not a valid way of categorizing the world?
    This wouldn't make any sense because that would imply that we consider words like "it" "they" "We" as being not genders, and they most certainly are. I think I brought this up before, but it would be sort of like saying that 0 isn't a number because it has no value.
    At some point in the distant past, the universe went through a phase of cosmic inflation, Stars formed, planets coalesced, and on at least one of them life took root and developed into the human race, who conquered fire, built societies and developed technology .
    All of that so we can argue about nothing.
  • WinstonCWinstonC 163 Pts
    @Happy_Killbot "Of course not, because there are more attributes than just masculine or feminine. Theoretically, there are an infinite amount."

    OK, so we could also have blonde haired as a gender, it just doesn't fit the category structure. We could further classify hard as a colour, but once again it seems out of place.

    "The above is true, even in a sociocultural sense. Consider a sentient android, or some sort of genetic eunuch which lacks both X and Y chromosomes, something we could theoretically create. Entities such as these lack traditional gender roles."

    Exactly, they lack gender roles; in other words they lack a sociocultural gender.

    "Why should it matter if objects and entities which I consider neuter are sexless if they also lack masculine and feminine characteristics?"

    Well, the issue was that it seems the lack of a biological sex isn't how you define neuter, rather that a lack of masculine and feminine attributes is.

    "This wouldn't make any sense because that would imply that we consider words like "it" "they" "We" as being not genders, and they most certainly are."

    Genders may have associated pronouns but pronouns aren't genders.

    "I think I brought this up before, but it would be sort of like saying that 0 isn't a number because it has no value."

    Would it also be like saying being unemployed isn't a career?
  • Happy_KillbotHappy_Killbot 1824 Pts
    @WinstonC ;
    OK, so we could also have blonde haired as a gender, it just doesn't fit the category structure. We could further classify hard as a colour, but once again it seems out of place.
    So, if you had grown up in a world in which we use something else like skin color to define genders and you were used to it then it wouldn't seem out o place then? This is exactly what I am saying, there is no reason we couldn't do this.
    Exactly, they lack gender roles; in other words they lack a sociocultural gender.
    Yet they still have a gender. The point is there are more sociocultural gender roles than man and woman.
    Well, the issue was that it seems the lack of a biological sex isn't how you define neuter, rather that a lack of masculine and feminine attributes is.
    Masculine and feminine attributes are based on biological sex, so biological sex would still be the arbitrary root for gender, and since some things have no biological sex (most things actually) this would automatically count as at least a 3rd attribute.
    Would it also be like saying being unemployed isn't a career?
    That would be a false analogy because in order to have a career you have to be capable of having a job, but not all things fit into this category, unlike with genders where everything has a gender.
    At some point in the distant past, the universe went through a phase of cosmic inflation, Stars formed, planets coalesced, and on at least one of them life took root and developed into the human race, who conquered fire, built societies and developed technology .
    All of that so we can argue about nothing.
  • WinstonCWinstonC 163 Pts
    @Happy_Killbot "So, if you had grown up in a world in which we use something else like skin color to define genders and you were used to it then it wouldn't seem out o place then? This is exactly what I am saying, there is no reason we couldn't do this."

    We could do this, but then we would also create a category for the phenomenon we currently refer to as gender.

    "Yet they still have a gender. The point is there are more sociocultural gender roles than man and woman... Masculine and feminine attributes are based on biological sex, so biological sex would still be the arbitrary root for gender, and since some things have no biological sex (most things actually) this would automatically count as at least a 3rd attribute."

    What sociocultural attributes would you put into the neuter category?

    "That would be a false analogy because in order to have a career you have to be capable of having a job, but not all things fit into this category, unlike with genders where everything has a gender."

    Only because you have defined a lack of a gender as a gender.
  • @WinstonC ;

    At this point I think we are just talking past each other because this conversation has been going in circles. Everything you ask here I have already answered at least once.
    We could do this, but then we would also create a category for the phenomenon we currently refer to as gender.
    No problem with that, but at any rate there would be more than 2 genders.
    What sociocultural attributes would you put into the neuter category?
    Anything that doesn't have a sex associated with it, such as common nouns and neuter. We have been over this already.
    Only because you have defined a lack of a gender as a gender.
    I have done no such thing, I have defined a lack of sex as a gender, but sex and gender, even in a sociocultural sense, are not equivalent.
    At some point in the distant past, the universe went through a phase of cosmic inflation, Stars formed, planets coalesced, and on at least one of them life took root and developed into the human race, who conquered fire, built societies and developed technology .
    All of that so we can argue about nothing.
  • WinstonCWinstonC 163 Pts
    edited May 12
    @Happy_Killbot "Anything that doesn't have a sex associated with it, such as common nouns and neuter. We have been over this already."

    My point is that sex isn't a sociocultural attribute, but a biological one. In any case, thank you for helping me consider some new perspectives, it's always a pleasure.
  • @joecavalry theres no such thing as gender. It’s a construct of our own minds. It shouldn’t exist. The idea, of gender to people who “identify” differently, is that they don’t “feel” like they are what their sex tells them they are. If you want to solve this problem focus on the stereotypes driving it. How can one “feel” like a man, or a woman, or neither, or both? You can’t. You can’t feel you’re sex. You simply are what you are. No if’s, and’s, or but’s.
  • JesusJesus 66 Pts
    @joecavalry

    there are lots of genders

    for example, you can be a toaster or an attack helicopter

    they are perfectly acceptable as genders

    what kinda sh1t is male and female?

    imagine still being a male or female

    nah we moving it up to the 25th century 

    u can even be a knife

    gf cheating on u?

    slice her up

    wanna eat bread but its locked in ur mom's closet?

    pick the lock with your knife even though i dont know how

    your gender is a strategic life form that you can take on to use different special abilities
    adesola_aWinstonC
  • adesola_aadesola_a 46 Pts
    How about those who feel completely confident in their gender? Those who have no intention to change their sex, and have no desire to be either gender fluid/non-binary? Although there are many who are adamant on the somewhat 'abolishment of gender, there are also many who are adamant that gender is a real, accurate way to navigate life.
    0.05-0.06% of the world's population is legally classified as part of the gender fluid community. Surely that isn't enough to discredit he/him and she/her pronouns?
    And how about those who identify as bigender? 'The tendency to move between masculine and feminine gender-typed behaviour depending on context, expressing a distinctly male persona and a distinctly female persona.' This definition demonstrates the supposedly 'more common' sexes. Are we going to discredit bigenders also, due to the fact that the title of 'male' and 'female' is just a construct?
     
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