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The Trinity is Biblical

Debate Information

Position: For
I am taking the position which affirms the doctrine of the Trinity as being in line with the God's self-revelation in the Bible. The foundational argument is that, "within the one Being that is God, there exists eternally three coequal and coeternal persons, namely, the Father, the Son, and the Holy Spirit" (James White, The Forgotten Trinity). The following is an abridged version of the Creed which can hopefully provide some clarification by way of exposition of the above statement (I would like to note the distinction in the use of the words "being" and "person"):

  1. That we worship one God in trinity and the trinity in unity,
        neither blending their persons
        nor dividing their essence.
            For the person of the Father is a distinct person,
            the person of the Son is another,
            and that of the Holy Spirit still another.
            But the divinity of the Father, Son, and Holy Spirit is one,
            their glory equal, their majesty coeternal.
  2. And yet there are not three eternal beings;
                there is but one eternal being.
                So too there are not three uncreated or immeasurable beings;
                there is but one uncreated and immeasurable being.
  3. Thus the Father is God,
            the Son is God,
            the Holy Spirit is God.
                Yet there are not three gods;
                there is but one God.
  4. The Father was neither made nor created nor begotten from anyone.
        The Son was neither made nor created;
        he was begotten from the Father alone.
        The Holy Spirit was neither made nor created nor begotten;
        he proceeds from the Father and the Son.

This doctrine finds it's origin in verses like John 12:41 cross referencing Isaiah 6:10 (of the Son, YHWH in Isaiah is said to be Jesus by John) and John 14:16-17, John 16:13, and 1 Corinthians 2:10-12 (of the Spirit). This may be best visualized during the Baptism of Christ recorded in Matthew 3:17.


Reference

James White, The Forgotten Trinity
The Athanasian Creed



Debra AI Prediction

Against
Predicted To Win
56%
Likely
44%
Unlikely

Details +
    Total: "Against" Winning by 1 Pts
    Arguments: Winning by 1 Pts
    Evidence & Sources: Winning by 0 Pts
    Spelling & Grammar: Winning by 0 Pts
    Conduct: Winning by 0 Pts


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Debate Type: Traditional Debate



Voting Format: Casual Voting

Opponent: K_Michael

Rounds: 3

Time Per Round: 48 Hours Per Round


Voting Period: 72 Hours


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Post Argument Now Debate Details +



    Arguments


  • Round 1 | Position: Against
    K_MichaelK_Michael 114 Pts   -  
    I'm a little unclear on what all of that means, but I agree that their essence is the same and their persons are different. I don't understand the whole 'only one being' part.
    It's hard to decipher as it never clearly says straight out, "God and Christ and the exact same person and so is the Holy Ghost"
    I believe that we can be sure that Christ was present before the creation of the world, as he created it (refer to The Pearl of Great Price, at lds.org) However, I also believe that our souls were created before the existence of the Earth, because we are to RETURN unto our Father. I would like to talk more on all of this, but I need to find some specific verses, and I would like you to at least skim The Pearl of Great Price before we continue.
    "We're all in the gutter, but some of us are looking at the stars." 
    Debra AI Analytics  
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  • Round 1 | Position: For
    dboxdbox 40 Pts   -  

    I can not clarify any further unless you specify what is unclear to you. They are one Being (they share the same essence), but are three distinct Persons. The Father is YHWH, the Son is YHWH and the Spirit is YHWH.

    You stated, "It's hard to decipher as it never clearly says straight out, 'God and Christ and the exact same person and so is the Holy Ghost'". You will not find a statement like this because the doctrine of the Trinity does not teach they are the same Person. As I mentioned, there is a distinction between God as a Being (Essence, or that which makes God, God) and Person, the distinct Persons that share the Essence.

    Debra AI Analytics  
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        Considerate: 93% 
       
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        Spelling & Grammar: 98% 
       
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        Avg. Grade Level: 8.6 
       
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      ____________________

        Political Analysis: No Political Affiliation  
      ____________________

        Clear (Beta): 50% 
       
        Relevant (Beta): 85% 
       

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