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Climate change is real and it’s important. Prove me wrong.

Debate Information

There are plenty of climate deniers out there. But...
Climate change is real and it is a real problem.
The facts prove this. Several activists such as Greta Thunberg have pointed this out. Now is the time to act.
We_are_accountableGrafix
  1. Live Poll

    Is climate change real?

    14 votes
    1. Yes.
      71.43%
    2. No.
      28.57%
«1



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    Arguments


  • Happy_KillbotHappy_Killbot 5557 Pts   -  
    Climate change deniers disturb me...

    They want to pretend like nothing is wrong, but how will they react when reality catches up with them?
    DeeCYDdhartaxlJ_dolphin_473AlofRIZeusAres42
    At some point in the distant past, the universe went through a phase of cosmic inflation,
    Stars formed, planets coalesced, and on at least one of them life took root.
    Through a long process of evolution this life 
    developed into the human race.
    Humans conquered fire, built complex societies and advanced technology .

    All of that so we can argue about nothing.
  • TKDBTKDB 694 Pts   -   edited March 2020
    @Happy_Killbot

    This very planet is said to be 4.5 billion years old.

    Can you deny that fact?

    Can you deny that this planets weather cycles, have put the very surface of this planet, through millions of different weather created situations?

    The Freezing that this planet has gone through?

    The droughts that this planet has gone through?

    Throw in some meteor strikes, to add some Freezing, or Scorched earth moments, and some of man can gleam but how much Scientifically created to support the COMPUTER created made up science called climate change?

    Man today, basically understands, the equivalent of a handful of needles,(because of the man made toy called "climate change,") when it comes to the global Haystacks of weathered history that the Earth has experienced.

    That some of "climate change crowd," thinks they know, what they're talking about?

    When some of the humanity on this planet can be decimated by the random acts of a Hurricane, Tornado, Tsunami, Earthquake, or what have you, and man can't do anything about those weather situations, but try to use Computer models in a computer, to help him play catch up, with this planets weathered history?

    Man in reality, has a better understanding about money, illegal drugs, sexual assault, gun violence, and human trafficking, then Humanity as a whole, will ever evolve as a species to develop understanding, about this planets Weather History?

    Unless the science fiction, over a Real Life time machine, becomes a reality, down the road?

    And then Man, can take a ride, and see this planets weathered history, via that time machine? 

    Otherwise, man is but playing a game of slow motion catch up, with a History of Weather, than he can only speculate about up to this point via the current version of Science, that humanity has at its current disposal, right?

    I'm guessing that you're a climate change supporter?

    @Happy_Killbot

    "Climate change deniers disturb me...

    They want to pretend like nothing is wrong, but how will they react when reality catches up with them?"

    @Happy_Killbot

    Are Tsunamis not real?

    Or Earthquakes, or Hurricanes, or Tornadoes not real? 

    The Earth has gone through how many Ice Ages, or Droughts? 

    The above have been happening for billions of years, right?

    So maybe, some of the probable pretenders, are some of the Climate Change scientists themselves?

    Who by using a computer, to create a Climate Change algorithm, to create an artificial science, called Climate Change?
     



    AlofRIGrafix
  • MichaelElpersMichaelElpers 1121 Pts   -  
    If you want to convince people that it is real, probably shouldnt cite greta thornbug as a reliable source.

    I dont think many are people are direct climate change deniers, they just think that there is that the severity of human interaction is less than stated, the effects arent as bad and arent occuring as fast as predicted (their predictions have often been wrong just look at al gores movie), and the correct way to combat it is not to turn over most of the economy to the government.
    Grafix
  • Happy_KillbotHappy_Killbot 5557 Pts   -  
    @TKDB

    Are you a climatologist?
    At some point in the distant past, the universe went through a phase of cosmic inflation,
    Stars formed, planets coalesced, and on at least one of them life took root.
    Through a long process of evolution this life 
    developed into the human race.
    Humans conquered fire, built complex societies and advanced technology .

    All of that so we can argue about nothing.
  • DeeDee 5395 Pts   -  
    @TKDB

    are you babbling about?
    AlofRIBlastcat
  • MichaelElpersMichaelElpers 1121 Pts   -  
    @Happy_Killbot @Dee

    You dont understand... weather, earth billions of years old, tsunamis, earthquakes, tornados. 
    Theyre all real. Am i over your head yet.

    Ices ages, droughts, computer models. Humanity never understand the complexity of weather.

    His argument is decimated by random tornados of information.
    Grafix
  • Happy_KillbotHappy_Killbot 5557 Pts   -  
    @MichaelElpers

    It is a common misconception that what the individuals who push climate change policies are after is more power for themselves. Only in highly corrupt countries should this be the case.

    For example, a carbon tax some might think is simply the government taking money and doing what it wants with it, and in deed this would do this if it were mismanaged. However, the proper way to accomplish this would be to take the money collected through a carbon tax and then either invest it into green technologies through subsidies, or to redistribute those funds to everyone in the form of a negative tax or a tax reduction.

    The reason for this is fairly straightforward, first off this tax discourages behavior which produces carbon or wastes energy, effectively reducing the CO2 emissions. This is actually good for businesses because they will now have an incentive to invest in the things that will end up saving them money in the long run, i.e. installing insulation and taking basic conservation policies for their employees.

    Second, the atmosphere is a public resource, for which everyone has equal share and can use without permission or payment. Anyone who converts atmospheric O2 into CO2 is effectively polluting this resource and that means that everyone who relies on it for stable weather has to pay for it, in the form of drought, storm damage, mass migration, and decreased air quality. A carbon tax effectively returns this value to the average citizen by providing compensation for that damage.

    Switching to renewable energy sources will not turn over our economy, in fact it will actually benefit the economy in the long run because solar power is cheaper, more sustainable, and more stable than fossil fuels, with the exception  of natural gas which is made cheap thanks to fracking technology. Even so, renewable energy represents a much longer term power source because fossil fuels are by nature limited in supply, while the sun will not be extinguished for billions of years. The renewable sector is expected to see a huge increase in affordability in the next few decades, so from an economic perspective it will be wiser to make this transition. Consider that installing solar cells onto the roof of your house can reduce your total energy costs or even potentially reverse it entirely giving you a source of income. This kind of mass distribution of the means of production is something that could very well be a reality in the next two decades, and would be better for the average citizen overall.
    CYDdhartaAlofRI
    At some point in the distant past, the universe went through a phase of cosmic inflation,
    Stars formed, planets coalesced, and on at least one of them life took root.
    Through a long process of evolution this life 
    developed into the human race.
    Humans conquered fire, built complex societies and advanced technology .

    All of that so we can argue about nothing.
  • Actually, due to the number of national lockdowns across the globe due to coronavirus outbreak, the climate has been getting a bit better. Another bit of proof that humans are the cause of the current bit of climate change.
    CYDdhartaAlofRIxlJ_dolphin_473Grafix



  • Climate change deniers disturb me...

    They want to pretend like nothing is wrong, but how will they react when reality catches up with them?
    @Happy_Killbot I find it mind-boggling that you still have climate change deniers among with many other kinds of deniers such as anti-vaxers, flat earthers, pandemic deniers such as the one happening now, evolution deniers, GMO safety deniers, etc.

    The degree of evidential support surrounding these things I just mentioned is so great that it's insurmountable.
    Happy_KillbotCYDdhartaAlofRIxlJ_dolphin_473



  • TKDBTKDB 694 Pts   -   edited March 2020
    @Happy_Killbot ;


    I'm a realist. 

    I don't fool myself about the weather that exists on this planet.

    And when a crowd of scientists want to conjure up a term like Climate Change from the depths of the of their own collective of laptop computers, via their Climate Change algorithm talk, they are free to verbally chase an algorithm all that they want to, down their own rabbit holes

    And this planet and its weather changes are, going to do what it does, because that's just how it is, to live on the surface of this planet, at our very own risks?


    Yes, or no? 
    ZeusAres42AlofRIxlJ_dolphin_473
  • Happy_KillbotHappy_Killbot 5557 Pts   -  
    @TKDB

    So if you are not a climatologist, is it possible that you are unqualified to talk about what is and isn't true with regards to the planet's climate?
    At some point in the distant past, the universe went through a phase of cosmic inflation,
    Stars formed, planets coalesced, and on at least one of them life took root.
    Through a long process of evolution this life 
    developed into the human race.
    Humans conquered fire, built complex societies and advanced technology .

    All of that so we can argue about nothing.
  • TKDBTKDB 694 Pts   -   edited March 2020
    @Happy_Killbot

    Are YOU a climatologist?

    And if not, then good for you.

    And in regards to your question:
    Nope, but being that I've done enough gardening, and provided enough of an infrastructure while taking care of various gardening landscapes to see how the cold and warm weather, affects crops.

    And the crops will either die, or survive, depending on how this planets weather affects them.

    Paying attention to the weather, and caring for plants, while putting food on the table, didn't, and still doesn't require me, having to study up, on what an isolated group of scientists, who want to peddle their "Climate Change" narratives, to whomever is willing to be preached to about their Climate Change messaging?

    They have an algorithm based Science, that they want people to feed on, kind of like the Liberal preachings, that the Liberals want their followers to mentality wise, feed off of, just the same right?

    "So if you are not a climatologist, is it possible that you are unqualified to talk about what is and isn't true with regards to the planet's climate?"

    I've LIVED my experiences, while you have the Climate Change scientists making up their experiences, through their tunnel visioned Climate Change narratives again, based on an Algorithm hatched inside the parts of their computers?


  • TKDBTKDB 694 Pts   -  
    @Happy_Killbot

    Why did you ignore the below questions?

    This very planet is said to be 4.5 billion years old.

    Can you deny that fact?

    Can you deny that this planets weather cycles, have put the very surface of this planet, through millions of different weather created situations?

    The Freezing that this planet has gone through?

    The droughts that this planet has gone through?

    Throw in some meteor strikes, to add some Freezing, or Scorched earth moments, and some of man can gleam but how much Scientifically created to support the COMPUTER created made up science called climate change?

    Man today, basically understands, the equivalent of a handful of needles,(because of the man made toy called "climate change,") when it comes to the global Haystacks of weathered history that the Earth has experienced.

    That some of "climate change crowd," thinks they know, what they're talking about?

    When some of the humanity on this planet can be decimated by the random acts of a Hurricane, Tornado, Tsunami, Earthquake, or what have you, and man can't do anything about those weather situations, but try to use Computer models in a computer, to help him play catch up, with this planets weathered history?

    Man in reality, has a better understanding about money, illegal drugs, sexual assault, gun violence, and human trafficking, then Humanity as a whole, will ever evolve as a species to develop understanding, about this planets Weather History?

    Unless the science fiction, over a Real Life time machine, becomes a reality, down the road?

    And then Man, can take a ride, and see this planets weathered history, via that time machine? 

    Otherwise, man is but playing a game of slow motion catch up, with a History of Weather, than he can only speculate about up to this point via the current version of Science, that humanity has at its current disposal, right?

    I'm guessing that you're a climate change supporter?

    @Happy_Killbot

    "Climate change deniers disturb me...

    They want to pretend like nothing is wrong, but how will they react when reality catches up with them?"

    @Happy_Killbot

    Are Tsunamis not real?

    Or Earthquakes, or Hurricanes, or Tornadoes not real? 

    The Earth has gone through how many Ice Ages, or Droughts? 

    The above have been happening for billions of years, right? 

    So maybe, some of the probable pretenders, are some of the Climate Change scientists themselves?

    Who by using a computer, to create a Climate Change algorithm, to create an artificial science, called Climate Change? 
  • Happy_KillbotHappy_Killbot 5557 Pts   -  
    @TKDB

    So you know that the Earth's climate has been different in the past.

    So that means you are aware that it could be different today then.

    You know that these changes have been in part due to differences in the Earth's atmosphere.

    So that means you are aware that changes to the Earth's atmosphere can change the climate.

    You know that the burning of fossil fuels at industrial levels releases millions of tons of CO2.

    So that means you are aware that humans can change the Earth's atmosphere.

    All the pieces come together then.
    ZeusAres42
    At some point in the distant past, the universe went through a phase of cosmic inflation,
    Stars formed, planets coalesced, and on at least one of them life took root.
    Through a long process of evolution this life 
    developed into the human race.
    Humans conquered fire, built complex societies and advanced technology .

    All of that so we can argue about nothing.
  • MichaelElpersMichaelElpers 1121 Pts   -  
    @Happy_Killbot

    "It is a common misconception that what the individuals who push climate change policies are after is more power for themselves."

    Can you say that with a straight face, need i mention the green new deal?
    How am i supposed to believe climate change is a big deal when the proponents wont use nuclear power one of the cleanest and most efficient alternatives on the market.  Also while the coasts are supposed to be underwater banks are investing millions and millions of dollars on shore property that supposed to be underwater in ten years.

    Clean natural gas wasnt produced by government funding...the best solutions never are.  We invested so much in solar and wind which are inefficient and cant be stored.

    If global warming becomes an actual issue, the free markets will notice it and put large amounts of money into the solution to prevent them from losing business.
  • NopeNope 397 Pts   -  
    TKDB 
    Scientist use climate data from around the world since the 1880's as well as other evidence like satellite data, ocean composition and bacteria growth to determine the earths mean temperature is increasing (climate change). They also look at air trapped in ice, rock composition, fossil and other sources to project earths past large scale climate patterns. Then they look at possible causes for the shift in temperatures and determine it is highly probable that an increase in CO2 in the atmosphere caused by humans is the primary cause. We can then observe the consequence and projections of climate change to conclude it is most likely bad for humanity.

    Trends in earth climate patterns are easier to predict then local clime patterns. Its much harder to predict where or when a hurricane is going to happen then it is to predict an increase in hurricane frequency.
  • Happy_KillbotHappy_Killbot 5557 Pts   -  
    @MichaelElpers

    The green new deal was a travesty. Besides, it is fallacious to assume that just because some greedy idiots do want to use climate change it for personal gain that it must be false. It is both more likely and makes overall more sense that they are simply taking advantage of the situation.

    Natural gas is subsidized. In fact, 80% of  the $20 billion US fossil fuel subsidies go to natural gas.
    https://www.eesi.org/papers/view/fact-sheet-fossil-fuel-subsidies-a-closer-look-at-tax-breaks-and-societal-costs
    I have of course already stated the obvious personal benefit to installing solar panels on your roof. The storage problem is technologically feasible, and there are many companies which are already working on solutions to it. Our battery technology does lag behind others, but this is something which we will solve soon. Being as I am a strong proponent of nuclear power, I need not make an argument here. Best case scenario, nuclear is used to supplement renewable power as a way to decrease the land usage to a point where little if any additional land must be cleared.

    The markets might not be not fast enough to catch up to the changes in the atmosphere because the effects are exponential, and we are already seeing them. For example, mass migration due to desertification, such as the migration of people from Mexico into the US is a direct result of climate change. If they had the resources in Mexico to survive, they would not need to come to the US.

    The thing is, the markets are reactive rather than pro-active. The massive economic damage that would result from climate change is not something the markets can just "adjust" to, unless by that you mean that the fishing industry dissolves and with it all companies relying on it go with it, including some that you might not expect has a direct link, such as drugs, glue, or protein powder. In addition to the oceans becoming dead, terrestrial life will also become less tenable. Desertification will lead to an overall decrease in the planet's arable land, which will inevitably lead to mass starvation and increased food prices. This will mean that meat will become much more expensive and the economy will phase out those who like their steak. We still rely on the planets ecology for certain resources which will be lost permanently with rapid increases in the planets average temperature.

    Another thing to consider is that the costs of reversing the damage also go up exponentially, that is to say the sooner we implement a fix the more likely it is that that fix will be able to fix the damage. For example, I have already mentioned that widespread destruction of the planet's ecology, and marine life in particular, will not come back. This is technically not true, because it could be possible to clone the animals back into existence if a large enough sample of their DNA were preserved. However, this process is much more expensive both in terms of labor and feasibility than simply not letting them go extinct in the first place. If we would have started a 2% per year decrease in CO2 emissions starting in 2000 climate change would have already be a non issue. Now we need to have more like a 55% decrease per year.
    ZeusAres42
    At some point in the distant past, the universe went through a phase of cosmic inflation,
    Stars formed, planets coalesced, and on at least one of them life took root.
    Through a long process of evolution this life 
    developed into the human race.
    Humans conquered fire, built complex societies and advanced technology .

    All of that so we can argue about nothing.
  • TKDBTKDB 694 Pts   -  
    @Nope

    Good for you, look at the Science, that resides between your ears.
  • TKDBTKDB 694 Pts   -   edited March 2020
    @Happy_Killbot

    You mean you pieced your pro Climate Change rhetoric together, all nice and self sufficiently, didn't you?

    "All the pieces come together then."

    The weather has been changing long before the Climate Change scientists, ever came up with their moniker. 

    "Climate change is real and it’s important. Prove me wrong."

  • TKDBTKDB 694 Pts   -  
    @xlJ_dolphin_473

    @Happy_Killbot

    Are the two of you going to email the below countries, and verbally reprimand them over their fossil fuel usages, in the light of your pro Climate Change narratives?

    "ChinaChina is by far the world's leading producer of coal, with 46% of the global total in 2018.Jul 14, 2019https://www.forbes.com › 2019/07/14 "


    "The Ten Countries That Dominate World Fossil Fuel Production "

    "More resultsHow many countries rely on fossil fuels?five countriesCurrently, there are at least five countries that depend on fossil fuel for virtually 100% of their respective energy needs. Oman, Qatar, Kuwait, Saudi Arabia, and Brunei Darussalam are all currently completely dependent on fossil fuels for energy.Apr 25, 2017 "https://www.worldatlas.com › articles

     Fossil Fuel Dependency By Country - WorldAtlas.com "

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