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Should Trump Deport Illegal Immigrants?
in Immigration

I think that Trump should deport illegal immigrants as well as their children that may have been born in the US.
Jeter1011
Should Trumo deport illegal immigrants?
  1. What do you think?

    42 votes
    1. Yes
      73.81%
    2. No
      26.19%
«1



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Arguments

  • agsragsr 818 Pts
    It cannot be black and white, but there should be a deliberate program for deportations, qualifying many preexisting conditions and family situations. It is a difficult social and ethical issue, and I would suggest initial focus on incoming immigration.
    aarong
    Live Long and Prosper
  • There should be deportations as I mentioned in agsr's previous debate.
  • Yes, he should.
    George_Horse
  • Yes, he should do this and immediately. As he said, they bring nothing good to this country or for the most pry in general as well.
    George_Horse
  • He should.
    George_Horse
  • I am in america illegally with a mansion and can't leave. My whole life is here! You can't just pick me up by the croggy and THROW ME OUT LIKE A DOG
    George_Horse
  • DericWM2001DericWM2001 13 Pts
    edited January 2017
    Yes, Donald Trump should deport illegal immigrants! Why not?! If an illegal immigrant is found then that illegal immigrant should be deported out of this country as soon as possible.
    George_Horse
  • Hi DerikWM2001, thanks for being such an active user in the community! We would really appreciate it if you could spread the word about us! Keep it up, you are earning badges/points fast, try to get on the leaderboard. The more referrals, the greater pints and possibly prizes. Anyway, I believe that Trump should deport illegal immigrants based on their status.
    Schatzi11
    DebateIsland.com Founder/Administrator | Contact Me Via Private Messaging (aarong), Contact Support At customerservice@debateisland.com | Happy Debating! 
  • VaulkVaulk 480 Pts
    I believe that it's wrong (Illegally) to enter the U.S. through a course of action that is deceptive and illegal in nature.  I believe that it's wrong (Morally and Ethically) to give special and privileged treatment to those who have broken our laws simply because they got away with it for so long.  So let's argue this from a moral standpoint (Since most of the opposition seems to be willing to overlook the legality of the idea): Is it right to give special treatment to illegal immigrants simply because they managed to get away with their crime long enough to create a Family in the United States?  If so...what other crimes should we excuse on those grounds?

    Essentially, the left side of this argument is that it's acceptable to overlook a certain type of crime because of the circumstances involved years after the fact.  I'm sorry but I disagree, no circumstances created "After the fact" could possibly excuse you from the long established repercussions for committing a crime. 
    prorepublican19929WokeWhale
    "If there's no such thing as a stupid question then what kind of questions do stupid people ask"?

    "There's going to be a special place in Hell for people who spread lies through the veil of logical fallacies disguised as rational argument".

    "Oh, you don't like my sarcasm?  Well I don't much appreciate your stupid".


  • Yes, Trump should be deporting illegals and fast. I was very happy with Trumps tax plan released as well.
  • LogicLogic 236 Pts
    What makes murder wrong? In a world where we don't use our human feelings/nature, To say what is right or wrong, And we define everything by a set law, No matter how cruel it may be? Do you think that sounds like a good world? So we should use our humanity, To attack this problem.  When someone comes to a country to lead a BETTER life, They should be kicked out? Even if they couldn't come the legal way? If that's justice, Then i will take to part in association in such a corrupt form of 'justice' If you can even call it that.
  • inc4tinc4t 162 Pts
    @Logic, so if someone works really hard to rob your house because they want a better life for themselves, would by the same logic you would say that's okay?
    i wouldn't.
    I agree with you that we should show humanity, and given the impact we can do deportations in stages and have in some cases a legalization process.
    Nevertheless, illegal immigration is stealing money from honest american tax payers, who also work really hard for a better way of life for their families.
  • LogicLogic 236 Pts
    @inc4t Wow, I never really though of it that way. You opened my eyes to a new possibility, But we should STILL show some humanity when dealing with these people.
  • inc4tinc4t 162 Pts
    @Logic, thank you.  I am glad that you gained an additional perspective.  I also agree with you that we need to demonstrate humanity and dont just kick everyone out overnight - after all there are 11 million people who are here for generations in some cases.
  • @Vaulk, completely agree
  • VaulkVaulk 480 Pts
    I agree with @inc4t , I do believe in compassion and humanity but unfortunately...you can't overlook the negative repercussions of illegal immigration simply because there are people involved.  In this case I don't think there's a wonderful answer to the problem, I think this is going to come down to the lesser of two bad decisions and the lesser in this case is removing the people that should never have been allowed to be here in the first place in order to provide justice for those who are here rightfully so. 

    I understand the position of the illegal immigrant, it's hard, they had a bad life, they're trying to make a better life...but at what cost?  It cost taxpayer dollars to support them, they've broken our laws to achieve their better life, they've spat in the face of our legal system and in the faces of the immigrants who came here legally and what's worse than that is the fact that they're continuously spitting in the faces of those that are currently struggling to gain legal citizenship as we speak.  We cannot simply give them special treatment when there are hundreds of thousands of people still in line who DO respect our laws enough not to break them.
    "If there's no such thing as a stupid question then what kind of questions do stupid people ask"?

    "There's going to be a special place in Hell for people who spread lies through the veil of logical fallacies disguised as rational argument".

    "Oh, you don't like my sarcasm?  Well I don't much appreciate your stupid".


  • agsragsr 818 Pts
    @Vaulk, given your personal experience I think that makes you most qualified to offer an opinion on this topic.  You have see many of them in correctional facility.  
    I agree with you.
    Live Long and Prosper
  • I agree with @vaulk who provided his valid personal experience as @agsr mentioned. This is great evidence to support your debate and there for so agree with your point. There are really two majorities for this debate. Let Illegal immigrants stay or keep them out of here. On one hand, most illegal immigrants whether they're coming from Mexico, Canada or any country, want a better life for themselves and their families. This could be a reason Trump decided to potentially keep the Dream act, Obama put in place during his term. On the other side, Illegal immigrants are taking American jobs, killing people, selling drugs, and much more. I believe in high border control, especially on our American-Mexican border. My position, is the same as @vaulk 's and @agsr . We need to keep illegal immigrants out. I also believe in the dream act Ibama put in place and Trumo decide to to keep for his term as well. This is my side on the immigration stand point.
  • CovenyCoveny 417 Pts
    Deportation hurts the economy, is unfair, and way too expensive.
    LogicGeorge_Horse
  • I agree with @coveny . It will be very expensive and takes time.
  • VaulkVaulk 480 Pts
    @Coveny and @sportsonter , I would propose what Ann Coulter has proposed several times.  Now everyone get on your big boy pants because this one might sting a little lol.  The idea for removing Illegal Immigrants from the U.S. is simple...make it illegal for them to be here.  It sounds silly or too simple to work but in all actuality, if we had implemented this system in the first place...no one would be here illegally...ever.  Let me ask you something: What would happen if the United States required you to be a citizen in order to benefit from ANY goods or services available in the U.S.?  What if there were severe penalties for the crime of hiring illegal immigrants to work for you?  Well, employers would eventually get the hint and stop hiring illegal immigrants.  What if subsidized programs were suddenly ONLY available to U.S. Citizens...you know...the way it was supposed to be in the first place?  Well, then there wouldn't be any welfare, WIC, foodstamps, medicaid, medicare unless you were a citizen...which makes perfect sense because these are all services that are paid for by taxpaying citizens.  What if you couldn't receive medical treatment in the U.S. unless you were a Citizen? 

    It's really simple, we don't cater to illegal immigrants...they eventually go back to where they came from and go about citizenship the right way.  T  It sounds really harsh I know...but that's really only because we know they're already here...and the fact that they've already committed the crime should not ever be considered as a determining factor in our decision to remove them.  Ann Coulter has proposed this very idea and has taken heavy hits for it but in all actuality...she's right, it should have been this way since the beginning.
    "If there's no such thing as a stupid question then what kind of questions do stupid people ask"?

    "There's going to be a special place in Hell for people who spread lies through the veil of logical fallacies disguised as rational argument".

    "Oh, you don't like my sarcasm?  Well I don't much appreciate your stupid".


  • CovenyCoveny 417 Pts
    @Vaulk I would purpose you actually do some research. You can't get any of that stuff unless you are here legally. (except for emergency medical treatment because it's tough to ask nurses and doctors to just watch someone die in front of them that damn hippocratic oath!) As for the more stringent on companies that hire them, I guess you could do that, but it would cost money to get enforcement and whatnot when it really doesn't matter more of them are already leaving than entering the country. 
  • I agree with @coveny .
  • VaulkVaulk 480 Pts
    @ Coveny, since every U.S. Government organization admits openly that there is no possible way to calculate with ANY accuracy the number of illegal immigrants entering the country, then I need to know how it is that ANYONE could claim that more of them are leaving than coming.  I need to see some Source data or some logical deduction before I'll agree to contest this.  Meanwhile:

    https://fivethirtyeight.com/datalab/how-do-we-know-how-many-undocumented-immigrants-there-are/
    http://cis.org/Cost-Welfare-Immigrant-Native-Households

    You'll like this one, it explains how illegal immigrants get access to Federal Programs that you've claimed they can't get access to unless they're legal: http://www.gao.gov/assets/230/224907.pdf

    Here's some great videos on how Illegal Immigrants are getting government subsidized amenities like welfare, WIC, TANF, FoodStamps, government housing ect ect.


    But to recap the supposed *Myth* of illegal immigrants collecting welfare:  You come to the U.S., have a baby, then the baby qualifies for Social Security benefits, Welfare, TANF, WIC, Medicaid ect ect.

    The current pew poll uses an equation that includes the following variables: (U)  Unauthorized Immigrants =  (F) Total Foreign Born Population  -  (L) Estimated Legal Immigrant Population.  The issue here is how to identify (U) as a quantifiable variable...the problem is that it simply cannot be quantified.  Illegal immigrants cannot be counted entirely or even majorly simply due to the secretive nature of their existence in the U.S..  "Excuse me, would you mind telling the Census Bureau if anyone living here is an illegal immigrant"? 

    So without being able to accurately calculate the number of Illegal Immigrants entering the Country, or how many are here...then how can you accurately calculate how many are leaving?  The answer is: You simply cannot.  Therefor no one knows with any certainty that there are more leaving than coming and I concede as well that no one can know if there are more coming than leaving...the argument could go on as long as the origin of the Earth and neither side would win...which is why this isn't a debate on how many rather it's a debate on whether they should all be deported and I maintain my stance that they should be.





    agsrprorepublican19929love2debate
    "If there's no such thing as a stupid question then what kind of questions do stupid people ask"?

    "There's going to be a special place in Hell for people who spread lies through the veil of logical fallacies disguised as rational argument".

    "Oh, you don't like my sarcasm?  Well I don't much appreciate your stupid".


  • CovenyCoveny 417 Pts
    @Vaulk I concede that you can't know for certainty, but what difference does that make? We have to use some estimates if you aren't going to accept any numbers, then I guess there aren't any right? If you are actually interested in the information.

    https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/worldviews/wp/2017/01/27/even-before-trump-more-mexicans-were-leaving-the-us-than-arriving/?utm_term=.ba3f716e0aea

    I can not tell you how ironic I find it that you are on the side of "we can't know how many there are" and also on the "they are all using welfare". 


    prorepublican19929melanielust
  • I am on a very interesting side right now. I agree with both @vaulk An do @coveny . On one hand, you can't be certain how many illegals use welfare programs. Although, the probability is most likely very high as well. 
    Vaulk
  • VaulkVaulk 480 Pts
    @Coveny , I'm not on the side of "They all use welfare" nor did I make that statement.  If you believe I did as you've stated then I suggest you read my post again.
    "If there's no such thing as a stupid question then what kind of questions do stupid people ask"?

    "There's going to be a special place in Hell for people who spread lies through the veil of logical fallacies disguised as rational argument".

    "Oh, you don't like my sarcasm?  Well I don't much appreciate your stupid".


  • CovenyCoveny 417 Pts
    @Vaulk sorry I shouldn't have used the word all. Really though they aren't on welfare their children are, who are US citizens. We got this funny thing where we don't want children to starve to death. We are such wimps in this country. :smiley: 
  • @Vaulk, I agree with your position on this.  We need to take a position on a spectrum of being ruthless, but doing what's right 
    or
    being humanitarian and not doing anything

    I opt for the doing what's right
    Vaulk
  • VaulkVaulk 480 Pts
    @Coveny , We've become this nation that somehow doesn't hold people responsible for their actions.  If the Illegal Immigrant chose to come here illegally (Regardless of why) and then chose to have a child (With the rare exception of rape which has never been the majority of circumstances) then how is the U.S. somehow responsible for their actions?  More importantly, how are U.S. Citizens financially responsible (Tax Dollars) for the choices of the Illegal Immigrants who have no legal right to be here in the first place?
    agsr
    "If there's no such thing as a stupid question then what kind of questions do stupid people ask"?

    "There's going to be a special place in Hell for people who spread lies through the veil of logical fallacies disguised as rational argument".

    "Oh, you don't like my sarcasm?  Well I don't much appreciate your stupid".


  • CovenyCoveny 417 Pts
    @Vaulk I agree there are people in this country who are on government hand outs that the U.S. Citizens are financially responsible for and aren't held responsible for their actions, it's the 1%. (you know like your boy Trump who brags about how paying taxes is for losers) Immigrants can't afford the tax loopholes, and they help the economy rather than leeching off the people. I mean I get it, like when the soldiers came back from the vietnam war and everyone crapped all over them it's easy to blame the poor who are just doing what they have to do to make ends meet because they can't afford to get away from you. I mean it's clear that "illegal immigrants" are the ones who created the housing bubble and destroyed million of peoples retirement. Look while you are busy being mad at your fellow poor person the 1% continue to screw the rest of us over. They have corrupted our democracy. But ya man it's the mexicans that are the problem, and spending millions deporting them and hurting the economy is totally gonna help...


  • @Vaulk, great point.
  • VaulkVaulk 480 Pts
    @Coveny , I can't follow the tax loophole idea for Illegal Immigrants.  We're talking about people who don't have a social security number and who are majorly paid under the table for their services as they're not able to seek out and establish legal employment.  So...how exactly are they helping the economy?  If you can't pay income tax because you're income is paid under the table, and you can't pay social security tax because your income is paid under the table...then what exactly are you putting into the economy?  Sales Tax? 
    "If there's no such thing as a stupid question then what kind of questions do stupid people ask"?

    "There's going to be a special place in Hell for people who spread lies through the veil of logical fallacies disguised as rational argument".

    "Oh, you don't like my sarcasm?  Well I don't much appreciate your stupid".


  • CovenyCoveny 417 Pts
    @Vaulk you are of the position that immigrants not here legally are costing this country money, and yet you are requesting my help to understand how the economy works. Should you really be in this debate? Regardless you asked so I'll answer. <teacher mode on>

    The US is a consumer based economy in that the economy does it's very best when money is being spent rather than saved. When you buy groceries with you paycheck that helps the economy, anything that keeps money moving helps the economy. The reason for this is that supports businesses, and expansion because there is a demand for good as money is in the hands of those who are spending it. Anything that takes money away from this system hurts the economy, and this includes taxes. When the taxes are spent, they go back to being a positive and help the economy. (However that period of time from when you pay them to when the get used still "hurts" the economy) Anyone who saves money hurts the economy because they have taken money out of circulation and made money more scarce. (reduced supply) The economy doesn't care where the money came from, it just cares that products and services are getting purchased.

    Now to take all that and compare the 1% versus immigrants. Immigrants (and the majority of Americans) work paycheck to paycheck. This means every dime they get they spend. This is the ideal situation for the economy. The 1% on the other hand save money... they save millions, the 1% of the 1% save billions. This is terrible for the economy. As less money is in circulated, it becomes more difficult for anyone to get jobs, get paid, and spend their money, so the whole economy gets more and more crippled by this. To offset this the federal reserve prints more money, so we have it for circulation. This causes inflation as there is now more money total in the system, the value of each piece is lowered. Then as the new money enters the system, the 1% start grabbing it up, which makes the federal reserve print more, which makes the value continue to drop.

    Inflation (the dropping value of our money) is most acutely felt by salary/hours employees. This is because if they do manage to save any money, every year those saving have less and less purchasing power. This makes it more and more difficult for the model of work 50 years, save, and then retire. So we have fewer and fewer people who can afford to retire because of this. If their saving dodged the housing bubble, then what they made 30 years ago isn't worth but about 60% of what it was when they saved it. So to cover that difference they have to get back on the "job" treadmill to make ends meet.

    This causes a higher supply of workers in the work force, so the demand for workers drops. When the supply of workers is high companies can afford to pay workers lower wages. This also aggravates the problems with the economy as the poor (who spend every dime) they have less money to spend. As there is less money to spend, the economy drops and business begin to hurt. As they begin to hurt they lay off workers and the problem gets worse. The economy loves people who live paycheck to paycheck and hate people who save. Immigrants live paycheck to paycheck and the 1% saves.

    <teacher mode off>

    The 1% of this country don't pay taxes, their highly profitable companies ... don't pay taxes. As they hoard money they are able to pay workers less and less even though productivity keeps rising. So they don't have to spend, they don't have to pay taxes, and all they do is keep getting richer and richer, and hurting the economy more and more. It doesn't matter if immigrants pay income tax, when they spend there money someone else pays it, and as they are being paid under the table they have lower than minimum wages anyway so the amount of income taxes they would have to pay is almost non-existent anyway.  
    randal
  • randalrandal 64 Pts
    I agree with @Coveny . Not all illegal immigrants are costing the country money. Instead, they are greatly contributing to our society and the American economy due to them taking very low wages and doing a large amount of work. The work down is usually labor. Also, why are we only thinking about Mexican immigrants opposed to all illegal immigrants, globally not just at our borders. I don't Brielle ind deportations, due to the high cost and lowering our economy which it's just another huge factor in that action.
    Coveny
  • I don't believe they should be deported. It would be better to have a system that makes the path to citizenship easier and more accommodating of underprivileged Mexican families so that less people come into the US illegally. Most of the immigrants who are already here illegally do very beneficial work for society, especially in industries that need a lot of labor that not many people are willing to do.
    agsrWokeWhale
  • Coveny I'm curious as to where you got your information. The top 1% of America are more heavily taxed than any other group. The majority of the 1% puts more money in circulation than any other group as well. Think about who the real people are: the rich CEOs, the business magnates; they are the people who have and continue to put money into circulation, they create jobs with their companies and they facilitate the payment of thousands of people. It is necessary to have the 1% so that there can be a high standard for people to strive for, in addition to a plethora of philanthropical opportunities.
  • inc4tinc4t 162 Pts
    There is related debate rssentially on the same topic
    http://www.debateisland.com/discussion/580/illegal-immigration-debate
  • VaulkVaulk 480 Pts
    edited May 2017
    @Coveny ,

    Before we get into that, see below.



    The tax code is broken in the United States, so before we ever argue that a group is or isn't paying their fair share...we'd have to have a reasonable tax code.  Our current code is a disaster.

    Oh and view this:



    And lastly, we can take a look at what illegal immigrants are getting compared to some of the other more deserving citizens of our country.





    "If there's no such thing as a stupid question then what kind of questions do stupid people ask"?

    "There's going to be a special place in Hell for people who spread lies through the veil of logical fallacies disguised as rational argument".

    "Oh, you don't like my sarcasm?  Well I don't much appreciate your stupid".


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