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The unforgiveable sin explained (blasphemy of the Holy Spirit).
in Religion

By YeshuaBoughtYeshuaBought 83 Pts
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  • EvidenceEvidence 763 Pts
    @YeshuaBought ;
    All Minister John MacArthur does here is talk about how important it is for him as a Christian defender to know and to confess that Jesus is God, almost as if he is saying that if we don't, that would be "blasphemy against the Holy Spirit".

    He refers to:
    Mark 3:28 “Assuredly, I say to you, all sins will be forgiven the sons of men, and whatever blasphemies they may utter; 29 but he who blasphemes against the Holy Spirit never has forgiveness, but is subject to eternal condemnation”— 30 because they said, “He has an unclean spirit.”

    so he ties this together with the Trinity Doctrine teaching that Jesus is God, and as the Christian went through Europe beheading, burning, torturing anyone who would not accept the Christian Trinity-gods, he is painting the same picture: If we don't accept Jesus as God, then we are blaspheming against the Holy spirit as the scribes have saying that Jesus had the spirit of Beelzebub.

    Even though I used to love to listen to Mr. MacArthur as a Christian, I no longer do. I have renounced the pagan god worshipping multi-god Christian Religion, but not the good Bible believing and Christ teachings loving people, because I know with all my heart how I have been deceived all those years. So I pray in the name of Jesus Christ that he would send the Holy Spirit to open the eyes of all those good people who still hold on to Christianity and their gods, to "Get Out Of Her!"

    Mr. MacArthur is the one blaspheming God Word by suppressing the Holy Spirit from teaching billions of people the truth with this repetitious, brainwashing of over and over again pounding into peoples head the Trinity doctrine that makes Jesus a sun-god which we all know is Lucifer. He will have a lot to answer for on the fast coming Judgement Day!
  • pocopoco 87 Pts
    Christians do not have to be concerned about this.  Over & over in the NT, it tells us, that's once someone is 'saved,' it is irrevocable.  No where does it state otherwise.
    If someone blasphemes the Holy Spirit, they were never a true Christian to begin with.
    Evidence
  • @poco
    There is no true Christian. There are many denominations in Christianity, and all disagree on certain aspects. The Bible is up to interpretation by anyone, and some people view things written in the bible differently than others. Some people also choose to disagree with scripture at points. If to be a true Christian, you have to believe everything in the bible as literal fact, then true Christians would be a tiny minority.
  • pocopoco 87 Pts
    you:  There is no true Christian. There are many denominations in Christianity, and all disagree on certain aspects. The Bible is up to interpretation by anyone, and some people view things written in the bible differently than others. Some people also choose to disagree with scripture at points. If to be a true Christian, you have to believe everything in the bible as literal fact, then true Christians would be a tiny minority.


    me:  Just how have you ascertained there's no true Christians?
    I ask you if you know what is required to be a true follower of Jesus.  (Hint ..... sinner's prayer says a lot re this), & to be guaranteed salvation with God. 

    & no, the bible is not up to interpretation by anyone, altho it's true that there are diff interpretations of the same idea.  Though, there is agreement re much of what the bible's verses mean ..... & its message.  That is what's important, not a certain verses here & there.  The more one studies, the better acquainted they become with the bible's message.

    I don't know where you have ever heard that it takes a belief of a literal read of the bible to be a true Christian.  Please elaborate, bc that's a new one on me.  Just a cursory read of the NT will tell you that ...... over & over.

    You, like many other commenters here seem to assume things, for whatever reason, rather than investigate what you think is true. 
    Please tell me where you have come up with your beliefs stated above.  & wherever you have come up with them, don't go back for more "biblical knowledge."

    You seem to be typical re criticism of the bible.  Thing is, shouldn't one study both sides of a topic so as to become familiar with the truth about both sides, rather than assume things?  I am so very surprised that so many people never seemed to be familiar with debating protocol from argumentative English.  One would learn to attempt to be an expert with both sides of any argument to be able to argue from an intelligent perspective, rather than opinions such as you have come up with.  So puzzling. 





  • @Polaris95

    You stated "The Bible is up to interpretation by anyone, and some people view things written in the bible differently than others. Some people also choose to disagree with scripture at points. If to be a true Christian, you have to believe everything in the bible as literal fact; then true Christians would be a tiny minority." So, let's break this down and explain each claim you have made. 

    "The Bible is up to interpretation by anyone, and some people view things written in the bible differently than others." 
    • It is true anyone can interpret the Bible; the key is not to find your interpretation that fits your worldview but to study the scriptures make harmony with the whole Bible and understand what God's understanding is.  In other words, study to understand what God says, not what you want him to say.  Do this, and there is no disagreement.

    "Some people also choose to disagree with scripture at points." 
    • This is true because it does not fit their worldview.  For instance, the New Testament says there is only one reason to divorce a spouse, and that is for adultery (Mathew 19.9 "And I say to you, whoever divorces his wife, except for sexual immorality, and marries another, commits adultery; and whoever marries her who is divorced commits adultery."). However, many have twisted the scriptures and believe it's okay to divorced because I can always ask for forgiveness.  It is true one can ask for forgiveness, but forgiveness does not dissolve an adulteress relationship.  In other words, if one asks for forgiveness of something, it's called repenting, and you can't continue in the same state.  Example:  If a person robs a bank and ask for forgiveness can he keep the money?  No, he is still a thief and has stolen good.
    "If to be a true Christian, you have to believe everything in the bible as literal fact; then true Christians would be a tiny minority."
    • You don't have to believe everything literally because some parts of the bible are not meant to be literal.  There are parts that poetry, there are parts that are apocalyptic and or figurative in their speech, such as the book of Revelation.  Part's are parables that give a moral message, like in the Beatitudes (Mat 5-7) Christ said if your eye causes you to sin pluck it out.  He did not mean for you to mutilate your body.  He was instead stressing the importance of not having a sinful nature.   However, there are in fact many parts that are to be taken literal, again the key is to study and to come to know what is literal and what is not.   Understanding the Bible is not rock science, but when we want to make it fit into a worldview that it was not meant to, i.e., a sinful nature.  Things become complicated, not because of Gods word, but by our desires.
    • I do believe that there are just a few true Christians in the world.  When you study the Old Testament, the Jews often went against God's desires.  He would let them digress to a certain point then He would have them destroyed or put into captivity.  However, every time this took place, it speaks of God saving a remnant.  A small group of loyal followers.  Now does that mean everyone who professes to be a Christian is going to hell, no, but I believe that what it's saying is that out of all of mankind only a small portion will be found to have been faithful unto death? 
    When it comes to understanding what blasphemy is and what the only unforgivable sin is.  The word blasphemy can and does mean to elevate one's self to God's level or high in our thinking.  So, when a person thinks they know more than God or the Holy Spirit that person is not going to be apt to asking for forgiveness and repenting of their sins.  Instead, they will continue in their sinful nature.  So I tend to believe the only unforgivable sin is one you refuse to repent of, thus blaspheming against the Spirit.

  • EvidenceEvidence 763 Pts
    poco said:
    Christians do not have to be concerned about this.  Over & over in the NT, it tells us, that's once someone is 'saved,' it is irrevocable.  No where does it state otherwise.
    If someone blasphemes the Holy Spirit, they were never a true Christian to begin with.
    @poco It's been a long time I debated this "once saved always saved", .. can you elaborate on it some more with scripture?
    Thanks.
  • EvidenceEvidence 763 Pts
    poco said:
    you:  There is no true Christian. There are many denominations in Christianity, and all disagree on certain aspects. The Bible is up to interpretation by anyone, and some people view things written in the bible differently than others. Some people also choose to disagree with scripture at points. If to be a true Christian, you have to believe everything in the bible as literal fact, then true Christians would be a tiny minority.


    me:  Just how have you ascertained there's no true Christians?
    I ask you if you know what is required to be a true follower of Jesus.  (Hint ..... sinner's prayer says a lot re this), & to be guaranteed salvation with God. 

    & no, the bible is not up to interpretation by anyone, altho it's true that there are diff interpretations of the same idea.  Though, there is agreement re much of what the bible's verses mean ..... & its message.  That is what's important, not a certain verses here & there.  The more one studies, the better acquainted they become with the bible's message.

    I don't know where you have ever heard that it takes a belief of a literal read of the bible to be a true Christian.  Please elaborate, bc that's a new one on me.  Just a cursory read of the NT will tell you that ...... over & over.

    You, like many other commenters here seem to assume things, for whatever reason, rather than investigate what you think is true. 
    Please tell me where you have come up with your beliefs stated above.  & wherever you have come up with them, don't go back for more "biblical knowledge."

    You seem to be typical re criticism of the bible.  Thing is, shouldn't one study both sides of a topic so as to become familiar with the truth about both sides, rather than assume things?  I am so very surprised that so many people never seemed to be familiar with debating protocol from argumentative English.  One would learn to attempt to be an expert with both sides of any argument to be able to argue from an intelligent perspective, rather than opinions such as you have come up with.  So puzzling. 





    @poco where in the Bible does it teach for anyone to be Christian?

    25 Then Barnabas departed for Tarsus to seek Saul.
    26 And when he had found him, he brought him to Antioch. So it was that for a whole year they assembled with the church and taught a great many people. And the disciples were first called Christians in Antioch.

    The disciples were first called Christian in Antioch, and this mock word spread quickly, and we can see why?

    Antioch was the centre of the Seleucid kingdom until 64 bce, when it was annexed by Rome and was made the capital of the Roman province of Syria. It became the third largest city of the Roman Empire in size and importance (after Rome and Alexandria) and possessed magnificent temples, theatres, aqueducts, and baths. The city was the headquarters of the Roman garrison in Syria, one of whose principal duties was the defense of the empire’s eastern border from Persian attacks. it was there that the followers of Christ were first called Christians, and the city was the headquarters of the missionary St. Paul about 47–55 ce.

    There are only three places in the Bible that mention the word "Christian", in Acts 11:25, and here Acts 26, which seems like this could be used to refer someone to become a Christian, but not really. Let's examine it;

    Acts 26:24 Now as he thus made his defense, Festus said with a loud voice, “Paul, you are beside yourself! Much learning is driving you mad!” 

    We can see it starts off as mockery with Festus hinting on Paul going mad!

    25 But he said, “I am not mad, most noble Festus, but speak the words of truth and reason. 26 For the king, before whom I also speak freely, knows these things; for I am convinced that none of these things escapes his attention, since this thing was not done in a corner. 27 King Agrippa, do you believe the prophets? I know that you do believe.”

    28 Then Agrippa said to Paul, “You almost persuade me to become a Christian.”

    29 And Paul said, “I would to God that not only you, but also all who hear me today, might become both almost and altogether such as I am, except for these chains.”

    Paul knew what Agrippa was referring to; followers/disciples of Christ  which is what Paul now was, but instead of Agrippa saying: "You almost persuade me to become a disciple of Christ" he used the mock name that was becoming popular with the Gentiles in Antioch and surrounding cities, the word "Christian" because obviously Agrippa didn't want Paul to take his suggestion seriously.

    So the first time the word is mentioned in Acts 11:25, then in Acts 26:28, .. and finally Peter addressed the growing problem with the Believers in 1 Peter 4:

    Yet if any man suffer as a Christian, let him not be ashamed; but let him glorify God on this behalf.
  • pocopoco 87 Pts

    you: It's been a long time I debated this "once saved always saved", .. can you elaborate on it some more with scripture?
    Thanks.




    me:  (a)Romans 8:30 declares, "And those He predestined, He also called; those He called, He also justified; those He justified, He also glorified." This verse tells us that from the moment God chooses us, it is as if we are glorified in His presence in heaven. There is nothing that can prevent a believer from one day being glorified because God has already purposed it in heaven. Once a person is justified, his salvation is guaranteed—he is as secure as if he is already glorified in heaven.

    (b) Paul asks two crucial questions in Romans 8:33-34 "Who will bring any charge against those whom God has chosen? It is God who justifies. Who is he that condemns? Christ Jesus, who died—more than that, who was raised to life—is at the right hand of God and is also interceding for us." Who will bring a charge against God's elect? No one will, because Christ is our advocate. Who will condemn us? No one will, because Christ, the One who died for us, is the one who condemns. We have both the advocate and judge as our Savior.

    (c) Believers are born again (regenerated) when they believe John 3:3, Titus 3:5. For a Christian to lose his salvation, he would have to be un-regenerated. The Bible gives no evidence that the new birth can be taken away.

    (d) The Holy Spirit indwells all believers John 14:7, Romans 8:9 and baptizes all believers into the Body of Christ             1 Corinthians 12:13. For a believer to become unsaved, he would have to be "un-indwelt" and detached from the Body of Christ.

    (e) John 3:15 states that whoever believes in Jesus Christ will "have eternal life." If you believe in Christ today and have eternal life, but lose it tomorrow, then it was never "eternal" at all. Hence, if you lose your salvation, the promises of eternal life in the Bible would be in error.

    (f) In a conclusive argument, Scripture says, "For I am convinced that neither death nor life, neither angels nor demons, neither the present nor the future, nor any powers, neither height nor depth, nor anything else in all creation, will be able to separate us from the love of God that is in Christ Jesus our Lord" Romans 8:38-39. Remember the same God who saved you is the same God who will keep you. Once we are saved, we are always saved. Our salvation is most definitely eternally secure!


    Evidence
  • pocopoco 87 Pts
    Re your question about teaching a Christian .... Was that rhetorical bc you seemed to answer it?
  • EvidenceEvidence 763 Pts
    poco said:
    Re your question about teaching a Christian .... Was that rhetorical bc you seemed to answer it?
    Wow, @poco I'm so glad you know your Bible, there are so many questions, and so many different views on it where we ended up with tens of thousands of denominations all claiming to be Bible Believers, like the Once saved always saved above, which I have questions about, but this is first:

    OK, so no, not teaching a Christian, but I was asking where in the Bible does it say that the early disciples called themselves Christians? This is extremely important, especially knowing the history of the Roman Catholic Church and Emperor Constantine, do we Believers and followers of our Lord Jesus Christ want to be associated with such a paganist organization, .. please think about this?

    "All roads lead to Rome" meaning, all Religions lead to Rome, the abomination of desolation. Please, please look at this video, and then answer to my request below?



    It's clear that the gentiles, and the unbelieving Jews who till today reject Christ called the early disciples/believers the mock name "Christian". There is a huge difference when history talks about a group the people mocked with the word "Christian" and what the disciples referred to themselves as; "followers of the Way".

    First, before I go on to our "one saved always save" debate. and if you are Godsent to help me, then you (or any Christian reading this) will look into what the Lord has brought to my attention with prayer, and have both your physical and your spiritual eyes open. This, especially if you feel deep down in your soul that the end of all time is upon us, that soon this "One World Order" symbolic words will not be just words, but see that is soon becoming a stark reality, and that I believe without a doubt that this subject of this word "Christian" is something so important, that it will be what will separate the goats from the sheep, the chaff from the wheat, .. Believers and followers of Christ, from those following Satan. The chosen from those destined to destruction. So I humbly ask you with the love of Christ to read carefully what I say here, and take it very seriously, as if your soul salvation depended on it, .. which very well could be.

    So tell me this, but please pray before you answer, .. "if you were to come to the absolute knowledge that the word "Christian" was a derogatory word used to mock the early disciples, and later taken by the RCC along with the pagan gods worshipping Emperor Constantine, would you renounce this Religion called 'Christian' with its doctrines, and come back to simply become follower of the Way, which is understood as Christ? (not the existing Christian denominations that go by that name)

    Here is what I have done, and what you or any still called Christian would have to understand, and renounce:

    1. You must agree that you understand that the very Foundation of the Roman Catholic created Christian Religion is the "plural-gods" concept called the "Trinity Doctrine" that has been enforced in it's earliest conception by a Christian Army of soldiers who went out not by "turning the other cheek", but by Constantine's sword punishing, torturing and killing millions of people over the past 1,700 years, specifically the early believers, those early disciples who were "of the Way", because they would not and could not deny that their God is One, and that "there is no OTHER god besides Him", contrary to the Triune-plural gods concept taught by the RCC-Christian Religion, and it's thousands of denominations. (I am NOT a JW, or any other Christian non-trinitarian)

    2. You must be willing to seek out, and accept the One True God just as mentioned in the Bible, who is One in essence identified Himself throughout the Bible as: "Infinite and Eternal Creator God "I Am"" and accept that Infinite is God, and since Infinite has no borders, understandably nothing or no one could be besides Infinite, just as God said throughout the Bible.

    Would you (or any Christian reading this) be willing to make that change for Christ? NOT for me, .. but for your own salvation!?

  • pocopoco 87 Pts
    you:  OK, so no, not teaching a Christian, but I was asking where in the Bible does it say that the early disciples called themselves Christians? This is extremely important, especially knowing the history of the Roman Catholic Church and Emperor Constantine, do we Believers and followers of our Lord Jesus Christ want to be associated with such a paganist organization, .. please think about this?


    me:  I believe it's in Acts re the disciples being called Christians in Antioch.

    But as far as the Catholics being called pagans ..... kind of a stretch isn't it?  Maybe true early on bc they were pagans turned to follow Jesus in some manner, but aren't you being bit harsh here?

    you:  "All roads lead to Rome" meaning, all Religions lead to Rome, the abomination of desolation. Please, please look at this video, and then answer to my request below?


    me:  I don't have the time right now, 45 min, but will try later.  I grew up a Catholic, kinda grew disenchanted, then started studying the bible & consider myself a nondenominational Christian now. 

    The video I'm sure has much truth in it, but that doesn't mean that the Catholic Church doesn't help many people with their relationship with God.  I do not fault the whole, for the missteps of some.  I believe that any entity that helps one get closer to God does that person good, & therefore is in God's graces.  Are we not to judge others ..... especially when the misdeeds are in the past for the most part?



    you:  It's clear that the gentiles, and the unbelieving Jews who till today reject Christ called the early disciples/believers the mock name "Christian". There is a huge difference when history talks about a group the people mocked with the word "Christian" and what the disciples referred to themselves as; "followers of the Way".




    me:  Yes, Jesus' followers were initially said to be part of "The Way." 
    Well, Luke & Peter called Jesus' followers Christians.  I don't think they mocked them.  True, others may have mocked them bc there was much competition during the early times, but there was also true followers of Jesus that kept true to His teachings that called themselves Christians.


    you:  First, before I go on to our "one saved always save" debate. and if you are Godsent to help me, then you (or any Christian reading this) will look into what the Lord has brought to my attention with prayer, and have both your physical and your spiritual eyes open. This, especially if you feel deep down in your soul that the end of all time is upon us, that soon this "One World Order" symbolic words will not be just words, but see that is soon becoming a stark reality, and that I believe without a doubt that this subject of this word "Christian" is something so important, that it will be what will separate the goats from the sheep, the chaff from the wheat, .. Believers and followers of Christ, from those following Satan. The chosen from those destined to destruction. So I humbly ask you with the love of Christ to read carefully what I say here, and take it very seriously, as if your soul salvation depended on it, .. which very well could be.


    me:  I believe that many happenstance events/situations are Godsent.  Thing is, we miss many of them if not on watch. 

    I'm not sure of the End Time thing tho.  No one knows for sure.  Jesus stated this.  This time in history is not unlike many other secular popular times.  I look at it as tho any time could be my end time, so why even worry or consider the End Time thing?  What good will that do you, or anyone else ...... except to maybe drive non believers away thinking End Timers are crack pots, & stop listening when those dreaded words are said.

    True, Christian is so important, but no more so than any other time ...... when we consider our own salvation.  On the other hand, the connotation of the word Christian has been on the decline bc in the recent past so many teachers/people call themselves Christians & give perverted teachings.  I tend to call myself a believer when talking to non believers explaining this as told in last sentence.  It's not the words that are so important, it's our actions.



    you:  So tell me this, but please pray before you answer, .. "if you were to come to the absolute knowledge that the word "Christian" was a derogatory word used to mock the early disciples, and later taken by the RCC along with the pagan gods worshipping Emperor Constantine, would you renounce this Religion called 'Christian' with its doctrines, and come back to simply become follower of the Way, which is understood as Christ? (not the existing Christian denominations that go by that name)




    me:  As I said earlier, the past doesn't necessarily dictate the present not the future.  Why worry about a 3rd century person, when people are saved & follow Jesus just as they do in other Christian denominations?  Sure, not all of the things Catholic liturgy says is in the bible, but if some are lead to Jesus thru the Catholic religion, then it cannot be all bad .....no matter their past ...... centuries ago.


    you:  Here is what I have done, and what you or any still called Christian would have to understand, and renounce:

    1. You must agree that you understand that the very Foundation of the Roman Catholic created Christian Religion is the "plural-gods" concept called the "Trinity Doctrine" that has been enforced in it's earliest conception by a Christian Army of soldiers who went out not by "turning the other cheek", but by Constantine's sword punishing, torturing and killing millions of people over the past 1,700 years, specifically the early believers, those early disciples who were "of the Way", because they would not and could not deny that their God is One, and that "there is no OTHER god besides Him", contrary to the Triune-plural gods concept taught by the RCC-Christian Religion, and it's thousands of denominations. (I am NOT a JW, or any other Christian non-trinitarian)

    2. You must be willing to seek out, and accept the One True God just as mentioned in the Bible, who is One in essence identified Himself throughout the Bible as: "Infinite and Eternal Creator God "I Am"" and accept that Infinite is God, and since Infinite has no borders, understandably nothing or no one could be besides Infinite, just as God said throughout the Bible.

    Would you (or any Christian reading this) be willing to make that change for Christ? NOT for me, .. but for your own salvation!?



    me:  Any time someone tells me I "must do ..." for my salvation, & it's not spelled out in the bible specifically as told to me, I discount it as misguided. 

    Please tell me where in the NT it tells us to follow what you say here, while it does specifically tell us what to do re Jesus to be saved.  What it doesn't say, is once we do those things specified, what we can do to lose salvation.

    So, tell me why the NT is wrong, b4 you tell me why you are correct.  It seems as tho you, like the Catholic doctrine, adds things & discounts other things that are spelled out in the bible.

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