"I like him, he likes me.", says POTUS Trump in reference to Kim Jong Un. Your thoughts? - The Best Online Debate Website | DebateIsland.com - Debate Anything The Best Online Debate Website | DebateIsland.com
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"I like him, he likes me.", says POTUS Trump in reference to Kim Jong Un. Your thoughts?
in Global

By YeshuaBoughtYeshuaBought 191 Pts
I doubt the two dictators like each other.





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  • @YeshuaBought

    keep your friends close and your enemies closer, don't be fooled by what Trump says, it's an act to get what he wants, and so far that's not a bad thing.  If you have to kiss a little backside to get nukes removed, I support it.
    "I'm just a soul whose intentions are good
    Oh Lord, please don't let me be misunderstood"
    The Animals
  • It is a sad state of affairs when a president of a democratic country openly expresses his appreciation of the leader of the vilest state on the planet, and even sadder when both are suggested as the top candidates for the Nobel Peace Prize. On the other hand, it has been trendy among the US presidents for a long time now, going as far back as to Kennedy's term, with several notable exceptions such as Reagan. Obama hugged dictators probably more than any other president in the US history, so even Trump is an upgrade in this regard.

    Something Donald does not realize is that totalitarian dictatorships tend to be extremely opportunistic. Every time a worthwhile state expresses a good will towards them, they take it as a weakness, as something to exploit. Kim Jung Un will squeeze as much financial and humanitarian aid out of the US as possible with temporary and illusory concessions, and then double down on the hard line he had been pushing before. Does Kim like Donald? Yes, but not as a friend - rather, as a naive inexperienced statesman who can be exploited for Kim's personal benefit. The sooner Trump realizes what person he is dealing with, the fewer resources will be transferred into that black hole to permanently disappear.

    I still regret that McCain did not win the race back in 2008. John understood the state of world affairs from a first hand experience, and he would not have made such horrendous blunders as Obama and Trump did.
  • EvidenceEvidence 791 Pts
    edited October 11
    MayCaesar said:
    It is a sad state of affairs when a president of a democratic country openly expresses his appreciation of the leader of the vilest state on the planet, and even sadder when both are suggested as the top candidates for the Nobel Peace Prize. On the other hand, it has been trendy among the US presidents for a long time now, going as far back as to Kennedy's term, with several notable exceptions such as Reagan. Obama hugged dictators probably more than any other president in the US history, so even Trump is an upgrade in this regard.

    Something Donald does not realize is that totalitarian dictatorships tend to be extremely opportunistic. Every time a worthwhile state expresses a good will towards them, they take it as a weakness, as something to exploit. Kim Jung Un will squeeze as much financial and humanitarian aid out of the US as possible with temporary and illusory concessions, and then double down on the hard line he had been pushing before. Does Kim like Donald? Yes, but not as a friend - rather, as a naive inexperienced statesman who can be exploited for Kim's personal benefit. The sooner Trump realizes what person he is dealing with, the fewer resources will be transferred into that black hole to permanently disappear.

    I still regret that McCain did not win the race back in 2008. John understood the state of world affairs from a first hand experience, and he would not have made such horrendous blunders as Obama and Trump did.

    All the world’s a stage,
    And all the men and women merely players;
    They have their exits and their entrances,
    And a President in his term plays many parts

    @MayCaesar
    Applesauce
  • MayCaesar said:
    It is a sad state of affairs when a president of a democratic country openly expresses his appreciation of the leader of the vilest state on the planet, and even sadder when both are suggested as the top candidates for the Nobel Peace Prize. On the other hand, it has been trendy among the US presidents for a long time now, going as far back as to Kennedy's term, with several notable exceptions such as Reagan. Obama hugged dictators probably more than any other president in the US history, so even Trump is an upgrade in this regard.

    Something Donald does not realize is that totalitarian dictatorships tend to be extremely opportunistic. Every time a worthwhile state expresses a good will towards them, they take it as a weakness, as something to exploit. Kim Jung Un will squeeze as much financial and humanitarian aid out of the US as possible with temporary and illusory concessions, and then double down on the hard line he had been pushing before. Does Kim like Donald? Yes, but not as a friend - rather, as a naive inexperienced statesman who can be exploited for Kim's personal benefit. The sooner Trump realizes what person he is dealing with, the fewer resources will be transferred into that black hole to permanently disappear.

    I still regret that McCain did not win the race back in 2008. John understood the state of world affairs from a first hand experience, and he would not have made such horrendous blunders as Obama and Trump did.
    what has the U.S. given or given up to N.K. under Trump?  Hasn't Trump increased and stiffened the sanctions that where in place?  Isn't he tougher on N.K. than Obama was?  Trump even warned China not to supply them with oil.  What changes or events are you basing your opinion on?
    "I'm just a soul whose intentions are good
    Oh Lord, please don't let me be misunderstood"
    The Animals
  • @Applesauce That is so true. I have political pages on FB to avoid my partisan frienemies.


  • CYDdhartaCYDdharta 730 Pts
    edited October 11
    MayCaesar said:
    It is a sad state of affairs when a president of a democratic country openly expresses his appreciation of the leader of the vilest state on the planet, and even sadder when both are suggested as the top candidates for the Nobel Peace Prize. On the other hand, it has been trendy among the US presidents for a long time now, going as far back as to Kennedy's term, with several notable exceptions such as Reagan. Obama hugged dictators probably more than any other president in the US history, so even Trump is an upgrade in this regard.

    Something Donald does not realize is that totalitarian dictatorships tend to be extremely opportunistic. Every time a worthwhile state expresses a good will towards them, they take it as a weakness, as something to exploit. Kim Jung Un will squeeze as much financial and humanitarian aid out of the US as possible with temporary and illusory concessions, and then double down on the hard line he had been pushing before. Does Kim like Donald? Yes, but not as a friend - rather, as a naive inexperienced statesman who can be exploited for Kim's personal benefit. The sooner Trump realizes what person he is dealing with, the fewer resources will be transferred into that black hole to permanently disappear.

    I still regret that McCain did not win the race back in 2008. John understood the state of world affairs from a first hand experience, and he would not have made such horrendous blunders as Obama and Trump did.

    LOL, yeah, McCain was just great with foreign policy LOLOLOL.  Calling Kim Jong Un a "crazy fat kid" is definitely the way to get them to work with us.  Fortunately for all of us, McCain never got the chance to foist his ideas on foreign policy on the rest of the world.

  • @Applesauce ;

    Trump might be a bit harsher on North Korea than Obama, but he still makes the same mistakes. Same promises to lift the sanctions off in exchange of temporary and illusory concessions from the North Korean side. It has been the theme for many decades: North Korea starts waving its weapons around, the US promises humanitarian aid and easing out on the sanctions in exchange for demolition of some nuclear research polygons, it delivers - and then the situation gets back to the square one.

    A radically different approach is needed for dealings with this sort of states. Negotiations are important, but they must come from the position of force and ideological supremacy, not "We disagree on some things, but let us work together on those we agree on". The latter will always be exploited by the other side.
  • @MayCaesar

    The U.S. can't use force, not really.  His father was horrible also.  This will go on and on for generations still to come unless the family is removed from power and it becomes part of S.K. or it's own democracy.  Either way Trump has made more advancements than previous administrations.  There's no way to tell if that will be lasting but things are moving in the right direction rather than stagnating like the past decades.  The previous and common stance was just to wait it out.  Trump doesn't seem to want to do that, which explains what and why he's doing what he is.  If everything remains the same we are still better off.  They aren't threatening or testing only because of Trump.  That's a good thing right?  In those regards you have to give credit where credit is due, he's accomplished this which is more than any other president has, right?
    "I'm just a soul whose intentions are good
    Oh Lord, please don't let me be misunderstood"
    The Animals
  • @Applesauce

    Well, my point is exactly that this progress is temporary and illusory, and will not have any long-term boons, while will allow the North Korean regime to slightly ease their struggles out. Kims destroyed their nuclear polygons in the past many times as well, only to rebuild them quickly once the exchange was completed and they obtained everything they wanted from the other side. The only thing that is different this time is that the highest-ranked members of both Koreas, as well as the US president, met together on the neutral ground - but this seems to be more of a PR move to me, than any real motion in any direction.

    It is commendable that Trump wants to move the situation from the dead-end it has been stuck in for a long time - but he is not the first president to have this desire and to take the decisive steps in order to make it happen. The problem is, good intentions do not always lead to pragmatic actions. Obama wanted to provide everyone with affordable healthcare, and instead wasted enormous amounts of taxpayers' money and made healthcare even less affordable for everyone but the small minority. Similarly here, Trump acts in alignment with his desires - but not in alignment with how they can actually be made into reality.

    Reagan, McCain, Brzezinski and other giants of geopolitics demonstrated a very reasonable approach to dealing with totalitarian isolationist regimes. If only their views were shared by more politicians these days... We do not really have many individuals of this caliber left nowadays. "War hawk politics" are unpopular after the recent failures of the US on the Middle East and on the Russian front, and it is very convenient to label any hard line approach as "war hawk politics" - something Trump definitely does not want to be associated with. 

  • @MayCaesar

    I forget the fail assassination attempt by the U.S. but that put an end to the U.S. doing things like that, though i'm not sure I agree with such a limitation.  Afaik the sanctions are much stronger than before Trump and they have not changed since being implemented.  The proof is in the pudding.  While I see potential and hope for the best it mostly is a facade.  That's all any of this talk is, regardless of who is doing it or has done it.  Actions speak louder than words and only results matter.  All we can do is wait and see.
    "I'm just a soul whose intentions are good
    Oh Lord, please don't let me be misunderstood"
    The Animals
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