just good old god

maxx

actually I stated that I do not have a belief;  I said that I do not know. That is why I can look at the bible and other beliefs objectively. I would be more likely to believe that 
god if so, created the universe for his own use, not ours and we are simply by-products of his creation. @Sand

Sand

@maxx

I am glad you can look at things objectively. Nevertheless, what good is it to take a neutral stand? Seeing things objectively? This is illogical. Whether if you determine there is a God and you feel the Bible does not relate to God. You may need to seek out another religious book or make your own.

You must admit the other alternative is there is no God. So whatever you do will be futile if that is the case. The only logical conclusion is to direct our efforts to please whatever entity created us.

Choosing a side doesn’t mean you know for sure. It means you make the best logical decision for the information you have. Error often is to be preferred to indecision. If everyone sat and made no conclusions until they had absolute proof, nothing would be done. No airplanes, no cars, no science, no religion, nothing. Greatness is never achieved through indecision. Everyone would be just thinking. We all must make the best decision for the information we have. Working in harmony with your decision helps progress, growth, and understanding to be made.

This is just food for thought. If you see an error in my thinking please point it out. I am trying to grow! Fire helps growth! That's why I enjoy communicating viewpoints with yourself,ZeusAres42,Plaffelvohfen, Neopesdom, ethang5, etc. It helps us remove the impurities from our viewpoints, and replace with stronger materials.

maxx

I cant agree that looking at things objectively is illogical. People would all be sheep and stuck in a rut if we did not do so.  Seeing things objectively is what broke the old worn out conventions of yesteryears and helped create new wisdoms. For instance, galileo was ex-communicated by the church for declaring that the earth revolved around the sun, not to mention what people saw through his telescope. You state that greatness is never achieved though indecision; that is generalizing. It depends on what one is indecisive about. Galileo was indecisive about believing that all bodies revolved around the earth. He achieved greatness. newton, Einstein and many others achieved greatness by be undecided about what others believed and in doing so, opened up new frontiers. Indecision is not saying I dont know one way or another; it means that a person wants to explore all options before declaring his-self. You are mistaking indecision as one who does not explore new possibilities when instead they are simply undecided because they want to look at all sides and options.@Sand

Sand

You maybe right, I probably mistakened being indecisive with someone who doesn't explore new possibilities. Nevertheless, Galileo, Einstein, and Newton were all religious and this didn't hinder their objectibility. But, thanks for the correction.

Dee

@Sand

You say .....Galileo, Einstein, and Newton were all religious and this didn't hinder their objectivity 

  

My reply....Galileo and Newton were like everyone else at the time they lived in ....religious , Einstein was not he thought such Christian beliefs were childish I agree........

Einstein stated that he believed in the pantheisticGod of Baruch Spinoza.He did not believe in a personal Godwho concerns himself with fates and actions of human beings, a view which he described as naïve.He clarified however that, "I am not an atheist",[4] preferring to call himself an agnostic,or a "religious nonbeliever."Einstein also stated he did not believe in life after death, adding "one life is enough for me."He was closely involved in his lifetime with several humanistgroups.

It was, of course, a lie what you read about my religious convictions, a lie which is being systematically repeated. I do not believe in a personal God and I have never denied this but have expressed it clearly. If something is in me which can be called religious then it is the unbounded admiration for the structure of the world so far as our science can reveal it.

In a letter to Eric Gutkinddated 3 January 1954, Einstein wrote in German, "For me the Jewish religion like all others is an incarnation of the most childish superstitions. And the Jewish people-to whom I gladly belong and with whose mentality I have a deep affinity have no different quality for me than all other people. As far as my experience goes, they are also no better than other human groups, although they are protected from the worst cancers by a lack of power. 

maxx

many people know Einstein did not believe in a personal God so to speak and you are simply wrong about everyone being religious back in the days of galileo and newton. worst case of generalizing I have ever seen. The roman catholic church was more of a form of a government that a religious body and many peasants of the time refused to accept not only the laws imposed by them but also disregarded the beliefs.@Dee

Dee

@maxx

You say .......many people know Einstein did not believe in a personal God so to speak and you are simply wrong about everyone being religious back in the days of galileo and newton. worst case of generalizing I have ever seen

My reply .....”Worst case ever” .....Hilarious so the whole of Europe was Christian or claimed to be yet I’m “generalizing”? 

. You say .....

The roman catholic church was more of a form of a government that a religious body and many peasants of the time refused to accept not only the laws imposed by them but also disregarded the beliefs

My reply ......So tell me if Catholicism was the main religion of the times and I’m “generalizing “ were they all atheists then as I’m wrong about them being religious you claim , you really are offensively  

Sand

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Religious_views_of_Isaac_Newton

Sir Isaac Newton wrote a lot of religious books for religion and pro God.

Isaac Newton was very religious.

Galileo - considered the priesthood as a young man - his idea were only considered atheistic because it went against the church views at the time.

Galileo - "Galileo went to Rome to defend himself and his Copernican and biblical ideas. " - Wiki

He still believed in the Bible, but felt his ideas were not in conflict.

I may be wrong about Einstein, he could be viewed as religious or possibly not:

Einstein - He clarified however that, "I am not an atheist", preferring to call himself an agnostic, or a "religious nonbeliever." - Wiki

He stated he is not an atheist. Meaning he believes in God, just not the way others view God.

Answering a Japanese scholar who asked him about ‘scientific truth’, Albert wrote,
 ‘Certain it is that a conviction, akin to religious feeling, of the rationality or intelligibility of the world lies behind all scientific work of a higher order. This firm belief, a belief bound up with deep feeling, in a superior mind that reveals itself in the world of experience, represents my conception of God. In common parlance this may be described as "pantheistic".’ - Ideas and Opinions by Albert Einstein, Crown Publishers, New York, NY, USA, pp. 261–62, 1954

I'm not trying to say everyone needs to be religious, I am trying to make the point that religious people can still be objective.

Feel free to correct, I am light on this line of thought.

maxx

you need to prove all of Europe was religious; you stated it so prove it.@Dee