Should women face the DEATH PENALTY for having an abortion??

Barnardot

@jack Since when did they say yes like never and it was law makers any way any way they said they were considering it so what are you trying to say but not saying at all.

jack

Barnardot said:

they said they were considering it so what are you trying to say but not saying at all.

Hello B:

Who, exactly are "they"??  Well, they're South Carolina law makers, and "they" wanna off women who get abortions.  Whether they GET to do that is beside the point - they WANT to. 

I rest my case.

excon

John_C_87

@jack

Women already have faced the Death Penalty as it is an illegal slang used by lawyers and others who often cannot be legally held for perjury in a standard court of law. However, the lie and liars can best be addressed in an Armed Services tribunal when it is presented before the Armed Services as a United States Constitutional Right that is being made and argued before the people. The observation describes women have been assembled as a 2nd Amendment militia by the way law and women themselves has been set as a united state by legislation in connection to this term “abortion". The choice to amputate by a woman is based on her ability to perform a sealed Military tribunal and the violation of that seal publicly is a in question of patient privacy. Not just of the women by also of the male who is also connected to a pregnancy.

Who is saying a woman is having an abortion a doctor, a law, or the women? There has never been an abortion in America they have all been Female Specific Amputations that have been said to be abortions. In many if not all events described as an abortion the method to which the description of a female specific amputation had been called abortion was Illegal and a violation of a constitutional right never set as self-evident truth before the courts of law.

Both sides of the argument of a woman’s constitutional right to seek a medical amputation when the stop a form of immigration that can result in a death of a women is a outcome. It is both parties that can face capital punishment and it is not just women who seeks the amputation. The Constitutional right the chose is over the state of the union of whole truth to be held as self-evidnet as the perfect connection to established jsutice.  is not the same as a women's right to choose and the difference is a complex series of whole truths that link all women together then all pregnancies to established justice.

jack

John_C_87 said:

@jack

There has never been an abortion in America they have all been Female Specific Amputations that have been said to be abortions.

Hello John:

So, abortion is an amputation, huh?

I like it.

excon

MayCaesar

The 17 members of the house of representatives (out of 124) who introduced this bill do not constitute "your government" if you live in South Carolina. Small groups of representatives all around the country systematically propose weird bills that do not go anywhere. This particular bill appears to violate the constitution of South Carolina as per the state Supreme Court's ruling on January 5th.

The bill also says nothing about "death penalty". Here is the actual bill: https://www.scstatehouse.gov/sess125_2023-2024/bills/3549.htm What it does propose is this:

enforcement is subject to the same presumptions, defenses, justifications, laws of parties, immunities, and clemencies as would apply to the assault of a person who had been born alive

It simply classifies abortion in certain cases as murder, which in South Carolina can be punished by death in the presence of one of the 12 aggravating factors. Only one of those factors (the victim being under the age of 11) seems to be potentially applicable here, and it is not clear if it is actually applicable given the ambiguity of the "who had been born alive" part in the context of someone under the age of 0.

It is a pretty abhorrent proposal, but you are citing something that is a product of the broken telephone game going on for a while. Doing a bit of research before reposting a clickbait article from The Hill could be quite handy.

jack

MayCaesar said:

The 17 members of the house of representatives (out of 124) who introduced this bill do not constitute "your government"

It simply classifies abortion in certain cases as murder, which in South Carolina can be punished by death

Hello M:

Nahhh...  The legislature IS the government, and 17 of 'em wanna murder women who get abortions..

And, you can play footsie with it all you want, but if enacted, and they wish to, they'll KILL women..  Count on it. 

excon

John_C_87

jack said:

John_C_87 said:

@jack

There has never been an abortion in America they have all been Female Specific Amputations that have been said to be abortions.

Hello John:

So, abortion is an amputation, huh?

I like it.

excon

  Thank you..there has been a great deal of work and many sacrifices that have gone it the colmination of the description. The obective is to assemble a whole truth to be used in describing as self-evident something to be held as a more perfect connection made between all women and established justice.

No abortion is not an amputation, the word abortion and how it is used internatinally and in America is a malpractice of law. The medical treatment a woman receives in regulating a high-risk immigration into America is a medical amputation in "whole" truth.

John_C_87

@MayCaesar

It simply classifies abortion in certain cases as murder,

Make no mistake MayCaesar the term abortion and how it is used in legislation and law describes possible murder in all cases. That is reason why it is unfit for use in United States Constitutional Right, that is why it is also unfit for use in law, period. It is the lawyers job of a said state to represent the women they may be hired too, however, it is then the peoples United State in the phrase United States Constitution that describes all woman are to be represented in Constitutional Right. Even if "they" the girls who have become women cannot produce the self-evident truth and state of the union to hold themselves there. The failure is understandable as It is by far the greatest task set forth upon the people by some of the brightest and best minds included in legal representation the world has ever known.

MayCaesar

jack said:

MayCaesar said:

The 17 members of the house of representatives (out of 124) who introduced this bill do not constitute "your government"

It simply classifies abortion in certain cases as murder, which in South Carolina can be punished by death

Hello M:

Nahhh...  The legislature IS the government, and 17 of 'em wanna murder women who get abortions..

And, you can play footsie with it all you want, but if enacted, and they wish to, they'll KILL women..  Count on it. 

excon

I wish I had your mind-reading abilities! Unfortunately, I can only go by the real world verifiable data (the data you do not seem to have reviewed), and there is nothing in that data suggesting the murderous intent behind this proposal.

You asked in a different thread if Trump was going to win in 2024... I do not see why he would not when his opposition largely employs the same strategy as him: throwing as much dirt as possible at their political rivals hoping that some of it sticks, rather than taking a deep breath and making a logical argument against their actual actions and positions. Trump happens to be better at this game than you guys, and the probability is high that he will win it. How does that saying goes? "Play *beep* games - win *beep* prizes"?

If you want to get good at this game, you have to go further. Come up with a catchy label for these representatives. Something colorful, like "Pocahontas". May I propose "Electricians"? Too subtle a reference, perhaps...

bjinthirty

I think the public slang for "abortion" when referred to the medical term "amputate" is subtle. It should inexplicably be noted the connection between law and order as an example to public dependance of a working government serving its purpose. Therefore Government should be wise to serve the aptitude of these claims as a courtesy to the people. It doesn't take much to realize that a woman or man can cause an abortion at home by natural means. However, the publics decision to turn to government for an answer should be viewed as a comforting one. Give the people what they want i say.


As far as the death penalty goes, it is only a fairy tale. A disturbing story meant to perhaps grab public attention to some sort. It would never be enforced because it violates the legal code of ethics of professional conduct. 

Now if you ask me personally should they be given the death penalty for abortion?. I say yes but to a limited extent of judicial powers. The ruling of such case would be translated in the judicial process easily misinterpreted but meant to raise public awareness and generate funding for the state. Holding noth parties accountable if brought to trial. The outcome of each trial would always result as no death penalty given and under no means have either party under arrest unless substantially necessary.

This would induce a ripple effect across the country for marriages or couples to better communicate and work things out. The focus is on the children because since they are the future of this country we want to work hard to provide them a safe stable environment for them to grow up in.

theinfectedmaster

Argument Topic: Absolutely not.

For the most part, I think abortion is wrong, but that doesn't mean I think that any woman should be getting the death penalty for that.

Barnardot

@jack ;Well, they're South Carolina law makers, and "they" wanna off women who get abortions.

Well yes like thats what I said I said

it was law makers any way 

And they didn't 

."they" wanna off women who get abortions

Did they because they said 

they were considering it

And the article did not say who these law makers were did it. Like they were probably some radical dweeds sitting in a back street law office who said that while they were off there heads on weed right. Yes thats right. So you dont rest any case at all because there is no case because you made it all up.

John_C_87

jack said:

MayCaesar said:

The 17 members of the house of representatives (out of 124) who introduced this bill do not constitute "your government"

It simply classifies abortion in certain cases as murder, which in South Carolina can be punished by death

Hello M:

Nahhh...  The legislature IS the government, and 17 of 'em wanna murder women who get abortions..

And, you can play footsie with it all you want, but if enacted, and they wish to, they'll KILL women..  Count on it. 

excon

Want to know what bothers me here jack? 

If your answer was yes: Are the 17 members representing a United State between South Carolina's Constitution and America's Constitution? 
What is the condition of the state of the union with established justice? Abortion Vs. Loss of Privacy
Then legal argument is adding voters Vs. protecting the voters you have.

 2021-2022 Bill 3016: SC Data Privacy Act - South Carolina Legislature Online (scstatehouse.gov)

John_C_87

@bjinthirty
As far as the death penalty goes, it is only a fairy tale. A disturbing story meant to perhaps grab public attention to some sort. It would never be enforced because it violates the legal code of ethics of professional conduct. 

Here is the problem the State & Federal Courts have laws describing that narrative above pointless as they have been exempted by their unconstitutional connection to each other and the law. It is and will always be an Armed Service Judicial matter or a Military court by State & Federal Congressional making. A women and man she chooses to copulates with has no such protection written in law which turns into an even larger political issue down the line . 

OakTownA

This legislation is not the first of it's kind, nor will it be the last. NC attempted to pass such legislation in both 2021 and 2022, but it never made it out of committee. Texas has also tried to pass such a bill, as have Kentucky, Oklahoma, and Arkansas, and conservative legislators in Alabama are trying to do the same.
"The bills being introduced in Arkansas, Texas, Kentucky and South Carolinalook to establish that life begins at conception. Each of these bills explicitly references homicide charges for abortion. Homicide is punishable by the death penalty in all of those states." 
The bills in Oklahoma, South Carolina, and Texas include the abortion pill, and Wyoming recently banned mifepristone, which is a drug commonly used to induce an abortion.
https://www.aclu.org/news/reproductive-freedom/no-one-should-face-the-death-penalty-for-accessing-health-care
https://www.theguardian.com/us-news/2023/mar/10/republican-wave-state-bills-homicide-charges
https://www.vox.com/2023/3/19/23647123/wyoming-abortion-pill-ban-south-carolina-texas
These legislators don't care that their local Supreme Courts have ruled against them; they will keep trying, or appeal to the SCOTUS. They do not seem to see the irony of it, too!

John_C_87

@OakTownA

These legislators don't care that their local Supreme Courts have ruled against them; they will keep trying, or appeal to the SCOTUS. They do not seem to see the irony of it, too!

There is no irony it is a malpractice of law OakTownA plain and simple. The problem is it is not a State or Federal Court issue as it is a Violation of a United States Constitutional Right conducted by a malpractice of law in which the State and Federal Courts have pass law to block any connection to established justice. Even the Right of law to patient privacy is violated by abortion legislation be it in favor or against and not movement towards established justice is taking place due to the malpractice of law being held.

Dreamer

Argument Topic: This is scary. Is this patriarchal misogyny, religious zealots, or a combination of both?

"The bill does not provide an exception for rape or incest" thehill

Yikes! The irony that conservatives use strong loaded words including totalitarianism in regards to smoking. Clearly, conservatives do not value human life. Read the ridiculous title of this conservative article.

"The Totalitarian Crusade Against Second-Hand Smoke" reason.com Brendan O'Neill 2014

Sheesh, what about the lack of mandates in conservatives states? Being conservative is a risk factor for the Kraken sub-variant. The logical inconsistencies of today's Republicans is maddening.

Dreamer

Argument Topic: This is absurd implantation often fails.

"would redefine “person” under state law to include a fertilized egg, giving it at the point of conception equal protection under the state’s homicide laws, including the death penalty." thehill

"Even if the timing is right, implantation may not happen. According to researchersTrusted Source, a lack of implantation is a common cause of early pregnancy loss."

https://www.medicalnewstoday.com/articles/implantation-symptoms

What this means is that if an egg is fertilized and then implantation fails, common even if you do everything correct, you are guilty of homicide. If given the death penalty the human race would cease to exist if this was actually enforced. Absolutely ludicrous. Do these people know anything about biology?

OakTownA

@John_C_87
When your group is called "pro-life," arguing that someone should be put to death for having an abortion is, by definition, irony. I have no idea what all you were trying to say.

John_C_87

@OakTownA

When your group is called "pro-life," arguing that someone should be put to death for having an abortion is, by definition, irony. I have no idea what all you were trying to say.

United States Constitutional right describes a connection of pro-life, pro-choice, and abortion in legislation of law as a malpractice of law created to prevent a state of the union with established justice. Yes, I know you have no idea what I am writing down, not saying but placing in writing. That does not mean it is not a whole truth....

Does it?

John_C_87

When your group is called "pro-life," arguing that someone should be put to death for having an abortion is, by definition, irony. I have no idea what all you were trying to say.

To be clear a women would face Capital charges for ordering an abortion not having an abortion. To repeat there is no women in the United States of America who has had an abortion since the year 1973 as a united state Constitutional Right they have all been Female-Specific Amputations instead. The just cause object to the use of abortion in all conditions of legislation of law in all states in America is the violation of privacy which is created by the malpractice of law in deceitfully collecting admissions to a fabricated in advance possible crime.

John_C_87

@Dreamer

What this means is that if an egg is fertilized and then implantation fails, common even if you do everything correct, you are guilty of homicide. If given the death penalty the human race would cease to exist if this was actually enforced. Absolutely ludicrous. Do these people know anything about biology?

This is simple a partial truth, not whole truth. To which at some point it is highly likely the lawyers who also hold medical degrees have been consulted. The grievance in a court at some point will become the obstruction taking place over what is stopping a state of the Union with established justice. Again why this then becomes an Armed Service court proceeding is the implication of an attack on United States Constitution made by a malpractice of law.

This is not a religious argument and is well on the way to become a conspiracy linking several Executive officers XXXVII – IVL (37 – 46) But who is counting?

John_C_87

I have no idea what all you were trying to say

You are quite correct. I understand clearly you have not received all relative pertinent information as it may have been presented to you as a juror in a criminal case involving perjury in the matter of abortion and the malpractice of law it creates in legislation. Thanks for the liberty to allow me to attempt to explain and establish a more perfect state of the union with established justice then what is made with the term abortion.

OakTownA

@Dreamer
People in the United States have all ready been arrested, tried, and found guilty of manslaughter after having a miscarriage. This happened before the SCOTUS overturned Roe, and will increase in the years to come. More than 50 people in the US have been arrested for child neglect or manslaughter after testing positive for drugs. They were tested after having a miscarriage or stillbirth. States where this has happened includes Alabama, South Carolina, Oklahoma, and nine others. Most, if not all, have some sort of fetal personhood legislation. There is no evidence that the deaths were caused by drug use, but they were arrested anyway. 
https://www.themarshallproject.org/2022/09/01/they-lost-their-pregnancies-then-prosecutors-sent-them-to-prison
A 2013 study showed that from 1973-2005, there were just about 400 cases were people were investigated and/or prosecuted do to the death of a fetus. That number has since increased three fold to over 1,200. And it's not just people who use illegal drugs; people who use prescribed drugs like Adderall have also been charged. Marshae Jones was charged after losing her fetus due to being shot. She was charged because she "started" the fight. Kendisjia Jones took abortion medications in Georgia BEFORE abortion was illegal there, and was charged with the death of her fetus. I could go on. This is not going to get better as more and more states decide that a fetus is a person. 
https://www.11alive.com/article/news/national/miscarriages-are-already-criminalized-roe-v-wade/85-7e78facf-b673-4775-8a09-9a45e3a794b2
https://www.npr.org/2022/07/03/1109015302/abortion-prosecuting-pregnancy-loss

OakTownA

@John_C_87
"United States Constitutional right describes a connection of pro-life, pro-choice, and abortion in legislation of law as a malpractice of law created to prevent a state of the union with established justice. Yes, I know you have no idea what I am writing down, not saying but placing in writing. That does not mean it is not a whole truth....

Does it?"

No idea, as I have no clue what this means.

Dreamer

Argument Topic: Oh wow, thank you for the informative post. :)

@OakTownA

There is a lot I missed. Did you know about fake abortion clinics outnumber real ones 3-1?

https://counterhate.com/blog/anti-abortion-fake-clinics/

They are called crisis pregnancy centers.

bjinthirty

Maybe if an activist out there decides to, without consent impregnate the mothers, daughters and wife of all politicians pushing for this law. Its interesting to think.


And what makes someone think this law may not be used as a powerful weapon. Women already report many fake allegations to incriminate an innocent man. What makes someone believe that a man won't intentionally corner a woman with this against a wall. Isnt there better laws to pass than this? Over in Arizona, the state just found out by accident that Saudi arabia was pumping water for years without paying. There should be more laws invested in oversight before making a huge leap into this unprepared.

Dreamer

Argument Topic: Hmmm, I didn't hear about Saudi Arabia pumping water for years, do you have a source?

@bjinthirty

Ever hear the Monty Python song every sperm is sacred.

"Every sperm is sacred
Every sperm is great
If a sperm is wasted
God gets quite irate"

John_C_87

@OakTownA

No idea, as I have no clue what this means.

It describes a situation and in the easiest way to understand the situation it details. You are a woman speaking for all women and men. Yet, you are talking about a subject which should be directed in law to represent all women with a man's involvement limited at the onset of Filed Grievance before written in legislation of law. We, America does not write laws describing the legal ways to shoot people both men and women with guns it has and should not write laws describing how women and men can “kill” using sexual activity.

BEFORE abortion was illegal there. Abortion was and will always be possibly illegal everywhere when it is written into law. The word  is now dependendent on the fact a State of Law such as New Jersey, New York, and Califoria and others must have laws describing the State of law itself can not be charged with a crime. This process is a possible malpratice of law and it is what misleads you to believe abortion is even possibly to hold itself legal. The difference between Female-Specific amputation and abortion as a American United States Constitutional Right is that Female-Specific amputation will always hold itself legal.

And why do "you" have known clue what something means when it relates to what you are talking about?

bjinthirty

Dreamer said:

@bjinthirty

Ever hear the Monty Python song every sperm is sacred.

"Every sperm is sacred
Every sperm is great
If a sperm is wasted
God gets quite irate"

https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.azfamily.com/2022/12/28/wells-are-running-dry-drought-weary-arizona-foreign-owned-farms-guzzle-water-feed-cattle-overseas/?outputType=amp




no  I have not heard that song. are you implying that you want mine?

John_C_87

@bjinthirty

Please explain the connection to established justice I do not understand the point of the Monty Python association.