Does Trump have an army albeit a secret one?

Openminded

Argument Topic: Once again I must correct you and tell you no meme was used on my part.

@Factfinder

Once again I must correct you and tell you no meme was used on my part. It is now and remains a video depicting the true nature of biden. I do not believe you would ever defend trump. The fact that you claim trump saying his daughter is both smart and beautiful and any guy would be lucky to have her; would "sway" you MORE into believing he groped someone than a video actually showing biden groping little girls "sways" you into thinking biden has groped, leaves for little doubt that you would ever defend trump. And is cause to question your judgment.

The video you posted was a meme. It was altered with the misleading title ¨Biden Groping Children Compilation" and ¨This is not normal¨. It was built up to convey something entirely different than the actual purpose of the video. And it was proliferated through social media and other forums.

As I said, if Trump was affectionately (though unthinkingly) touching children, yes I would defend him if the media propagated this as something nefarious.

And just where in the video I posted about Trump and sexualizing his daughter does it say that Trump said his daughter was smart???  And where did it say any guy would be lucky to have her?

Some might say you are not grounded in reality. I was in a discussion with MaeCaesar about ignorance. This supports what I said to her - Ignorance can lead to delusion.

Openminded

Argument Topic: So now you're pretending you have never used "air quotes" @Openminded?

@Factfinder

I am not pretending I don´t use air quotes. Air quotes are finger quotes physically displayed by forming two fingers of each hand and raising them in the air.

Factfinder

Openminded said:

@Factfinder

Once again I must correct you and tell you no meme was used on my part. It is now and remains a video depicting the true nature of biden. I do not believe you would ever defend trump. The fact that you claim trump saying his daughter is both smart and beautiful and any guy would be lucky to have her; would "sway" you MORE into believing he groped someone than a video actually showing biden groping little girls "sways" you into thinking biden has groped, leaves for little doubt that you would ever defend trump. And is cause to question your judgment.

The video you posted was a meme. It was altered with the misleading title ¨Biden Groping Children Compilation" and ¨This is not normal¨. It was built up to convey something entirely different than the actual purpose of the video. And it was proliferated through social media and other forums.

As I said, if Trump was affectionately (though unthinkingly) touching children, yes I would defend him if the media propagated this as something nefarious.

And just where in the video I posted about Trump and sexualizing his daughter does it say that Trump said his daughter was smart???  And where did it say any guy would be lucky to have her?

Some might say you are not grounded in reality. I was in a discussion with MaeCaesar about ignorance. This supports what I said to her - Ignorance can lead to delusion.

Do you realize a meme and a video are two entirely different things? If your attention span doesn't allow you to follow a video so you miss what's in it, that's your problem. It would be delusional to think I could fix that for you. What's not normal was a pervert who felt he was untouchable so he fondled children on camera. Your blind allegiances to false narratives compel your programmed responses. Which is the biden video is fake? But it's not and you know it. Oh but that's right, you don't review sources seeking any truth they have, you look for trump conspiracies so of course you couldn't see in your own video the folly of your accusations that you falsely claimed the video supported. So now your asking where was that? 

Factfinder

 Go back to my post that you're lying about and tell me what I should have done to point out your leading set up question. Or do you have the same problem following conversations as you do news sources?  @Openminded Tell me how you still don't get it. You know something, all the closeminded irrational argumentation in the world won't change the fact you can't produce this "secret army". 

Openminded

Argument Topic: If I met Trump in real life, I would be very interested in talking to the guy, getting business tips from him, hearing about his experiences and struggles.

@MayCaesar

If I met Trump in real life, I would be very interested in talking to the guy, getting business tips from him, hearing about his experiences and struggles. Something tells me that many of the people who despise him to extreme level cannot even see a human in him; they just see a target, a boxing bag to throw their personal frustrations at. I remember someone on some late night show seriously asking, "Trump is president right now. How can we raise children in such a world?" Yeah, Trump is totally responsible for you not knowing how to raise children in a world where you do not like your president.

I believe Trump is an exceptionally damaged human. I don´t use him as a punch bag to get my frustration out. My intuition and intelligence tells me he will do great damage to America (and quite possibly the world) if reelected. Maybe what was being conveyed in the late night show is that raising children is hard enough in complex times; and a manipulative and unstable POTUS at the helm would mean raising children with hyper vigilance taking much joy out of raising a family

Openminded

Argument Topic: You disagree with me because, as usual, you did not read my comment carefully. I was talking about specific sociopathic traits that lead to one becoming a butcher, not sociopathic traits in general. See how careful I am with my language, and how little respect for care and precision you have?

@MayCaesar

You disagree with me because, as usual, you did not read my comment carefully. I was talking about specific sociopathic traits that lead to one becoming a butcher, not sociopathic traits in general. See how careful I am with my language, and how little respect for care and precision you have?

Ah, got it. So what specific sociopathic traits did Hitler have that you believe Trump does not have? Is it possible that Trump´s narcissism may drive him toward more sociopathic tendencies?

Factfinder

@Openminded

 Is it possible that Trump´s narcissism may drive him toward more sociopathic tendencies?

Maybe, unless before he gets to that point senility overwhelms him like it had biden. 

MayCaesar

@Openminded

If Trump's presidency causes someone to be worried about their children's well-being, then I have no other advice for them than to go on vacation in one of the less fortunate countries. People here often have a very poor understanding of their position in the world... What in the US is considered living in poverty, in 85% countries out there is at least the solid middle class. By virtually all metrics the US today is also a better country to live in than ever before. It seems to me that people do not react to objective changes in the country, but just to the change of the actor on TV (common for those obsessed with "couch politics").
Meanwhile, they are not noticing how a very malicious cross-breed of Marxism and post-modernism is taking over institutions including public education. They are worried that Trump will establish some sort of dictatorship in the US, even as no one gets "cancelled" over promoting very edgy ideas such as "your gender is whatever you say it is", but a lot of people get "cancelled" over expressing ideas that just 10-15 years ago seemed obvious to the very people who now cancel them. A KGB runaway Yury Bezmenov 40 years ago warned people about this coming, and everyone thought him insane and alarmist. Well, here it is, exactly as he described - and where are cries of terror?

Regarding specific sociopathic traits I mentioned: if you look at any brutal dictator of past or present, they all have extremely painful and violent background. Hitler went through the horrors of the First World War and organized an armed rebellion against the regime; Stalin fought in the Civil War, led a group of violent gangsters prior to that, and survived the brutal power struggle for the USSR leadership; Mao led the communist rebellion against the largest army in the world; Che Guevara led multiple guerilla campaigns in various countries, fighting in the jungle for months, and personally executing soldiers who failed him; Tojo has gone through countless battlefields over the course of 30+ years before effectively taking over and committing the most egregious human rights violations in human history... These were extremely tough, gritty people who were ideologically possessed and willing to slaughter millions of humans like pigs to bring about the paradise without which they could not see themselves living. Even relatively soft dictators, like Pinochet, Putin or Mubarak, had very serious background in the military or secret police, where they demonstrated extreme ruthlessness that shocked even the most distinguished veterans. These are extreme outliers on the brutality, grittiness, toughness and misanthropy scale.
What background Trump has that mirrors any of that? The guy probably has never been punched in the face, lived the life of riches and endless attention. He is more like a capricious kid, than a bloody dictator.

Which brings me back to my earlier point: people who grew up in the First World often are incredibly oblivious to historical and even modern realities of the majority of human population. When people seriously compare Trump to Hitler and Mussolini because he created a personality cult and said a few nasty things about people... it is like comparing me to General Tojo because both me and him like sushi. These are completely different people from completely different eras and societies. In his first 4 years, what exactly did Trump do that put your life in danger if you were to criticize him? Go to China and try to criticize the government there, see where you end up, and then reflect on the validity of the comparison.

RickeyHoltsclaw

@jack

I am a supporter of Donald Trump, his policies, his "America First" agenda. I am a Christian conservative, White-heterosexual male, who believes that the Democrat-Progressive-Marxist Party in the United States is demonic at its root and unsustainable in its policy objectives. For all intents and purposes, I believe America is dead morally, ethically, monetarily, militarily; this, due to the immoral, unethical, unsustainable, demonically inspired, polices of the Democrat Party and those who support same; America is dead due to the previous 50-60-years of systematic Progressive brainwashing in the Marxist Institutions of higher learning often referred to as "America's Public Education System;" therefore, if another Civil War was legitimately declared I would proudly fight for the policies espoused by Donald Trump; therefore, I can be considered a MAGA warrior in Donald Trump's "army" of America First Patriots. I believe the Democrat - Progressive - Marxist population in America are horrible people, destructive at their core, arrogant and demonic at their root, unsustainable and contrary concerning America's Constitutional Republic.

Openminded

Argument Topic: You disagree with me because, as usual, you did not read my comment carefully. I was talking about specific sociopathic traits that lead to one becoming a butcher, not sociopathic traits in general. See how careful I am with my language, and how little respect for care and precision you have?

@MayCaesar

Just in case you missed this - you´re usually good at responding to direct questions and I´m interested.

Openminded to MayCaesar: Ah, got it. So what specific sociopathic traits did Hitler have that you believe Trump does not have? Is it possible that Trump´s narcissism may drive him toward more sociopathic tendencies?

Openminded

Argument Topic: who believes that the Democrat-Progressive-Marxist Party in the United States is demonic at its root and unsustainable in its policy objectives.

@RickeyHoltsclaw

Democrat-Progressive-Marxist Party ... demonic ....

Is that a thing?

Openminded

@MayCaesar
You would be hard-pressed to point out anything any particular politician has ever done that has significantly affected your life. Look around: you are (I presume) a young energetic woman, living in one of the safest and most prosperous countries in the world, having one of the best citizenships in the world allowing you to travel almost anywhere visa-free, having access to incredible job market, the highest-performing stock market in the world... Getting new technology every month that people a few decades ago could not have dreamed of. And yet you are getting more pessimistic and less hopeful because of one guy?

I encourage you to try this experiment: stop reading the news for just a month. Just... withdraw. Do a temporary informational diet. You might be surprised by how much happier you will be, and you will never want to get back to obsessing about silly political things.

And yet I am getting more pessimistic at the idea of a Trump presidency. That is EXACTLY the reason. I do not want to lose America.

Factfinder

Openminded said:

@RickeyHoltsclaw

Democrat-Progressive-Marxist Party ... demonic ....

Is that a thing?

You're a card carrying member. You should know.

Openminded

Argument Topic: Feelings are a dangerous source for intuition.

@MayCaesar

Feelings are a dangerous source for intuition. If you want to develop a good intuition, you have to study hard and learn about the world, so similarities between different phenomena form models of meta-phenomena in your mind that you can draw from. Feelings are only useful in telling you that there is a problem. If I feel unsafe while walking on a street, then something is off, either in my perception of reality, or in reality itself. What it is - that is impossible to determine without logic.

Feelings and instincts are exactly what drives intuition.  Yes, logic needs to supplement feelings. 

I do not think that feelings are any more helpful when talking emotion-driven problems than math problems. Can you give an example of where you think the opposite is the case?

If you are a more feeling person, your intuition may detect an emotionally charged problem sooner than a thinker. Example?  No specifics but the relationships I´ve been in. A thinker can be more successful in the speed in which they solve a math problem. The thinker is more logical and will likely dismiss his feelings of anxiety of fear easier that an intuit whose emotions will present more strongly thereby delaying the final result. 

I recognize the danger of many scenarios to humanity, and I strongly suspect that the scenarios many people despising Trump would want to occur are much worse for humanity than his presidency.

I vehemently disagree. I believe history can and will repeat itself if the elements of a perfect storm exist. Trump is following in Hitler´s footsteps. Americans are being more and more radicalized.

Lastly, I really dislike the concept of "balance". There is no such thing as balance between murder and non-murder, for example. One should understand the domain of applicability of feelings, and the domain of applicability of logical thinking. There is no such thing as "too much thinking" or "too much feeling", but there is such thing as "overthinking" and "succumbing to feelings".

Like moderation, balance is the key. Not sure your analogy of balance between murder and non-murder is a reasonable one? And neither is moderation. It´s more of a right and wrong, black or white situation. I agree with your last statement 100%

Openminded

@MayCaesar
I encourage you to try this experiment: stop reading the news for just a month. Just... withdraw. Do a temporary informational diet. You might be surprised by how much happier you will be, and you will never want to get back to obsessing about silly political things.

I understand this position believe me. But I´m a patriot and believe that democracy just cannot sustain itself without citizen involvement. Before Trump, I trusted that democracy would always right itself. Not now.

Openminded

Argument Topic: What background Trump has that mirrors any of that? The guy probably has never been punched in the face, lived the life of riches and endless attention. He is more like a capricious kid, than a bloody dictator.

@MayCaesar

What background Trump has that mirrors any of that? The guy probably has never been punched in the face, lived the life of riches and endless attention. He is more like a capricious kid, than a bloody dictator.

https://www.commondreams.org/views/2019/08/09/leading-civil-rights-lawyer-shows-20-ways-trump-copying-hitlers-early-rhetoric-and

That´s an optimistic take on him. His childhood was less than ideal, like many, but he was raised by an authoritarian father who demanded excellence, loyalty and winning. I´m betting he was in a fight or two. Yes, he had $, but using your argument, not necessarily riches. He craves adoration. He is a narcissist. What threatens a narcissist more than humiliation? Losing. Humiliation to a narcissist is like holy water to the devil. 

Heŕes an interesting take on Hitler and Trumpś similarities. Note that the source is left leaning, (woke alert woke alert ¨Common Dreams¨) but accurate. I´m confident I could site sources for each of these similarities if needed. Note it is over five years old where accuracy may be in question, but Trump did not disappoint - there are more to add to the list and more to come in the coming weeks.

Factfinder

Openminded said:

@MayCaesar
I encourage you to try this experiment: stop reading the news for just a month. Just... withdraw. Do a temporary informational diet. You might be surprised by how much happier you will be, and you will never want to get back to obsessing about silly political things.

I understand this position believe me. But I´m a patriot and believe that democracy just cannot sustain itself without citizen involvement. Before Trump, I trusted that democracy would always right itself. Not now.

Trump derangement syndrome.

RickeyHoltsclaw

@Factfinder Definitely. A political party that fights and clamors and rallies and protests for the perceived "right" to murder babies in the womb; to normalize the perversity of LGBTQ and force same upon America's children and destroy the family unit; fights for open borders where untold millions cross into America from any number of radical, hostile, Nations, fighting age young men - unaccompanied; targets their political opponents by weaponizing the Judiciary/the Department of Justice; infiltrates social media to silence and deny free speech rights to their opponents; forces the insanity of "man-induced climate change" upon the masses...these are demonically rooted and they're represented by the Democrat-Progressive-Marxist Party of the United States...a hoard of horrible people. 

Openminded

@RickeyHoltsclaw

hahahaha. Democrat-Progressive-Marxist Party. Cool label. 

RickeyHoltsclaw

@Openminded ; Jesus said, "You will know them by their fruit" (Matthew 7:15-20).

Openminded

Argument Topic: Meanwhile, they are not noticing how a very malicious cross-breed of Marxism and post-modernism is taking over institutions including public education.

@MayCaesar

Meanwhile, they are not noticing how a very malicious cross-breed of Marxism and post-modernism is taking over institutions including public education. They are worried that Trump will establish some sort of dictatorship in the US, even as no one gets "cancelled" over promoting very edgy ideas such as "your gender is whatever you say it is", but a lot of people get "cancelled" over expressing ideas that just 10-15 years ago seemed obvious to the very people who now cancel them. A KGB runaway Yury Bezmenov 40 years ago warned people about this coming, and everyone thought him insane and alarmist. Well, here it is, exactly as he described - and where are cries of terror?

Really? I do believe this is a dog whistle on your part May.  This theory you assert is a falsehood used by far-right extremists and conspiracy theorists to explain away and whitewash the ills of our modern world. It ties up the package neatly for many confused Americans doesn´t it? It´s similiar to what Hitler espoused while setting up his full reign in power - the enemy is Marxism.  Nationalism, as a result was pushed as a means to control society and save the whites from extinction. This is 45´s technique to gain control -- the leftists are VERMIN because they support the marginalized, and the immigrants are POISONING THE BLOOD OF OUR COUNTRY. Explaining away what ails America is easy when you successfully manipulate your supporters first. By conning them into trusting only him, pushing anger and fear mongering is easy as he´s already captured their adoration. The disloyal non supporters become the scapegoats as Marxists - and they are the enemy.  Proponents of LGBTQ, gay marriage and public education are labeled ¨marxists¨ in the hopes that it will scare people into voting conservative. Groups like Moms For Liberty, No Left Turn in Education and Mass Resistance have been manipulated into believing that Marxism is ruining our education system. Who is actually doing the majority of book banning and taking away our freedoms? And school choice vs public education is another dog whistle being used to bamboozle Americans. Fortunately the majority of Americans understand the motivations of Trump and his similarities to Hitler. One day his manipulated cult followers will need to reconcile that Trump is a cult leader and they are his cult followers.

MayCaesar

Openminded said:

@MayCaesar

Just in case you missed this - you´re usually good at responding to direct questions and I´m interested.

Openminded to MayCaesar: Ah, got it. So what specific sociopathic traits did Hitler have that you believe Trump does not have? Is it possible that Trump´s narcissism may drive him toward more sociopathic tendencies?

I addressed this in the second paragraph of my previous comment.

Openminded said:

@MayCaesar
You would be hard-pressed to point out anything any particular politician has ever done that has significantly affected your life. Look around: you are (I presume) a young energetic woman, living in one of the safest and most prosperous countries in the world, having one of the best citizenships in the world allowing you to travel almost anywhere visa-free, having access to incredible job market, the highest-performing stock market in the world... Getting new technology every month that people a few decades ago could not have dreamed of. And yet you are getting more pessimistic and less hopeful because of one guy?

I encourage you to try this experiment: stop reading the news for just a month. Just... withdraw. Do a temporary informational diet. You might be surprised by how much happier you will be, and you will never want to get back to obsessing about silly political things.

And yet I am getting more pessimistic at the idea of a Trump presidency. That is EXACTLY the reason. I do not want to lose America.

I think that losing a country is far-far worse than losing oneself. I have witnessed many instances of the latter, of people getting incredibly invested in something petty like politics and turning into misanthropic pessimistic people who are not fund to be around and who it is not fun to be. I have also seen many people who have been through hell and emerged happier and more content than ever. How you feel is not a product of what happens around you, but a product of how you choose to process it.

Openminded said:

@MayCaesar

Feelings are a dangerous source for intuition. If you want to develop a good intuition, you have to study hard and learn about the world, so similarities between different phenomena form models of meta-phenomena in your mind that you can draw from. Feelings are only useful in telling you that there is a problem. If I feel unsafe while walking on a street, then something is off, either in my perception of reality, or in reality itself. What it is - that is impossible to determine without logic.

Feelings and instincts are exactly what drives intuition.  Yes, logic needs to supplement feelings. 

I do not think that feelings are any more helpful when talking emotion-driven problems than math problems. Can you give an example of where you think the opposite is the case?

If you are a more feeling person, your intuition may detect an emotionally charged problem sooner than a thinker. Example?  No specifics but the relationships I´ve been in. A thinker can be more successful in the speed in which they solve a math problem. The thinker is more logical and will likely dismiss his feelings of anxiety of fear easier that an intuit whose emotions will present more strongly thereby delaying the final result. 

I recognize the danger of many scenarios to humanity, and I strongly suspect that the scenarios many people despising Trump would want to occur are much worse for humanity than his presidency.

I vehemently disagree. I believe history can and will repeat itself if the elements of a perfect storm exist. Trump is following in Hitler´s footsteps. Americans are being more and more radicalized.

Lastly, I really dislike the concept of "balance". There is no such thing as balance between murder and non-murder, for example. One should understand the domain of applicability of feelings, and the domain of applicability of logical thinking. There is no such thing as "too much thinking" or "too much feeling", but there is such thing as "overthinking" and "succumbing to feelings".

Like moderation, balance is the key. Not sure your analogy of balance between murder and non-murder is a reasonable one? And neither is moderation. It´s more of a right and wrong, black or white situation. I agree with your last statement 100%

I am not sure what relationships you have had, but I have never been in a single situation in my life where going by my feelings was a way to resolve a conflict or a problem. Whenever things got a little heated, the best course of action has always been to say, "Hey, this conversation is a little rough, isn't it? I really value your input and do not trust myself to react to it properly right now. Let's go and grab a couple of drinks and come back to it tomorrow, shall we?" Letting negative feelings run me always resulted in me saying something or doing something that I would later regret, a couple of times costing me dear friends or leading to days/weeks/months of awkwardness with them.

Americans becoming more radicalized seems to me to be another illusion resulting from putting too much stock into petty politics. I meet with new people in the US all the time, and interactions with them are almost always fantastic regardless of what political leaning they have. Countless other people have similar experience. It is very different from what it was like in Germany in the 30-s where people would refuse to talk to their best friends because they found out they were of the wrong ethnicity.

Openminded said:

@MayCaesar
I encourage you to try this experiment: stop reading the news for just a month. Just... withdraw. Do a temporary informational diet. You might be surprised by how much happier you will be, and you will never want to get back to obsessing about silly political things.

I understand this position believe me. But I´m a patriot and believe that democracy just cannot sustain itself without citizen involvement. Before Trump, I trusted that democracy would always right itself. Not now.

Reading news and arguing about them has little to do with sustaining democracy; if anything, it has the opposite effect. Every time you lash at one of your fellow countrymen over a political disagreement, you reduce the number of people who trust that you have their best interest in mind by one.

Openminded said:

@MayCaesar

What background Trump has that mirrors any of that? The guy probably has never been punched in the face, lived the life of riches and endless attention. He is more like a capricious kid, than a bloody dictator.

https://www.commondreams.org/views/2019/08/09/leading-civil-rights-lawyer-shows-20-ways-trump-copying-hitlers-early-rhetoric-and

That´s an optimistic take on him. His childhood was less than ideal, like many, but he was raised by an authoritarian father who demanded excellence, loyalty and winning. I´m betting he was in a fight or two. Yes, he had $, but using your argument, not necessarily riches. He craves adoration. He is a narcissist. What threatens a narcissist more than humiliation? Losing. Humiliation to a narcissist is like holy water to the devil. 

Heŕes an interesting take on Hitler and Trumpś similarities. Note that the source is left leaning, (woke alert woke alert ¨Common Dreams¨) but accurate. I´m confident I could site sources for each of these similarities if needed. Note it is over five years old where accuracy may be in question, but Trump did not disappoint - there are more to add to the list and more to come in the coming weeks.

Trump may be a petty guy and he may have some superficial similarities with many dictators, but he is not made of the same matter. Chechen dictator Ramzan Kadyrov likes to say that he killed his first human when he was 15; this is the kind of experience I am talking about. And even Kadyrov is a softie compared to true monsters like Hitler, Stalin or Mao.

I am sorry, but I see absolutely no evidence that Trump has the guts to kill anyone, let alone drown the whole country in the ocean of blood.

Openminded said:

@MayCaesar

Meanwhile, they are not noticing how a very malicious cross-breed of Marxism and post-modernism is taking over institutions including public education. They are worried that Trump will establish some sort of dictatorship in the US, even as no one gets "cancelled" over promoting very edgy ideas such as "your gender is whatever you say it is", but a lot of people get "cancelled" over expressing ideas that just 10-15 years ago seemed obvious to the very people who now cancel them. A KGB runaway Yury Bezmenov 40 years ago warned people about this coming, and everyone thought him insane and alarmist. Well, here it is, exactly as he described - and where are cries of terror?

Really? I do believe this is a dog whistle on your part May.  This theory you assert is a falsehood used by far-right extremists and conspiracy theorists to explain away and whitewash the ills of our modern world. It ties up the package neatly for many confused Americans doesn´t it? It´s similiar to what Hitler espoused while setting up his full reign in power - the enemy is Marxism.  Nationalism, as a result was pushed as a means to control society and save the whites from extinction. This is 45´s technique to gain control -- the leftists are VERMIN because they support the marginalized, and the immigrants are POISONING THE BLOOD OF OUR COUNTRY. Explaining away what ails America is easy when you successfully manipulate your supporters first. By conning them into trusting only him, pushing anger and fear mongering is easy as he´s already captured their adoration. The disloyal non supporters become the scapegoats as Marxists - and they are the enemy.  Proponents of LGBTQ, gay marriage and public education are labeled ¨marxists¨ in the hopes that it will scare people into voting conservative. Groups like Moms For Liberty, No Left Turn in Education and Mass Resistance have been manipulated into believing that Marxism is ruining our education system. Who is actually doing the majority of book banning and taking away our freedoms? And school choice vs public education is another dog whistle being used to bamboozle Americans. Fortunately the majority of Americans understand the motivations of Trump and his similarities to Hitler. One day his manipulated cult followers will need to reconcile that Trump is a cult leader and they are his cult followers.

I was actually born in a Marxist country and am quite familiar with the work of the guy, and my opinion has nothing to do with what some groups in the US say. The foundational idea of Marxism is class struggle, with the alleged outcome being obliteration of the class structure as such. The foundational idea of post-modernism is social constructivism, where what is truth is highly subjective and depends on the individual framing of their observations. The ideology that is a union of these two is spreading everywhere, including the university I am working at. We all get emails from the president every day talking about social-constructivist nonsense. That is a true cult, and you are pointing at Trump as the main source of danger?

Ask yourself who is more likely to be "cancelled" on a college campus, or in a city hall, or on TV: someone who says that gender is a social construct, or someone who says that gender is a biological factor? Note that science is very clear on this, so the default position is obvious.
I have never heard of anyone getting "cancelled" over expressing their dislike of Trump, but countless people have been "cancelled" over endorsing him.

You may be right that the current political situation in the US has some aspects of the situation in Germany in the mid-30-s, only you seem to be getting the roles backwards.

Factfinder

Openminded said:

@MayCaesar

Meanwhile, they are not noticing how a very malicious cross-breed of Marxism and post-modernism is taking over institutions including public education. They are worried that Trump will establish some sort of dictatorship in the US, even as no one gets "cancelled" over promoting very edgy ideas such as "your gender is whatever you say it is", but a lot of people get "cancelled" over expressing ideas that just 10-15 years ago seemed obvious to the very people who now cancel them. A KGB runaway Yury Bezmenov 40 years ago warned people about this coming, and everyone thought him insane and alarmist. Well, here it is, exactly as he described - and where are cries of terror?

Really? I do believe this is a dog whistle on your part May.  This theory you assert is a falsehood used by far-right extremists and conspiracy theorists to explain away and whitewash the ills of our modern world. It ties up the package neatly for many confused Americans doesn´t it? It´s similiar to what Hitler espoused while setting up his full reign in power - the enemy is Marxism.  Nationalism, as a result was pushed as a means to control society and save the whites from extinction. This is 45´s technique to gain control -- the leftists are VERMIN because they support the marginalized, and the immigrants are POISONING THE BLOOD OF OUR COUNTRY. Explaining away what ails America is easy when you successfully manipulate your supporters first. By conning them into trusting only him, pushing anger and fear mongering is easy as he´s already captured their adoration. The disloyal non supporters become the scapegoats as Marxists - and they are the enemy.  Proponents of LGBTQ, gay marriage and public education are labeled ¨marxists¨ in the hopes that it will scare people into voting conservative. Groups like Moms For Liberty, No Left Turn in Education and Mass Resistance have been manipulated into believing that Marxism is ruining our education system. Who is actually doing the majority of book banning and taking away our freedoms? And school choice vs public education is another dog whistle being used to bamboozle Americans. Fortunately the majority of Americans understand the motivations of Trump and his similarities to Hitler. One day his manipulated cult followers will need to reconcile that Trump is a cult leader and they are his cult followers.

What do we have here? @MayCaesar who actually lived through two dictatorships, and we have supposedly @Openminded. It's not a 'theory' when you lived through two dictatorships, closeminded.

I served guard duty assignments on the east/west border in germany. I saw and was briefed on how citizens on the east side (socialist) had to call their guard tower if they needed to go to the store for bread! Yeah, we were that close. We saw them, they saw us. Now keep in mind the western side,(capitalistic) people were going about their daily business, no need to inform us. So you see open, observed reality, plus what's well known undenied fact about marxism and it's methods AND the fact you constantly use horrible debate decorum, sorry open, May wins hands down! I mean really, comparing someone you ill rationally hate to hitler??? Talk about fallacy and being the bane of debating decorum.

Bogan

@Openminded ;    At what age did your emotional growth stop at?

Why is it that your dog does not like you?   

Openminded

Argument Topic: They are worried that Trump will establish some sort of dictatorship in the US,

@MayCaesar

They are worried that Trump will establish some sort of dictatorship in the US, even as no one gets "cancelled" over promoting very edgy ideas such as "your gender is whatever you say it is", but a lot of people get "cancelled" over expressing ideas that just 10-15 years ago seemed obvious to the very people who now cancel them. A KGB runaway Yury Bezmenov 40 years ago warned people about this coming, and everyone thought him insane and alarmist. Well, here it is, exactly as he described - and where are cries of terror?

The Russian psychological warfare used on enemy countries that Bezmenov talks about (demoralization, destabilization, crisis and normalization) can certainly be applied to the Russian interference in the 2016 election and subsequent elections. The demoralization of America, to me, is evident not only in loss of hope and confidence in America but in the crumbling foundation of America as a whole. Not so surprising is the tribal psychology Americans have adopted. Both sides recklessly assign labels like Marxists, Fascists, Commies, Socialists. The right call the left Socialists seemingly because Nazis were the National Socialist Party and Mussolini was a radical socialist. Extreme right wing politicians like MTG contribute to the name calling narrative using fascists and Nazis to further the division. The left call the extreme right fascists due to what they perceive as Trump´s apparent subservience to leaders like Putin, Jung Un and Hitler, his first wifeś claim to her lawyer that he kept a book of Hitler´s speeches, ¨My New Order¨ (not Mein Kampf) in a locked drawer, his recent speeches where he coincidentally? repeats language Hitler used like ¨vermin¨ to describe the radical left and ¨They´re poisoning the blood of our country¨ to describe immigrants.

https://www.cnn.com/videos/politics/2023/12/18/donald-trump-campaign-rhetoric-cnc-vpx.cnn

https://www.reuters.com/world/us/trump-i-have-not-read-hitlers-mein-kampf-2023-12-20/

Which brings me back to my earlier point: people who grew up in the First World often are incredibly oblivious to historical and even modern realities of the majority of human population. When people seriously compare Trump to Hitler and Mussolini because he created a personality cult and said a few nasty things about people... it is like comparing me to General Tojo because both me and him like sushi. These are completely different people from completely different eras and societies. In his first 4 years, what exactly did Trump do that put your life in danger if you were to criticize him? Go to China and try to criticize the government there, see where you end up, and then reflect on the validity of the comparison

One of my go-to phrases when I hear Americans complain about superficial things is ¨first world problem¨. I get it. Living under two dictatorships, we must sound quite entitled to you.

Sure wish I shared your (optimism)??? about the seriousness of Trump´s possible second term. He said more than a few nasty things as we all know, and they are too numerous to mention. I would be more than happy to list them on a spreadsheet for you if you like and if I knew you would need to read them as I´m sure you know the ¨nasty¨ things he´s said,  I do not want to waste time. But time permitting, I will even list some similarities between Trump/Hitler and Trump/Mussolini. I assure you, the comparison is not at all like the comparison you mention but you know that don´t you May?

How did Trump put my life in danger if I were to criticize him? That is a curious way of what I think you are trying to say. Possibly your Russian roots have desensitized you? Could you be implying that I still have freedom of speech and should be happy with that and not concerned? Silly you. Let´s just say we ain´t seen nothing yet. If he´s reelected, I´ll get back to you along with millions of Americans who are trying desperately to hang onto the freedom and democracy we´ve enjoyed over the decades of the great American experiment.

MayCaesar

@Openminded

I do not see people calling others "vermin" on college campuses or mainstream media. I do not see anything that Trump and his supporters did overtake multiple institutions and start silencing the opposition there. There is no place in the US, as far as I know, where you can put a hat "Biden 2024" on and get attacked by anyone or thrown out by anyone; compare that to what happens if you put a hat "Trump 2024" on and walk into any... respectable establishment. Try putting on a "Make America Great Again" and walk around the Harvard or Stanford campus. The claim that he will do something comparable if he wins another election has zero evidence to support it.

Do you sound entitled to me? No. Ignorant, yes, but not entitled. I do not think that the fact that things are much worse for someone means that you should be happy with everything. The fact that there are true hellholes out there like Chad or DRK does not imply that you cannot experience negative feelings. The fact that someone's mother died today should not make your heartbreak in a relationship painless.
When you compare two entities, you have to specify essential criteria of comparison. In what sense is person A similar to person B? In that they are both humans? In that they both like cheesecakes? In that they both have enslaved hundreds millions of people? You keep saying that Trump and Hitler have a lot of similarities, but you cannot pinpoint any similarity that suggests that Trump is going to do to the US population something comparable to what Hitler did to the German population. Pointing out the nasty words he said - that is not even in the same world as slaughtering millions of people and setting three continents on fire.

The fact remains: you still have not pointed out anything that Trump has done so far that would in any way threaten your political safety. Threat to individual political safety is what distinguishes an authoritarian regime from a liberal regime. Please name one single thing that you cannot safely say about Trump, but can about Biden. Has nothing to do with any "desensitization": I am asking a very standard question for discussions of authoritarianism.

Openminded

Argument Topic: I am a supporter of Donald Trump, his policies, his "America First" agenda.

@RickeyHoltsclaw

Your post is simply bizarre and not grounded in reality.

RickeyHoltsclaw

@Openminded ; Perhaps you don't understand "reality?"

Openminded

Argument Topic: I am sorry, but I see absolutely no evidence that Trump has the guts to kill anyone, let alone drown the whole country in the ocean of blood.

@MayCaesar
I am sorry, but I see absolutely no evidence that Trump has the guts to kill anyone, let alone drown the whole country in the ocean of blood.

You think one cannot be evil and dangerous unless they actually perform a violent or murderous act? Come on May. What do you take me for? Did Putin kill anyone with his own hands? No. Does that mean he is not dangerous and evil? As dangerous and evil as both Trump and Putin are (and no. Trump has not reached Putin´s level of evil or danger - YET), they are also cowards. 

MayCaesar

Openminded said:

@MayCaesar
I am sorry, but I see absolutely no evidence that Trump has the guts to kill anyone, let alone drown the whole country in the ocean of blood.

You think one cannot be evil and dangerous unless they actually perform a violent or murderous act? Come on May. What do you take me for? Did Putin kill anyone with his own hands? No. Does that mean he is not dangerous and evil? As dangerous and evil as both Trump and Putin are (and no. Trump has not reached Putin´s level of evil or danger - YET), they are also cowards. 

From the context it should be clear that I was not talking about killing someone with one's own hands. Vladimir Putin went through a KGB Academy, a place where for years they study terrible interrogation techniques, manipulation of human psychology, deception and trickery, and where they are taught that human life is expendable. They venerate people like Lavrentiy Beria, a guy who had little girls kidnapped, then raped them and (likely) personally murdered them. After just 1 year of being president he obliterated the biggest independent TV company and brought all mainstream media to their knees, had multiple journalists killed even before becoming president, and even in his early 20-s he was working with Stasi seeking and exposing traitors in the organization.

You want to compare Trump to that? What in his background resembles any of that? "Oh, he paid some of his workers below the market rate of their labor"? How terrible indeed...

On the other hand, I will tell you of something that is similar between Russia and the US. It is existence of pretty sensible opinions that are not supposed to be tolerated. In Russia, if you say that the Soviet Union's role in World War 2 was negative, you can be yelled at, or if you are in a remote rural area - even beaten up. But Russians have not gotten as far in this respect as Americans, where people have actually lost their jobs over saying things like "Gender is a biological reality". In Russia you can only have something like this happen to you if you criticize the regime, but in the US even expressing basic scientific facts can get you in trouble.
I have yet to hear a peep from you on this real, observable issue, however.

Factfinder

Openminded said:

@RickeyHoltsclaw

hahahaha. Democrat-Progressive-Marxist Party. Cool label. 

Is this you finally admitting to your true identity @Openminded? 

Openminded

Argument Topic: I was actually born in a Marxist country and am quite familiar with the work of the guy,

@MayCaesar

I was actually born in a Marxist country and am quite familiar with the work of the guy, and my opinion has nothing to do with what some groups in the US say. The foundational idea of Marxism is class struggle, with the alleged outcome being obliteration of the class structure as such. The foundational idea of post-modernism is social constructivism, where what is truth is highly subjective and depends on the individual framing of their observations. The ideology that is a union of these two is spreading everywhere, including the university I am working at. We all get emails from the president every day talking about social-constructivist nonsense. That is a true cult, and you are pointing at Trump as the main source of danger?

Perhaps like the German American Bund, there are similar pods of those radicalized who subscribe to trumpism (nationalism and neo-fascism) working hard to combat marxism and post-modernism.  Are these radicalized groups infiltrating our country in a quest to reject our American democracy and promote a favorable view of trumpism?  Many believe authoritarianism is easier to submit to and fall in line with - pack mentality for the weak in character. Like Hitler, who scapegoated the Jews and Marxists, Trump is scapegoating the immigrants as poisoning the blood of America and the left and democrats are being targeted as Vermin, the Marxists, the Fascists, the Commies, the Socialists - the enemy. Admittedly, I knew little of social-constructivism until you mentioned it and I did a brief read. It sounds like it is the idea of the overall importance of collective opinions, views and the encouragement of collectivism. The priority being to give a collective group more importance over an individual. This to me sounds like humanity. E Pluribus Unum - out of many--one (a long recognized national motto). Humanity - the collective attributes, behaviors and characteristics that define humans as a species. Honing our capacity for empathy, compassion, social organization and expression which encompasses the achievements and challenges of all humankind. This ongoing great American experiment is defined by society´s progress as well as setbacks and shared experiences that connect us all. And while it´s messy and complex due to the increasing population and complexities of human nature, I believe that the majority of the younger generation believes still in humanity - the freedom of collectivism - rather than authoritarianism. With the millennials outnumbering the baby boomers, the last 10 years have seen a significant rise in Generation Z. These two groups are said to be the most racially and ethnically diverse generation in American history. And therein lies our conundrum. Should we submit to (pack mentality) the safety and ease of nationalism? That which subscribes to a cultural ideology that promotes the interests, unity and identity of one country that promotes pride and loyalty to one nation with a strong belief in superiority over all nations. Or should we choose the messiness but humanness of internationalism? An ideology that emphasizes cooperation, collective collaboration and interaction among all nations to work toward the common good and advancement of collective shared interests. Collaborating with all nations to promote global solidarity (UN, EU, NATO). To me, internationalism is what America has been striving for since its founding. A collection of immigrants, ethnicities and cultures that contribute to the advancement of America. Success of internationalism is the hardest to achieve by far but to me, the great American experiment is the greatest show on earth. I say let´s let the younger generation continue their American journey to peace, unity, acceptance and justice for all. E pluribus unum. You think Internationalism is a cult? NO. Trumpism is the cult. The populist who has no ideology other than to control and pilfer $ off Americans. For the stodgy, right wing conservatives, the extreme evangelicals, the entitled baby boomers - suck it up. We´ve enjoyed our years in relative peace. It´s time to to lend our descendents a chance.

Ask yourself who is more likely to be "cancelled" on a college campus, or in a city hall, or on TV: someone who says that gender is a social construct, or someone who says that gender is a biological factor? Note that science is very clear on this, so the default position is obvious.

I have never heard of anyone getting "cancelled" over expressing their dislike of Trump, but countless people have been "cancelled" over endorsing him.

Who´s more likely to be canceled? Those saying gender is a social construct or those saying gender is a biological factor? Well due to the aging out and dying of baby boomers, and an ever evolving and pseudo awareness of the millennials and GenZers, let´s examine further. Now this may not feel comfortable to many Americans, but America is now theirs to inherit and continue to build and improve on. So yes, obviously those that believe gender is solely biological. Now city hall? It likely depends on the personnel - are they more liberal-minded or are they more conservative?  Same with TV.  That hardly supports the theory that the left are doing all the canceling with the majority of meaningful cancellations from the right: politically the republicans canceled Liz Cheney for speaking out against Trump. Socially, your buddy DeSantis reinstated the ¨Don´t Say Gay¨, Anti-woke bills and said he would initiate the cancellation of four federal agencies: DOE, Commerce, Energy and the IRS. Moms for Liberty - an ultra religious, conservative group is pushing book banning (with CRT being the impetus [most prominently taught in higher education] and advocate for public school funding to pay for private school selection. Mike Johnson, R, speaker of the house, wants to cancel the Constitutional separation of church and state and invoke religion back into education. Medically, abortion rights and health care for womenhave effectively been canceled by conservatives SCJs. I´m sure there´s more. And the ultimate cancel? The termination of all rules, regulations, and articles, even those found in the Constitution. Can you guess who said that? The left´s cancellations? They are frivolous, silly and hardly important to society´s well being unless you believe canceling Aunt Jemima, the takedown of the Lee statue and renaming sports teams was detrimental to America (though importantly symbolic and emancipating for many). 

https://www.msn.com/en-us/news/politics/fact-check-did-donald-trump-call-to-suspend-the-constitution/ar-AA1fIliY

You may be right that the current political situation in the US has some aspects of the situation in Germany in the mid-30-s, only you seem to be getting the roles backwards.

Yes the current political situation has many similarities to Germany in the mid-30s. I believe there are many radicalized Trump supporters who believe the left are the enemy and they subscribe to authoritarianism. Could this be the Russian American Bund? The roles are reversed?  Nah. Authoritarianism is on the rise worldwide largely because we have been culturally divided by the unleashing of a chaotic, narcissistic populist with no ideology other than to submit to strong men and rule like Putin, Jong-Un, Jinping. 

Now is there class struggle as you say? You bet there is. Has the left and liberal ideologies gone too extreme? Yes. Has the right gone too extreme? Oh yeah. But this is what democracy is all about. This is what free and fair elections are all about -- for the citizens to choose. We´ve worked it out for hundreds of years. We can continue working toward unity. But not with Trump as leader. Captain Chaos, if reelected, will do nothing but cause turmoil for Americans. His administration will spend four years doing damage control and cleaning up after him as his previous administration did. Only this time, he may just change the constitution as Putin did. Putinś reign will last until 2036 as a result of a massive campaign by ¨authorities¨ that pressured and manipulated voters. Ain´t authoritarianism sweet and neat?

MayCaesar

@Openminded

I am not sure what your first paragraph has to do with what I said. I have not said anything about internationalism: in the Marxist sense internationalism just means that communism must spread throughout the whole planet and cannot just be confined to one country - it is similar to Islamic teachings the end goal of which is universal acceptance of Islam across all of humanity. It is a disgusting ideology. So is nationalism.
Cosmopolitanism, on the other hand, is great! According to it, individuals should not be confined to their local communities, but should go out there in the world and interact with those from other communities, building bridges and learning from each other. Neither the "right" nor the "left" in the US embraces that. The "right" is pushing for the soft version of the Monroe isolationist doctrine, and the "left" is pushing for some kind of ugly cultural relativism where women in Saudi Arabia are not worse off than they are in the US - "they just have a different culture".
"Freedom of collectivism" is quite a sentence. Reminds me of Rousseau's "he will be forced to be free". Collectivism equates destruction of individual sovereignty and subjugation to the tribe. I say, let the tribe die if it does not let the individual live his own life on his own terms. A quote of one philosopher is fitting here: "Would I die for France? No. Let France die for me".

You said nothing to counter my claim on cancellation of people over things I mentioned. You just pointed out one instance of Liz Cheney being "cancelled", although I am not sure exactly what you are referring to. "Cancellation" involves disinvitation of someone from places they were previously invited to, and denying them platform all over the place over an opinion or a few they expressed. Which of what you listed qualify? Instating some laws and promising to abolish some agencies has nothing to do with this phenomenon.
Say you were invited to make a speech at a Catholic ("right-wing", you would say) university like Notre Dame, and a few days prior to the speech you had two options: to endorse Donald Trump, and to endorse Joe Biden. If your only goal was to not be disinvited, which option do you think you would be wiser to pick? If this question gives you a pause, then you have very little awareness of the state of affairs at educational organizations in the US.

Lady, if you think that Trump is responsible for the rise of authoritarianism in the world, then you have not been paying attention to anything happening outside the US. Putin, John-Un and Jinping built their totalitarian machines long before Trump even got into politics. You are so out of touch with reality, so focused on one particular American individual... That is what I mean when I say that you do not sound entitled to me, just ignorant. You view the whole world through the prism provided by a bunch of your favorite American media organizations. Let me enlighten you: the world outside of the US does not care at large what Americans think about it. Jinping did not listen to CNN or Fox News to figure out how he should pull out his lifetime president stunt.
It is cute that you assume that Trump "submits" to these leaders, by the way. One of the first things Trump did when becoming president was calling the president of Taiwan, a move that seriously upset the CCP leadership - and what did your friends tell him back then? "How dare you be so undiplomatic!" Your Democratic friends flip their stances on China, Russia and North Korea as well as Trump flips his, based on what is convenient at the moment. Remember Clinton's "Russian reset"? How did that go?

I still have not seen any evidence of Trump doing anything in order to extend his presidential term. You just keep claiming that he will change the Constitution or do something else, with zero evidence to support your claims. What we have is Trump's previous 4 years as president during which he did nothing of the sort. But he will suddenly do now, and that is somehow obvious?
Again, Putin went hardcore on securing his position even before he became president. It was not just some petty changes in the Constitution: it was murders of journalists and politicians, slaughter in Chechnya, and even likely terrorist attacks (the explosions in buildings that took lives of hundreds of people had KGB officers close to Putin implicated in them). By the time he officially took over on December 31st of 1999, the reign of terror had already been going on for a couple of years.

Sorry, but you just have very little clue about the people you are talking about. You only know bits and pieces that went through your favorite media. You have not actually studied lives of those people seriously.

Openminded

@MayCaesar

peep to come.

Openminded

Argument Topic: I am not sure what your first paragraph has to do with what I said.

@MayCaesar

Look, not sure if continuing this debate is beneficial. The question asked was does trump have an army - perhaps a secret one. For the record, my answer is I believe he does and the army, metaphorical or otherwise is working hard to destroy America´s democracy and freedom.

Factfinder

Openminded said:

@MayCaesar

Look, not sure if continuing this debate is beneficial. The question asked was does trump have an army - perhaps a secret one. For the record, my answer is I believe he does and the army, metaphorical or otherwise is working hard to destroy America´s democracy and freedom.

Of course you have no evidence. Not like inconvenient facts such as biden and coconspirators lied to get the presidency. I agree with you though. The closeminded left isn't interested in debate, only indoctrination. 

MayCaesar

Openminded said:

@MayCaesar

Look, not sure if continuing this debate is beneficial. The question asked was does trump have an army - perhaps a secret one. For the record, my answer is I believe he does and the army, metaphorical or otherwise is working hard to destroy America´s democracy and freedom.

I do not know, I enjoyed it. Unlike many posters around here, you actually explain your reasoning in detail, even if I disagree with it more often than not. I would like to see more debaters like this around here. I suppose I should also apologize for certain mean comments that I made: I get a little aggravated when debating online sometimes - something to work on, for sure.

I still do not understand, however, what "secret army" is being talked about. Sounds like it is metaphorical enough to be fairly meaningless.
Trump certainly has a lot of loyal followers, and the degree to which they are willing to defend him even when he contradicts himself within a couple of sentences is quite spectacular. But I am not aware of any who are "working hard to destroy America's democracy and freedom". Trump promotes the "America first" idea, so his followers naturally want to see the country's democracy and freedom thrive, even if the person and the policies they endorse in practice do not serve that purpose.

I have a problem with Trump's personality cult, the nationalism he promotes, and his habit to make stuff up all the time. He also has some kind of speech impairment that makes him sound like a kid sometimes: his vocabulary is very basic. But many people, it would seem, have a problem with everything he ever does. He supports Taiwan - "how undiplomatic". He supports China - "he bends under dictators". He is neutral to both - "he has no moral principles". When everything someone does is automatically interpreted negatively, you know that the judge is biased.

Reminds me of Yaron Brook's point on how people criticize corporations for everything.
- Corporation sells product above the market price: "Clearly a monopoly!"
- Corporation sells product below the market price: "Clearly a monopoly!"
- Corporation sells product at the market price: "Clearly collusion with other companies!"

RickeyHoltsclaw

@Openminded ;  How is Trump and his supporters undermining "democracy" and what is a "democracy" and is the United States actually a "democracy" or a Representative-Constitutional Republic?

jack

RickeyHoltsclaw said:

and what is a "democracy" and is the United States actually a "democracy" or a Representative-Constitutional Republic?

Hello again, Rickey:

So, you can't participate in a debate about the American democracy because America is NOT a democracy???

Is that you view, really??  It's weak.  It clearly it means you agree with the poster, and it's easier to deflect than answer.  Du*de!

Bwa, ha ha ha ha ha.

excon

RickeyHoltsclaw

@jack ; A "democracy" boils down to "mob rules." America's founding and its Constitution is the antithesis of a "democracy" in the truest sense. America is a Representative-Constitutional Republic where the "rule of law" based upon Biblical principals is the governing norm not the mob or the will of a majority.

“A democracy is nothing more than mob rule, where fifty-one percent of the people may take away the rights of the other forty-nine.”
― Thomas Jefferson 

RickeyHoltsclaw

@jack “Actually, in its essence, democracy is a totalitarian ideology, though not as extreme as Nazism, fascism or communism. In principle, no freedom is safe in a democracy, every aspect of the individual's life is potentially subject to government control. At the end of the day, the minority is completely at the mercy of the whims of the majority. Even if a democracy has a constitution limiting the powers of the government, this constitution too can be amended by the majority. The only fundamental right you have in a democracy, besides running for office, is the right to vote for a political party. With that solitary vote you hand over your independence and your freedom to the will of the majority.”
― Frank Karsten, Beyond Democracy: Why democracy does not lead to solidarity, prosperity and liberty but to social conflict, runaway spending and a tyrannical government

jack

RickeyHoltsclaw said:

@jack ; A "democracy" boils down to "mob rules."

Hello again, Rickey:

I got it..  You don't like it here.  You like dictatorships better.  Maybe North Korea is more to your liking..  DU*DE!   Don't let the door hit you in the arse. 

excon

RickeyHoltsclaw

@jack ; If you could set aside your arrogance and closed-minded bigotry for a moment you would find I support the original intent of the United States Constitution; that is, a very limited form of government by the people, for the people, fragmented into coequal branches, controlled by the rule of law based on Biblical principals and a government constrained by the States, the sole purpose of serving the States by protecting the borders through providing a strong military.

jack

RickeyHoltsclaw said:

@jack ; If you could set aside your arrogance and closed-minded bigotry for a moment you would find I support the original intent of the United States Constitution; that is, a very limited form of government by the people, for the people, fragmented into coequal branches, controlled by the rule of law based on Biblical principals and a government constrained by the States, the sole purpose of serving the States by protecting the borders through providing a strong military.

Hello again, Rickey:

If you'd get your nose outta Trumps rump, you'd know that you described the good 'ole USA..  Ain't this a great country, or what?

excon

RickeyHoltsclaw

@jack ; Exactly...I described the United States...so what is your point, Jack?

Bogan

Factfinder

RickeyHoltsclaw said:

@jack ; Exactly...I described the United States...so what is your point, Jack?

His point is he thinks the coequal branches of government you describe is the USA, but only if far left liberals lead all three branches. Jack also thinks the house of representatives will is too divided and will officially fall back to the left. He's feeling pretty happy about that right now. I'd say that's his whole point.

RickeyHoltsclaw

@Factfinder ; It is amazing what "civics," as taught by Marxist Progressives in our institutions of higher learning, have produced and vomited into American society.

Openminded

@RickeyHoltsclaw

I will flag over and over again the next time you call people who are not trump supporters - marxists. It´s disgusting. Stop. You are inciting hatred and that´s disgusting. You call yourself a religious man? 

MayCaesar

There are quite a few Marxists in the US (although most of them have a very poor idea of the actual ideology: they just call themselves Marxist because it is fashionable and because they have taken a couple of university courses professors of which themselves have never seriously studied Marx' work) - but Biden is not one of them. It is preposterous to assume that everyone who is somewhat sympathetic to some of the socialist ideas is automatically a Marxist. Even not every hardcore communist is a Marxist: one could argue, for instance, that Mao was not a Marxist.

It is kind of like people on the "left" often calling everyone they dislike "Fascist" or "Nazi". Nope. These terms have precise meanings and describe allegiance to specific ideologies.