Who is who is who???

Dee

You've hit the nail on the  head here, American relgious nuts are every bit as toxic and dangerous as any other relgious nuts.

All these religious  nuts attempt to justify their collective lunacy by appealing to their particular brand god and his " holy" dictates 

MichaelElpers

@jack

Well the pictures look completely different.

Assuming youre comparing ideology i cant say because talked to either and dont know their intentions.  If the image on the right is associated with HAMAS however they are calling for the eradication of Jews.  Actions and ideaology would explain the difference.

Bogan

The difference is that one woman is defending Christianity which is the basis of white western democracy, and the other is defending a backward medieval religion which has held back it's people and caused untold misery for 1400 years.

Dee

@Bogan

The difference is that one woman is defending Christianity which is the basis of white western democracy

You mean the same " democracy" that had American " christians" own people as property ......seriously?

Bogan

Try writing an entire 350 word article starting with a clearly stated premise that you are prepared to defend with a reasoned argument.     Writing curt replies dealing entirely in implications is hardly going to impress anybody into thinking you have an opinion worth reading.    Neither is, just continually asking loaded Dorothy Dixer questions.     You may think that it makes you look authoritative, but it just makes you look like an ignorant person winging it to vainly defend a position he passionately holds, but has little knowledge of.

 

MayCaesar

Well, one difference is that the lady on the left does not chant "Death to [insert your favorite villain here]!", while the lady on the right does. Another is that the lady on the left mostly practices on ranges and dreams of fancier ranges, while the lady on the right practices on military tracks and dreams of blowing herself up and taking as many civilians with her as possible. Another still is that the lady on the left is okay with people of different religions being present in her country, as long as they stay off her lawn, while the lady on the right wants all infidels slaughtered. Finally, the flag behind the lady on the left is that of arguably the most free and prosperous country in human history - while the flag behind the lady on the right is only trumped in the amount of blood behind it by the communist flag (and no, far fewer atrocities were committed under the National-Socialist flag than either of these two throughout history).

Ask yourself which of the two ladies you would rather have tea with and give an honest answer... I think we both know what the answer is going to be.

It is easy to see the world in simplistic terms: "Both women hold a gun and a holy book, so there is not much difference between them". Yeah, and both humans and caterpillars need somewhat warm weather to survive - does not make them equivalent.

John_C_87

@jack
Hi,
Who, is who, is who?

The person in front of the American Flag holding a Firearm is making attempt to display a desire to hold United States Constitutional Right. She is clutching the bible in the left arm and holding it in a way as to mimic lady justice. It appears that she personally may feel a scale no longer feels the sale best representation a connection to established justice. As a picture which speaks a thousand words it is not clear if she knows the exact reason behind the confusion, she may have thought it may have to do with the disconnection the 2nd Amendment has with legislation of criminal law. She is emotionally connected to the image in the picture she portrays as she is holding the Bible close to her heart and not at her side. She is somewhat oblivious to the true nature of the threat she faces, though her firearm appears loaded she is not displaying any additional ammo, nor is she dressed to believe she is holding sidearms.

The person on the right is dressed to match the background they stand in front of, the weapon is loaded, and additional ammo is on display. Side arms are in view as the person in the image is dressed in such a way to hide identity, hold grenade / grenades, pistol, ammo for side arm, and rifle efficiently as a person who is ready and capable for a combat assault.

The images do not appear to be of the same women. While the images are of both females the one on the right lacks a greater disadvantage socially as defenders a system of justice which does not even have United Sates Constitutional Rights though may have a nationally supported constitution. The female on the left is part of a system of United State constitution and it may be due to her own abilities that she is not represented by Articles and Sections of written described rights within those united states of law.

Bogan

Bogan

Bogan

Who is who is who?

Dee

@Bogan

Dee

@Bogan

Dee

@Bogan

Try writing an entire 350 word article starting with a clearly stated premise that you are prepared to defend with a reasoned argument.     Writing sneery one liners or simply submitting curt replies dealing entirely in implications is hardly going to impress anybody into thinking you have an opinion worth reading.    Neither is, just continually asking loaded Dorothy Dixer questions.     You may think that it makes you look authoritative, but it just makes you look like an ignorant person winging it to vainly defend a position he passionately holds, but has little knowledge of.

MichaelElpers

@Dee

Do think posting a picture from 1922 is a good comparison?

Dee

@MichaelElpers


Do think posting a picture from 1922 is a good comparison?

To one of the Hitler youth as posted yes,it's origins date back to .........  you guessed it 1922.....ZING ....

jack

MichaelElpers said:

@Dee

Do think posting a picture from 1922 is a good comparison?

Hello M:

Of course it's appropriate..  A terrorist is a terrorist is a terrorist, NO matter what the year, no matter what they wear, and no matter what book they carry.

excon

MichaelElpers

@jack

But they are terrorists back in 1922.
Guess how many of them are alive?

The point seems to be look we had white supremacists back in Oregon...in 1922.  Thats 100 years ago.

Guess what, ideaologies change.  Well except for HAMAS who is CURRENTLY trying to eradicate the Jews.

Are you going to justify immoral behavior like genocide or slavery just because in once happened in a certain culture?

Bogan

"Those who refuse to learn from history are doomed to repeat it."

ZeusAres42

MayCaesar said:

Well, one difference is that the lady on the left does not chant "Death to [insert your favorite villain here]!", while the lady on the right does. Another is that the lady on the left mostly practices on ranges and dreams of fancier ranges, while the lady on the right practices on military tracks and dreams of blowing herself up and taking as many civilians with her as possible. Another still is that the lady on the left is okay with people of different religions being present in her country, as long as they stay off her lawn, while the lady on the right wants all infidels slaughtered. Finally, the flag behind the lady on the left is that of arguably the most free and prosperous country in human history - while the flag behind the lady on the right is only trumped in the amount of blood behind it by the communist flag (and no, far fewer atrocities were committed under the National-Socialist flag than either of these two throughout history).

Ask yourself which of the two ladies you would rather have tea with and give an honest answer... I think we both know what the answer is going to be.

It is easy to see the world in simplistic terms: "Both women hold a gun and a holy book, so there is not much difference between them". Yeah, and both humans and caterpillars need somewhat warm weather to survive - does not make them equivalent.

Now, this is the kind of argument that seperates the elite from the rest! Cheers @MayCaesar:

ZeusAres42

Bogan said:

"Those who refuse to learn from history are doomed to repeat it."

Hitler, Napolean, Margaret Thatcher, Putin! 

Barnardot

@jack @Dee

Its easy to see the difference here and even Blind Freddie can see it. One picture is of a terrorist and there other is a digitally made up picturue.

There is a lot of this going on and we see it a lot with fake web sites and shopping web sites who scam customers with fake products and they all phish details from people. Mind you I would have to say that you have to question the brains of people who gravitate to that sort of trash.

Dee

@MichaelElpers


***Are you going to justify immoral behavior like genocide or slavery just because in once happened in a certain culture?***

Tell me what moral about the Israeli brutal  military campaign in Palestine?

Dee

@Barnardot

***Its easy to see the difference here and even Blind Freddie can see it. One picture is of a terrorist and there other is a digitally made up picturue.***

Ahh right got ya ,so there are no far right gun toting " christian" gun carriers in the US?

**(There is a lot of this going on and we see it a lot with fake web sites and shopping web sites who scam customers with fake products and they all phish details from people.***

You should avoid them. I hear Nike have their shoes made by slave labour in Pakistan ,maybe that's the way to go.

*** Mind you I would have to say that you have to question the brains of people who gravitate to that sort of trash.***

I agree, like these idiots know their Nikes are made by child labour but fully support Nike as that's what Americans do.

Dee

Wonder which of the women would agree with this......

Feminism is a destructive ideology that can cause an alienation between women and men. Feminism denies, or downplays, differences between men and women; opposes homemaking, child-rearing, and homeschooling and promotes participation by women in predominantly male activities, regardless of their life pursuits or interests. Most prominent modern feminists support abortion and promote misandry.

Attributes common to many feminists, include, an entitlement mentality and a "chip on one's shoulder" attitude, despite often benefiting from a life of privilege.[1]

Feminism can disrupt marriages, relationships, child-rearing, education, and the workplace. The feminist ideology is particularly dominant in elite universities, many large corporations, and competitive women's team sports. Feminism claims it wants to make men and women equal but in reality, it opposes equal support for men.

Barnardot

@Dee See there you go again blithering away  to dodge the point. I said THE PICTURE SHOWN THERE IS FAKE. Do you comprenez yes or no?
 Tell me if you you deviate that much when you think and talk what the f***ing dam nation do you do in your bed room?

Barnardot

@Bogan ;"Those who refuse to learn from history are doomed to repeat it."

Your quite right there and I couldn't agree more and your just got to go back to say in your land when all the whiteys knocked off the abos and shoved the survivers in the dessert with peaces of tin iron to live under and then all the kids that came from the convicts and soldiers sticking there doolies in the abo women were thrown in to centers where all the wardens beet the bejesus out of the kids and rapped them. And then they wonder why the kids go round with plastic bags filled with glue over there heads. So yep i bet your folk are certainly learning from that bit of history all right.

Dee

@Barnardot

See there you go again blithering away to dodge the point.

You made no " point" just went on one your usual delusional rants. 

I said THE PICTURE SHOWN THERE IS FAKE. Do you comprenez yes or no?

Prove it? Then read what I actually said.

 Tell me if you you deviate that much when you think and talk what the f***ing dam nation do you do in your bed room?

What you're trying to say is beyond me , your combination of dreadful spelling and lack of a basic eduction makes communication with you challenging . Are you special needs?

Barnardot

@Dee ;What you're trying to say is beyond me

I think you hit another nail on the heed again. I think we are all well aware that you get your far fetched ideas from LaLaLand and like trying to say that an uber cheap peace of plastic crap is the same as the reel thing And you even admitted that what you bought you wanted to return it any way. Like derrr. And that made up doctors on a scam website is evidence for another of your far fetched ideas. 

Barnardot

@Dee ;What you're trying to say is beyond me

I think you hit another nail on the heed again. I think we are all well aware that you get your far fetched ideas from LaLaLand and like trying to say that a peace of plastic crap is the same as the reel thing and that made up doctors on scam websites is evidence for another of your far fetched ideas. And you even admitted that what you bought you wanted to return it any way.

But any way I admit I was wrong about the fake picture because it was Holy Fisher who has her red Neck heed messed up any way.

Dee

@Barnardot

think you hit another nail on the heed again

" On the heed" ,you're that d-mb you you cannot even correctly spell a word consisting of four letters.

. I think we are all well aware that you get your far fetched ideas from LaLaLand and like trying to say that a peace of plastic crap is the same as the reel thing 

" the reel thing " another four letter word you cannot spell. Hows your NIKE made in Pakistan shoes getting on?

and that made up doctors on scam websites is evidence for another of your far fetched ideas.

I cannot help it that you believe in pseudoscience,  78 doctors agreed with me not you 

 And you even admitted that what you bought you wanted to return it any way.

 I never said that at all , you never debate you only constantly b- tch , whine and make up lies

But any way I admit I was wrong about the fake picture because it was Holy Fisher who has her red Neck heed messed up any way.

But you're always wrong no change there 

MichaelElpers

@Dee

"Tell me what moral about the Israeli brutal military campaign in Palestine?"

Youd almost have to look at each individual decision but the overall reaction is justified imo.
Theyre protecting themselves against a group that literally wants their total eradication.

What makes it difficult are the innocents involved.  To that ill say a couple things.
HAMAS prevents the palestinians from taking refuge, and in addition places military strategic positions in areas that would create most civilian casualties if they were struck. This while HAMAS goal is to kill as many Israelis as possible.
Next the people of GAZA voted in and 57% still hold a positive opinion of them.
Im not sure how you can hold a proper ceasefire with a group that doesnt just want a portion of land or separate occupations but kill you outright.

I definetly feel for the innocents in the area especially children.  I would hope they could strategic in their targets or use strike groups to ease the innocents killed but that most likely comes with more deaths of your own people.

The main issue is people view Israel as a power and therefore automatically the oppressor.
Id like to see how liberals reacted if HAMAS was a white suppremacist group attempting to eradicate a nation of black people.  I almost guarantee they want HAMAS complete destruction.  Which if you look at history the allies bombed the crap out of germany and most dont feel that was uncalled for.

Dee

@MichaelElpers

Youd almost have to look at each individual decision but the overall reaction is justified imo.

Theyre protecting themselves against a group that literally wants their total eradication.

And what do you think Israel wants? Ben Gurion at the founding of the state of Israel called for the total  irradication of the Palestinian People.

MichaelElpers

@Dee

Guess what even if that is true. He died 50 years ago.  Why dont you point to something relevant today.

Dee

Why dont you point to something relevant today.

I did point to something  relevant what do you think Israel wants now?




@MichaelElpers

Bogan

@MichaelElpers ;  Id like to see how liberals reacted if HAMAS was a white suppremacist group attempting to eradicate a nation of black people.  I almost guarantee they want HAMAS complete destruction.  

That is a very good point, Michael.   I will add your premise to my repertoire of rebuffs I already have.   One great thing about coming onto debate sites is that people who may hold my views on a particular issue sometimes come out with a perspective that is valid, but which  had nerver entered my head.     My hope is, that my posts do the same thig with other contributors who are like minded with me on other issues as well.  We learn from each other.

That said, my advice to you is to just ignore Dee and Barnadot.   They are simply trolls.     Notice how you raised four very valid points in your last post?   But Dee ignored three of them, especially the point I so admire. because it is devastatingly accurate.      He only ran with the one that he thought he could get some mileage out of.  Typical troll.   He has no intention of debating and testing the validity of his own beliefs at all.  His aim is not to debate, it is to stifle debate.  

MichaelElpers

@Dee

No you pointed to something from a single person who died 50 ago.

I think Israel wants now wants to have a separated state with a neighbor who goal isnt to eradicate them.

Dee

@MichaelElpers


No you pointed to something from a single person who died 50 ago.

So what, it was the states tated goal most likely still is.

I think Israel wants now wants to have a separated state with a neighbor

LOL 

 who goal isnt to eradicate them.

You seem to think every Palestinian is also a member of Hamas and totally aligned with their goals , whys that?

Dee

@Bogan

That said, my advice to you is to just ignore Dee and Barnadot.   They are simply trolls.     Notice how you raised four very valid points in your last post?   But Dee ignored three of them, especially the point I so admire. because it is devastatingly accurate.      He only ran with the one that he thought he could get some mileage out of.  Typical troll.   He has no intention of debating and testing the validity of his own beliefs at all.  His aim is not to debate, it is to stifle debate.  

Stop spouting nonsense , before you decided to even debate this topic I posted up my own views on the situation and defended every comment I made , you naturally remained mute much preferring to post up your usual racist  hate pieces, you're a nasty racist and bigot a typical cowardly troll , you don't debate you parrot  Israel propaganda nonsense , thats called preaching .son.

Bogan

@Dee ;  

Try writing an entire 350 word article starting with a clearly stated premise that you are prepared to defend with a reasoned argument.     Writing sneery one liners or simply submitting curt replies dealing entirely in implications is hardly going to impress anybody into thinking you have an opinion worth reading.    Neither is, just continually asking loaded Dorothy Dixer questions.     You may think that it makes you look authoritative, but it just makes you look like an ignorant person winging it to vainly defend a position he passionately holds, but has little knowledge of.

Bogan

@MichaelElpers ;    I think Israel wants now wants to have a separated state with a neighbor who goal isnt to eradicate them.

Actually, the joke in Israel is that it should be three states.    One for the Palestinians, one for the secular Jews, and one for the ultra orthodox Jews.  

MichaelElpers

@Dee

What makes you think it still is trying to eradicate palestinians other than your one guy who died 50 years ago?  Israel wasnt who started the terror attack.  In addition, if Israel wanted to they could blow all of Gaza into smitherines, they could eradicate HAMAS.
In fact, people hold Israel in such moral superiority liberals started complaining Israel wasnt allowing water supply or fuel into Gaza. This not only wasnt totally true, but kind of laughable that it is Israels job to allow supply to people trying to murder them.  Something HAMAS would never do.

Your basically stating U.S. once had slavery so that means they must want it now.

"You seem to think every Palestinian is also a member of Hamas and totally aligned with their goals , whys that?"

No, actually I think i very clearly stated 57% of the population has a positive view of HAMAS.  That is what i think

Dee

@Bogan

But you would just do what you always do run.

Dee

@MichaelElpers


Israel wasnt who started the terror attack. 

Would you like a list of previous terror attacks by Israel?

 In addition, if Israel wanted to they could blow all of Gaza into smitherines, they could eradicate HAMAS.

No they couldn't or wouldn't as worldwide condemnation  would follow with all theat that carries.


In fact, people hold Israel in such moral superiority liberals started complaining Israel wasnt allowing water supply or fuel into Gaza

Your obsession with liberals is telling.

. This not only wasnt totally true, but kind of laughable that it is Israels job to allow supply to people trying to murder them.  Something HAMAS would never do.

I haven't a clue what you're on about I don't nor wouldn't watch what passes for the news in the US.

Your basically stating U.S. once had slavery so that means they must want it now.

No I never stated that at all , I made the point that America which identified as a christian nation kept blacks segregated up to the 1960's such is the toxicity of what passes for Christianity in the US 


No, actually I think i very clearly stated 57% of the population has a positive view of HAMAS.  That is what i think

Depends on where you get your figures , either way  Hamas are what one resorts to when choices are limited 

MichaelElpers

@Dee

"Hamas are what one resorts to when choices are limited"

Ah so genocide and terrorism are justified then, but destruction of thw terrorism with civilian casualities is somehow more morally culpable.

Which limited choices are you referring to? 

Maybe its the limited freedoms they provide to everyone that doesnt agree to their relgion, their limited rights for women, ect which keeps them down.  Or maybe its all the money they take from their citizens to try to ensure the eradication of their enemies rather than improving their impoverished conditions.

Israel lives in the same area and for some reason they can hold a civilized society.

MayCaesar

ZeusAres42 said:

Now, this is the kind of argument that seperates the elite from the rest! Cheers @MayCaesar:

I do not think that my argument is that deep, to be honest. It just seems to me that people often use words carelessly, without fully understanding what they mean - and that allows for false comparisons. For instance, when someone says "Men and women are equal", he has to clarify what aspects exactly we are comparing. Men and women are mammals, in this respect they are equal. But men and women have different reproductive roles, in this respect they are unequal. Men and women are considered to have equal rights in most Western societies, in this respect they are equal. Men and women have different levels of physical strength and various emotional traits, in this respect they are unequal.

By definition, any two entities that are not exactly equivalent are different. Even 1 and 1 have differences: in this particular case, one of the 1-s is to the left and another to the right. Yet one who wants to make an argument that they are equal will ignore this difference. It seems wrong to me to pick and choose differences as convenient for the argument: one can say that any two entities are equal with this approach. A proper approach instead involves defining what aspects are relevant in the comparison given the context, and what are not. The OP has not done that, therefore opening a can of worms.

Dee

@MichaelElpers


Ah so genocide and terrorism are justified then

Seems to be once Israel are the ones are the ones engaging in such.

,but destruction of thw terrorism with civilian casualities is somehow more morally culpable.

You are the judge of what's morally right , interesting, you're the very same guy that gives your money to the criminal Catholic church which continues to shield and protect child molesting priests and you're just fine with that, seriously? 
. 

Palestine has been under a state system.of apartheid for 50 years.

Which limited choices are you referring to? 

What choices are open to Palestinians against the might of the Israeli military?

Maybe its the limited freedoms they provide to everyone that doesnt agree to their relgion, their limited rights for women, ect which keeps them down.  Or maybe its all the money they take from their citizens to try to ensure the eradication of their enemies rather than improving their impoverished conditions.

Funny that my neighbours are Palestinian and go home twice a year it seems you make it up as you go along.

The 1 million plus Palestinian chrisitians seem to be able to move about freely also

Israel lives in the same area and for some reason they can hold a civilized society

You call inflicting a brutal apartheid on your neighbours civilised which would be in line with most American " christians" who seem to detest everyone who isn't as them.


This is from your own government.....


Significant human rights issues included credible reports of: unlawful or arbitrary killings; arbitrary detention, often extraterritorial detention of Palestinians from the occupied territories in Israel; restrictions on Palestinians residing in Jerusalem including arbitrary or unlawful interference with privacy

Barnardot

@Dee ;

" On the heed" ,you're that d-mb you you cannot even correctly spell a word consisting of four letters.

Wrong The word Heed is in the dictionary.

" the reel thing " another four letter word you cannot spell. Hows your NIKE made in Pakistan shoes getting on?

Wrong There are 2 4 letter words there and Reel is in the dictionary and Thing is in the dictionary.

I cannot help it that you believe in pseudoscience,  78 doctors agreed with me not you 

Wrong I know you cant help it because you know very well that no doctor agreed with you and all the doctors and reports on that website were made up. Yes or no?

 And you even admitted that what you bought you wanted to return it any way.
 I never said that at all , you never debate you only constantly b- tch , whine and make up lies

Wrong because you said in the OP:

I was not happy with one product bought on Temu and they paid money back https://debateisland.com/discussion/9351/do-many-on-here-use-use-chinese-online-shops-seems-like-their-online-dominance-grows-by-the-month

But you're always wrong no change there 

Wrong Im very rarely wrong but on the few occasions I am I admit it. Persistent liers who had bed wetting problems will never admit there wrong and will always lier and divert to get out of the dog messes they get in to with there constant made up stories.

Dee

@Barnardot

Wrong The word Heed is in the dictionary.

I know, but you were trying to say " head" , seriously that's you best excuse for your st- pidity?

" the reel thing " another four letter word you cannot spell. Hows your NIKE made in Pakistan shoes getting on?

I know , but you were trying to say real but again you're that st-pid you couldn't even spell it 

Wrong There are 2 4 letter words there and Reel is in the dictionary and Thing is in the dictionary.

No , I'm right you keep proving you cannot even spell simple 4 letter words.

Wrong I know you cant help it because you know very well that no doctor agreed with you and all the doctors and reports on that website were made up. Yes or no?

Yes you are wrong 78 doctor's agreed with me no one except mad Maxxm agreed with you ....ZING 

 

Wrong because you said in the OP:

No I didn't.

I was not happy with one product bought on Temu and they paid money back https://debateisland.com/discussion/9351/do-many-on-here-use-use-chinese-online-shops-seems-like-their-online-dominance-grows-by-the-month

But you're always wrong no change there 

I said I wasn't happy with ONE product but i'm happy with all the rest do try and keep up dummy

Wrong Im very rarely wrong but on the few occasions I am I admit it. Persistent liers who had bed wetting problems will never admit there wrong and will always lier and divert to get out of the dog messes they get in to with there constant made up stories.

Hey maybe work on yourself if that's the way you see yourself.......


You're never right I keep schooling and correcting you 7 times in this post alone ......comeon dummy ......" LIER" seriously....ROFLMAO

Barnardot

@Dee ;Wrong The word Heed is in the dictionary.

I know, but you were trying to say " head" , seriously that's you best excuse 

Nope its not and excuse. Its a game because thats the sort of game you play all the time. And I mean all the time. Do you really want me to drag all the strawman crap that you make up like Nikes? and the thousand others that you post until people on this site get sick of it.

And do you really want me to quote the number of people on this site have pulled you up for your constant liering and twisting things to make them look like something else.? Well thats easy. Like every member of this site has pulled you up on that. No do you dare me to quote 20 examples/ Come on I dare you. 

Like for example 

Wrong because you said in the OP:

No I didn't.

Like what the. I actually copied and pasted that from your very own OP. Man your so gone in the heed its not even funny.

Bogan

@MichaelElpers ;    Israel lives in the same area and for some reason they can hold a civilized society.

That is one of the three reasons why Arab Muslims utterly hate the Jews.   Prosperous Israel is an unwelcome reminder of how their own Islamic system, supposedly blessed by Allah himself as His way for communities to organize their lives and prosper, is inferior to Jews, who, Mahammad hated.